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Katheryne Dollar, director of the Retired Senior Volunteer Program in association with the Natchitoches Area Action Association arranged interviews with senior citizens around the parish. The interviews were conducted between 1971 and 1974 by David Dollar. Recordings were originally aired on KNOC Radio.

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February 19, 2026

56. Howard Bell

Transcript

Transcript

David Dollar: Good morning. This is David Dollar, and we're glad you've joined us today on Memories. We're down in Campti, visiting with Mr. Howard Bell, and we'll be back to start our program right after this message from Peoples Bank, our sponsor. Hello once again. In case you've just joined us, David Dollar on Memories this morning down in Campti, visiting with Mr. Howard Bell. Mr. Bell, we thank you for having us in the home today and visiting with us. Why don't we start things off by you giving us a little family background, like where you were born, when you were born, and something about your family, maybe? How about that?

Howard Bell: I was born, let's see, 1893.

David Dollar: 1893? Okay. Where was this? Here in Campti.

Howard Bell: [inaudible 00:00:38].

David Dollar: Where is that?

Howard Bell: Wasn't here in Campti, it wasn't in this part of Campti.

David Dollar: Okay, all right. Were you the oldest child in your family?

Howard Bell: Yes sir, I was the oldest one.

David Dollar: Okay.

Howard Bell: I told you about, I think, my memories [inaudible 00:00:59]. I think I told you about I fell out of a tree, didn't I?

David Dollar: What's that? Let's here about that. When did you fall out of the tree?

Howard Bell: Well, I shot a squirrel, and he [inaudible 00:01:15] in the tree.

David Dollar: Yeah? Didn't come down.

Howard Bell: No, he didn't come down.

David Dollar: I've had that trouble before.

Howard Bell: And I went up there to get him, and I got on a rotten limb.

David Dollar: Uh-oh.

Howard Bell: Down I come. My little brother, he'd run to the house and told my dad about it, and I was still out. And he got-

David Dollar: It knocked you out, huh?

Howard Bell: Yeah, I was still out.

David Dollar: Gee.

Howard Bell: He throwed me on his shoulder and take me... Wasn't far from there to the doctor.

David Dollar: Yeah?

Howard Bell: Throwed me on his shoulder, carried me on to the doctor.

David Dollar: Well, I'll be.

Howard Bell: I got over it.

David Dollar: Got over it. Did you get the squirrel?

Howard Bell: I don't remember now whether I got the squirrel or not. After that, I don't know what happened. [inaudible 00:01:45].

David Dollar: You weren't too worried about that at all. Well, what was your dad doing at this time when you were born?

Howard Bell: Oh, he-

David Dollar: He was from around here, he and your mother?

Howard Bell: No, they were [inaudible 00:01:55]-

David Dollar: Or they found work here, or what?

Howard Bell: No they was up here in the country, we'd make ties, cut logs at sawmills.

David Dollar: Okay. Kind of worked at sawmill like.

Howard Bell: We cut logs, me and him both, once I got old enough to cut logs together. And then I worked in the sawmill.

David Dollar: Oh, you went into work with him. Huh.

Howard Bell: [inaudible 00:02:11].

David Dollar: Worked around there, too.

Howard Bell: Then I went to work and I don't know where that river is [inaudible 00:02:18] used to be in line down there, W. F. Johnson.

David Dollar: W. F. Johnson.

Howard Bell: Do you remember? Ever heard of that?

David Dollar: No, I'm not sure. I don't know. He's from around here, too?

Howard Bell: Yes sir, he used to have a big sawmill.

David Dollar: Had a big sawmill.

Howard Bell: Yeah. [inaudible 00:02:35].

David Dollar: How old were you when you first started logging?

Howard Bell: I was in my teenage years, I don't know [inaudible 00:02:40].

David Dollar: Uh-huh. Somewhere around it.

Howard Bell: Started, yeah.

David Dollar: Did you attend school or-

Howard Bell: No.

David Dollar: ... work when you were younger.

Howard Bell: Very little schooling [inaudible 00:02:48]. I didn't have a chance to go to school. I had to work all the time.

David Dollar: Work? Well, what about-

Howard Bell: I might could have went when I was... Nobody rushed me in it, and I didn't know the benefit it was in the school.

David Dollar: Yeah, I guess not.

Howard Bell: [inaudible 00:03:01].

David Dollar: There was no way for you to know.

Howard Bell: No. It's the rarity of it. So nobody [inaudible 00:03:05] liked going to school.

David Dollar: You think it's important for today's young folks to go on to school, though?

Howard Bell: For sure, I advise you to go to school.

David Dollar: Okay.

Howard Bell: And all my sisters got a pretty good run, but...

David Dollar: You being the first, you were the first one to have to go to work, I guess.

Howard Bell: That's it, that's it.

David Dollar: And made a little money so that some of them could go to school, maybe.

Howard Bell: [inaudible 00:03:28] for my sisters, two sisters. We had three sisters [inaudible 00:03:31].

David Dollar: That's good. What about your mother? What do you remember about your mom around the house, speaking of all these sisters? Did she have to take time to teach the girls how to cook or teach you how to cook for yourself or something?

Howard Bell: No, all the girls learned how to cook. And one brother. I just know how to do the work getting there [inaudible 00:03:55].

David Dollar: You did the working and the eating, and they did the cooking, huh?

Howard Bell: That's right, then when they got to cooking something I liked, I'd go back in there and ask... Momma had a young baby. And I'd go in there and make that baby cry, and they'd go back in there to see about the baby, and I'd grab a big handful of something, and I'd run.

David Dollar: And run. A little diversion there.

Howard Bell: Yeah. [inaudible 00:04:15].

David Dollar: Yeah. Goodness gracious. Always after that food. You gotta watch him.

Howard Bell: [inaudible 00:04:19] dinner pot, that would eat me up. I'd go and look at Momma, say, "What's the matter? I wasn't here. Did you see anything?" Say, "You thought... I sees you. I sees you. I sees you when you got it." [inaudible 00:04:30].

David Dollar: And you got a hot piece of meat or something in there, getting you a leg.

Howard Bell: Yeah, and got out some [inaudible 00:04:31] meat. Yes sir. I don't know what best story I can tell you, but [inaudible 00:04:31].

David Dollar: Oh, my goodness.

Howard Bell: And I was just dancing a jig and dancing [inaudible 00:04:44]-

David Dollar: Dancing around.

Howard Bell: ... trying to get that meat out.

David Dollar: Tell you what, let me interrupt you right here. We need to take a brief commercial here. We'll be back and talk a little more in just a minute. David Dollar on Memories today with Mr. Howard Bell, we'll be right back after this message from our sponsor, Peoples Bank and Trust Company.

Well, once again, in case you've just joined, this is David Dollar on Memories today down in Campti with Mr. Howard Bell. We've been talking about growing up working and having to trick sisters to get some food around the house and all. Speaking of food and house and things, we were talking a little bit earlier about your momma cooking, how did she cook and what were some of the things she had in the kitchen? Or was it like a kitchen like you've got around here today, something like that?

Howard Bell: No, not exactly, because the most we was eating at them days was cornbread.

David Dollar: Cornbread. Okay, tell me about her recipe for cornbread and how she fixed it. Did you ever get to watch?

Howard Bell: No, I didn't do that. My brother what's dead, he's the one done all... He done that watching, and he learnt to cook like she did.

David Dollar: I see.

Howard Bell: I never seen anybody cooking.

David Dollar: Well, did she have a range or stove or something like that?

Howard Bell: No, a wood stove.

David Dollar: Wood-burning stove?

Howard Bell: Wood-burning stove.

David Dollar: Uh-huh?

Howard Bell: And the times she'd go back in there, I'd go in there and make the baby cry. And you know, she'd go out and see about the baby, and there I'd go [inaudible 00:06:07].

David Dollar: You'd go snatch a piece of meat or cornbread or something, huh?

Howard Bell: Really, hey, whatever I could get to eat.

David Dollar: Whatever you could get. I see.

Howard Bell: And out the door. And she caught me one day. I was just a-shaking the [inaudible 00:06:17] and going on dancing around the floor and shaking the [inaudible 00:06:19], trying to get that meat [inaudible 00:06:20].

David Dollar: Yeah, hot grease on your leg or something.

Howard Bell: And she knowed it. She knowed what I done.

David Dollar: Oh, yeah. Mommas always know when you done something you shouldn't have.

Howard Bell: She said, "Mm-hmm." She said, I'll break that. That's [inaudible 00:06:28]? I'll break that one."

David Dollar: Yeah. What did y'all do as a family on weekends? Did you have to work all the way through or like on Sunday or Saturday?

Howard Bell: Oh, no. We didn't work on a Saturday and Sunday, [inaudible 00:06:40] I had to work.

David Dollar: What did you do?

Howard Bell: I used to cut logs for sawmills.

David Dollar: What did you do on Saturday and Sunday, though? When you had a little time off, how did you spend your free time?

Howard Bell: Well, just go down amongst the other boys and young fellas like me.

David Dollar: [inaudible 00:06:55].

Howard Bell: Shoot marbles and play ball, like that.

David Dollar: Shooting marbles and playing ball. Were you a good marble player?

Howard Bell: Pretty good.

David Dollar: Pretty good.

Howard Bell: Yes sir.

David Dollar: What about fishing and things like that? Did y'all get much time for that?

Howard Bell: I never did like to fish, so I used to go with my mother. She fished every day if she could get anything she'd cook for us.

David Dollar: I guess around here, around Black Lake and all that, that should have been pretty good fishing, at least pretty close by.

Howard Bell: Yeah. It was good fishing. But I never did care nothing about fishing, but while she's fishing, I'd be hunting squirrels.

David Dollar: Yeah, you were a hunter, huh?

Howard Bell: Yes sir, I'm a hunter.

David Dollar: Did you get to bring much meat in and y'all cook it?

Howard Bell: Sometime I'd kill four or five, and sometimes, maybe one, two, like that.

David Dollar: Sometimes not get any, I guess, huh?

Howard Bell: Sometime not get any.

David Dollar: Yeah?

Howard Bell: [inaudible 00:07:33].

David Dollar: Well, let's talk about-

Howard Bell: And the next thing, at that time, there was a lot of wild hogs in the woods, wasn't owned by nobody.

David Dollar: Oh, yeah? You know, I've heard about that a lot, even a few left today, but I've never seen one. Tell me about them.

Howard Bell: [inaudible 00:07:50]. They was big-size hogs, but they're dangerous, too.

David Dollar: They'd get after you, huh?

Howard Bell: Especially if they had a sow and she had some young. You better not get around them then.

David Dollar: Did you ever run up on one?

Howard Bell: Oh, yes. I run up on them. I've killed them, the males.

David Dollar: And pretty good eating?

Howard Bell: Oh, yes sir, they... I didn't know the difference in that and those other-

David Dollar: Between regular ham or wild hog, huh?

Howard Bell: No, I didn't know the difference. [inaudible 00:08:14].

David Dollar: I guess not. Well, you say they were dangerous, how so?

Howard Bell: They fight so bad, them wild hogs.

David Dollar: That's really strange to me, because the only pigs and hogs I've ever seen are just kind of big and fat and don't ever do much.

Howard Bell: No, they had hogs in the woods, nobody owned them. And you better not get out... You better know what you're doing, get out there amongst them.

David Dollar: Or could they chase you or something like that?

Howard Bell: Yes sir, they'd get in behind you, especially if they had some young ones lying there.

David Dollar: Or did they have those old tusk things like I've heard about, some-

Howard Bell: Yeah, they're just like a bear [inaudible 00:08:48], the big tusks that come out.

David Dollar: Come out of their mouth, huh?

Howard Bell: Yes sir.

David Dollar: Well, I guess they could do a little damage on your leg if they got a hold of you.

Howard Bell: Oh, yes sir. They'd do damage [inaudible 00:08:57].

David Dollar: Did you ever get chased?

Howard Bell: Oh, yes, I got chased and run up trees.

David Dollar: Run up trees?

Howard Bell: Yeah.

David Dollar: And hope you wouldn't fall out again like you did hunting squirrel, huh?

Howard Bell: That's right.

David Dollar: Well, what would they do, after you were treed by a hog? You just wait for it to go away, or-

Howard Bell: That's what I did, wait 'til they-

David Dollar: Or carry your gun up there with you?

Howard Bell: Oh, no. I stayed up there and wait 'til they go away.

David Dollar: My goodness.

Howard Bell: They'd [inaudible 00:09:20] that time, only do that, you know a sow who had some young. Them males, they didn't want you to go nowhere around them.

David Dollar: Get after you.

Howard Bell: Mm-hmm.

David Dollar: Well, I'm kind of glad I've never run up on one of those guys.

Howard Bell: Yes sir [inaudible 00:09:36].

David Dollar: Sounds bad.

Howard Bell: But a lot of people kill them now and then [inaudible 00:09:42].

David Dollar: Yeah, I've heard, especially one of the doctors in town I think still hunts some wild hog and some of his friends. I've heard some tales about it. I never knew whether he was pulling my leg, though. Sounds like y'all's stories collaborates pretty good. They're bad guys.

Howard Bell: I know one time I was out in the woods hunting, and I seen a bear coming towards us.

David Dollar: A bear?

Howard Bell: Yeah, and up that tree I went. And I had to stay up that tree. And I'd stay up there and I'd shoot my gun, and I'd shoot my gun.

David Dollar: At the bear?

Howard Bell: No, I'd shoot-

David Dollar: Or just up in the air?

Howard Bell: Yeah, I was shooting up in-

David Dollar: Trying to scare him.

Howard Bell: No, I was trying to make some people come [inaudible 00:10:18] if I could. I'd holler and then shoot my gun, you know, so [inaudible 00:10:22] white people, they'd decide something was wrong, and something had happened.

David Dollar: Uh-huh.

Howard Bell: And they started coming through the woods hollering. When they got in distance, we were pretty close there, I done told them it was a bear after me. I said, "A bear," and then they hollered through [inaudible 00:10:42] went back to the house and get somebody to bring some guns down there. And they killed the bear.

David Dollar: They killed the bear?

Howard Bell: Uh-huh.

David Dollar: My [inaudible 00:10:49] and I imagine-

Howard Bell: Killed him and we eat him up.

David Dollar: I'll tell ya. How-

Howard Bell: [inaudible 00:10:56].

David Dollar: That is really amazing, now that sounds like a tale from the pioneer days or something, and here, you lived right through it there.

Howard Bell: Yes sir.

David Dollar: Got treed by a bear. Were you afraid he was going to come up that tree after you?

Howard Bell: No, I wasn't afraid he was going to come up that tree after me, but I was afraid he wasn't going to leave so I can.

David Dollar: He wasn't going to leave like those hogs did.

Howard Bell: No. But I learned after that, that that time, a bear wouldn't hurt you if he didn't have no young ones nowhere around.

David Dollar: If he didn't have young.

Howard Bell: So I know then he must have had young around there, because he stayed there until-

David Dollar: He was watching you.

Howard Bell: He was watching me, you know. I didn't know [inaudible 00:11:30].

David Dollar: My goodness. Well, from what I can tell, you've spent a heck of a lot of time up in trees.

Howard Bell: Oh, yeah.

David Dollar: Between squirrels and pigs and bears [inaudible 00:11:38].

Howard Bell: That's right. Bears and all like that. There used to be a lot of them at that time.

David Dollar: I guess so.

Howard Bell: Lot of people [inaudible 00:11:49] bears just like that and then there wasn't too many people would travel at night.

David Dollar: They'd be coming out, huh?

Howard Bell: Them that would travel, they had weapons, they'd have their guns.

David Dollar: Yeah?

Howard Bell: Putting them little lights, lantern lights [inaudible 00:12:00]. People wouldn't think, as settled as it is now. You might find a house, and it would be a mile near abouts before you see another house. [inaudible 00:12:08].

David Dollar: So it was at Campti, and this area was pretty much just like the pioneer days.

Howard Bell: Yes sir [inaudible 00:12:16].

David Dollar: This was still a wilderness of sorts. And all kind of wild animals and-

Howard Bell: All kinds.

David Dollar: ... things that could happen to you.

Howard Bell: Mm-hmm.

David Dollar: Well, Mr. Bell, we're just about out of time. I tell you, this has been real enjoyable for me, finding out...

Howard Bell: [inaudible 00:12:27].

David Dollar: I'm an old Daniel Boone fan, and it was exciting for me to hear about the times that... Hear a person I'm talking to has lived through those same things, with bears and wild hogs and things.

Howard Bell: Let's see, that Daniel Boone, [inaudible 00:12:40]?

David Dollar: You know, one of the pioneers coming back in old Kentucky-

Howard Bell: That's right, that's right.

David Dollar: ... with his long rifle and all.

Howard Bell: That's right. That's right. I remember, I remember [inaudible 00:12:48].

David Dollar: Sounds like you were the same sort of fella, always out in the woods and hunting and things.

Howard Bell: Yeah, I remember. I remember now.

David Dollar: Yeah. Well, I tell you, we better bring our program to a close, we're about out of time again.

Howard Bell: Well, I enjoyed [inaudible 00:13:00].

David Dollar: We thank you for having us in and sharing your memories with us.

Howard Bell: I enjoyed talking with you.

David Dollar: Why, thank you.

Howard Bell: I find that gives me something else to think about besides [inaudible 00:13:08].

David Dollar: That's right. I guess so. If any of you folks at home have some memories you'd like to share, we'd sure like to hear from you. The Retired Senior Volunteer Program Office is helping us keep our schedule up, and their phone number is 352-8647. This has been David Dollar down in Campti today with Mr. Howard Bell, talking about bears and such, and we've had a good time. We're glad you've joined us and have a nice day.

David Dollar interviews Howard Bell about growing up in Campti, falling out of a tree, working in a sawmill, fishing, hog hunting, and getting chased up a tree.

Tags: memories, oral history interview, podcast, campti, natchitoches parish, hunting

February 12, 2026

55. Heardie Rivers pt. 2

Transcript

Transcript

David Dollar: Good morning. This is David Dollar. We're glad you joined us on Memories today. We're going to visit this morning with Ms. Heardie Rivers of Natchitoches, and we'll be right back to start our show right after this message from our sponsor, Peoples Bank and Trust Company.

Hello again. In case you're just joining us, we're visiting this morning with Ms. Heardie Rivers on Memories. Ms. Rivers, why don't we start things off by you just telling us a little bit about yourself? And then we'll talk some more. When were you born?

Heardie Rivers: I know what day, but what year? I'm 72 years old. It must be 1904.

David Dollar: 1904, huh?

Heardie Rivers: 1904, 12th July. My birth home is Clarence, Louisiana. We moved from Clarence to Campti. Go through that?

David Dollar: Yeah. Let's talk. Where all did you live?

Heardie Rivers: Campti, from Clarence to Campti. And from Campti to Alexandria. Two weeks from Alexandria here to Natchitoches.

David Dollar: What was your folks doing when you were little?

Heardie Rivers: My papa, he was working at the Frost-Johnson Lumber Company at the time, and so we moved here. My mother come first. She didn't want to go back in the country. So he wanted to go back to Moe. So she didn't. She come to Natchitoches and got her job at Ms. Royster. She worked there and bought the place out here in Breda Town.

David Dollar: You've been telling us your mother worked there while y'all were all young. You said that you've had quite a productive working career too. Why don't we talk a little bit about some of the work you've done while you've been growing up? Tell us about that job you had up at the school, I think is where it started.

Heardie Rivers: 1918, early part, I worked there... It must have been, it was in September. I worked there two weeks. I had the flu. And so when I got up from the flu, I didn't go back. It was no normal state college thing.

David Dollar: Normal, right.

Heardie Rivers: And so I didn't go back. Ms. Pearson's sister, Ms. Gannon, asked me to go and asked me would I work for her sister-in-law. And I told her, "Yeah." It's good to keep your word. It really is. When you don't have a word, ain't nothing left.

And so I told her I would, so I went, but I didn't go to state. But when I saw the little curly-haired boy, what I had dreamed of, I asked God, "That must be the place he want me to work." If he'd be with me, a doctor friend and on, which he have. I just had $18 worth of doctor bills since I've been grown.

David Dollar: My goodness. Somebody has been taking care of you then.

Heardie Rivers: The whole 55 years, not quite 55. 54 and some months.

David Dollar: You said you had dreamed about a little blond-haired boy. Tell me about that.

Heardie Rivers: Yes. You want that?

David Dollar: Yeah. What is that?

Heardie Rivers: Henry. I dream... In 1914, we moved here in 1913 and 1914, I had the beautiful dream, about all of them come true but one. And I don't think no change for it. A little curly-haired boy about the age of four years old. He didn't tell me four because he know I couldn't keep it, just the height.

David Dollar: About that size, huh?

Heardie Rivers: Height will fool you. High, which he was. And so I didn't go to state.

David Dollar: So that then in 1918, when you went to work-

Heardie Rivers: For her.

David Dollar: For Ms. Pearson?

Heardie Rivers: Ms. Pearson.

David Dollar: You saw this little boy that you had seen in your dream.

Heardie Rivers: I saw her. I didn't know it-

David Dollar: It was her son.

Heardie Rivers: Yes. I didn't know nothing about this inner part of town. That was 1914, from 1914 to 1918.

David Dollar: Four whole years.

Heardie Rivers: How many years?

David Dollar: What's that, four years?

Heardie Rivers: From 1914 to 1918.

David Dollar: Right.

Heardie Rivers: How many?

David Dollar: Four years. That's a pretty good while to remember a dream, isn't it? But you saw the same little boy that you had seen in your dream?

Heardie Rivers: The same in my dream when I went there. So I asked him, I made myself satisfied and I forgot about the price.

David Dollar: Figured that the Lord was leading you there to work.

Heardie Rivers: That's right, and I stayed put. I could have been in New York, but I didn't go. Why? See, God put me there. God don't follow us. He leads us but he don't follow us. If we go, we leaving him behind. He's sitting, standing right there with his arm open, waiting for us to welcome us back.

David Dollar: I believe that for sure. Let me interrupt you right here. We need to take a little short commercial. We'll come back and talk some more in just a minute. All right? David Dollar visiting with Ms. Heardie Rivers on Memories this morning. We'll be right back after this message from Peoples Bank, our sponsor.

Hello once again. In case you've just joined us, David Dollar visiting this morning with Ms. Heardie Rivers on Memories. Ms. Rivers. We're talking about you working for the Pearsons back in about 1918 when you first started because of a dream that led you there, it seems.

Heardie Rivers: Right, right.

David Dollar: Why don't we pick up there and talk a little more?

Heardie Rivers: She had four boys, Henry, Ed and David and Millie, and the B... The [inaudible 00:05:46]. That's the youngest boy, B. And so as they all got grown, I used to play with them. When they all got grown and married, and now when I can, I go from one to the other. They help keep me alive. And what's the other you want to last? And with my mother. That'd be end of it. It lined up all right, eh?

David Dollar: Oh, yes.

Heardie Rivers: Oh, my mother told me, she said, "Daughter, whatever you do, do it well, because mother ain't going to be with you always."

David Dollar: That's right.

Heardie Rivers: I wonder how many mothers tell their girls that?

David Dollar: I don't know. What do you think?

Heardie Rivers: None.

David Dollar: Did you find that was real true words of wisdom though?

Heardie Rivers: Yes, sir. But I didn't leave. I thought she was going to stay with us always. I didn't think she ever... I went off and shake my little self. I said, "You ain't going to never leave us." You see?

And when it happened, He just made my mind blank. I had a time getting back. Not a friend. See, I looked into it. See, God got all kind of way to bring us, make a real Christian. He wanted me for some purpose. And He done test me every way. I haven't fear. See, He blesses me and then He turn around and tests me.

He tests not only me, any of his children, see how strong their faith is. Everything happened to me. It's not no bad deed we have done. He's just testing, like when going to school, don't you get a test?

David Dollar: Oh, yeah. I get plenty of tests going to school.

Heardie Rivers: Well, that's the same way with Him. But we got to take time and look, whatever come, it got to come from inside, the inward, it got to come from... Whatever it is, it got to come from inside. You can't get nothing on the outside.

David Dollar: Not something you can just look around and find.

Heardie Rivers: Oh, that's right. He got to come from inward, and inward man and the inward woman. If it's evil, He coming from the inside. But good, you want to come from the inside.

David Dollar: Well, Ms. Rivers, we certainly thank you for having us over to your house today. You shared some really good memories with us, and we thank you for having us over.

If any of you folks at home would like to share some of your memories or you know somebody who would like to share, why don't you give us a call? The Retired Senior Volunteer Program is helping us keep our schedule straight, and their number is 352-8647.

This has been David Dollar visiting with Ms. Heardie Rivers today on Memories. We thank you for joining us. Have a nice day.

David Dollar interviews Heardie Rivers about growing up in the area, being led by a dream, advice from her mother, and tests of faith.

Tags: memories, podcast, oral history interview, dreams, natchitoches parish, campti, clarence

February 5, 2026

54. Hattie Harris

Transcript

Transcript

David Dollar: Good morning. This is David Dollar on Memories. Today we're going to visit with Mrs. Hattie Harris of Natchitoches and we'll be right back to begin our Memories program right after this message from our sponsor, People's Bank and Trust Company.

Hello again. In case you just joined us, this is David Dollar on Memories. We're going to visit this morning with Mrs. Hattie Harris. Ms. Harris, we'd like to start off our program by getting a little family background. Why don't you tell us a little bit about your family here in Natchitoches, growing up around the area and, I guess, life in general about getting you to where you are right now in life at 92 years old? Why don't you tell us a little bit about yourself?

Mrs. Hattie Harris: When I knowed myself, we was living at St. Norris, but it was in Natchitoches. My daddy was then a ferryman and he would ferry and he was farming.

David Dollar: Where did he ferry folks?

Mrs. Hattie Harris: Oh, he ferried over in St. Norris across the river at the time. One time back there during his ferrying, they had a man, two men get drowned.

David Dollar: Oh goodness. That's the Red River?

Mrs. Hattie Harris: Yeah, Red River.

David Dollar: Over in St. Norris.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: Yes, in St. Norris.

David Dollar: Okay.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: It was the mayor rider and one of the drummers. Them two that was driving Surrey. Double-hack, he called it then. And then a single hack, the mayor rider was driving a single. And it come when they got out there. My daddy taking another man with him, on that day, the wind was so high, by the name of Bob Brigg. And through that the wind got so high he asked the people to get out of there and stand ahead of the horses. They said, "No." Said they been crossing and said they wasn't going to do nothing. Well, they had a pole in front and one behind and he wanted them to stand in front of the horses to count them. 'Cause they was getting flustered already.

David Dollar: Right.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: So through that they didn't and all at once the hack was come in first. I'm going to say the drummer, the double-hack, come in first and the hack, the mayor rider was behind. Single-horse. Little half of something. And the double team backed back on the mayor rider. They went in backwards.

David Dollar: My goodness.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: Man, horse and everything he had. And at that time, well the man went in too. He had these up in there. The next was the horse, double hack. They went in. There's two of them. They went in right behind that. The wind was so high and the horses act like they was seeing something in the wind, the way they was acting. My daddy said. I wasn't there.

David Dollar: Yes, ma'am.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: But anyway, everybody was looking on because the wind was high and everybody in St. Morris and all the stores looking. Looking on, standing on the bank. But through that, let's see, two started out, he couldn't make it. One come out and two drowned.

David Dollar: My goodness.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: And it was well-harnessed up. Just the nicest and the best of.

David Dollar: Yes, ma'am.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: So through that, when we know anything, my daddy come to his house on this side, head down. My mother met him. What's the matter? Knelt said, trouble, trouble, trouble. He come after bridles of his own to take these horses back to Natchitoches. He come all the way around on this side, crossed over, crossed them back over. When they come out, they didn't have on nothing. They kicked out everything.

David Dollar: My goodness. Horses got out.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: Yeah, the horses got out. Really did. They got out. And two men got drowned. One come out. And he the one told the other one started and tried to bring some of his drummer packages, but he couldn't make it.

David Dollar: Well, I'll be.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: And so that is it.

David Dollar: How old were you when this happened? Do you remember?

Mrs. Hattie Harris: Oh, well I must be six years old. Because you didn't go to school then early as they do.

David Dollar: Right. Right.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: No. You had to be six or seven.

David Dollar: You did go to school though, right around the area here.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: Yeah. In Natchitoches.

David Dollar: What do you remember about going to school in Natchitoches when you were a young girl? Was it hard or did you have a good time or learn things that you didn't want to learn?

Mrs. Hattie Harris: No, no, no. I always wanted to learn.

David Dollar: Oh, really?

Mrs. Hattie Harris: Always wanted to learn. And now Mr. Thomas Bullock was the first teacher I come to know. But my brother from St. Morris was coming up on the Lou Ellis here to this school.

David Dollar: Yes, ma'am.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: To Lou Ellis. But I wasn't old enough and my uncle stayed up to here and my mother... That's my mother's brother. And she would visit and that caused us to be where... He boated with my uncle, this Thomas Bullock. And he was a finished teacher. He was real good. And the best exhibition ever was given to Lou Ellis, from my remembrance, it was him. And they had some other good ones, but not as good as his.

David Dollar: What was your favorite subject in school? Did you like to learn, oh, like about history or adding up columns or figures or what did you like about school? Or just everything?

Mrs. Hattie Harris: Everything. Anything. I didn't reject nothing and all. I never has got a lick about my lesson. I always kept my lesson one lesson ahead of the other.

David Dollar: Oh, that's good.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: I know this today and I know my lesson for tomorrow.

David Dollar: For tomorrow too.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: That's the way.

David Dollar: Oh, I tell you that. The way to do it.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: Yeah. Well that's the way. Now, at that time I wasn't in no grammar. I stopped school. I had to stop in third grade.

David Dollar: Yes, ma'am.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: Which was so grievous to me and with me, but I had to do it. My mother died when I was 12 and she left twins.

David Dollar: Oh, goodness.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: And she called me to the bedside and told me to come to the bed and I went. She said, "If I should die, I want you to be the mother of my two children." My mother's sister, she over there living there. Just us two. So I had to stay with the children.

David Dollar: Sure did.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: She went to school. She went to every teacher in the world until they got where they say they couldn't teach her. They'd have to send up to-

David Dollar: [inaudible 00:06:40] or something?

Mrs. Hattie Harris: High school.

David Dollar: High school.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: Gibsland.

David Dollar: Gibsland?

Mrs. Hattie Harris: Gibsland. That's where you sent the children.

David Dollar: I see.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: And seventh grade was high as they went here-

David Dollar: Yes, ma'am.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: ... at that time.

David Dollar: What time was this? Do you remember about what year it was? See if you were about 12 that'll make it about the 1880s, somewhere in there? 18 maybe 90?

Mrs. Hattie Harris: My mother died in '97. 1897.

David Dollar: Yes, ma'am.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: Well, that's when I had to quit.

David Dollar: That's right.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: That's when it was.

David Dollar: Right about then. Okay.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: And I was born 1884.

David Dollar: I see. Okay. Tell you what, let me interrupt you just a second.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: All right. Go ahead.

David Dollar: We're going to take a little commercial. We'll be right back with Ms. Hattie Harris right after this message from the folks at People's Bank. This is David Dollar again. We're visiting on Memories this morning with Mrs. Hattie Harris of Natchitoches. Learning some things that I sure didn't know. Ms. Harris, it's just a few days before Christmas. Do you have any Christmas memories you'd like to share with us or things that you remember or maybe some things you'd like to try to forget about Christmas?

Mrs. Hattie Harris: Well, with my father, Christmas was always good. They always tried to do what they could.

David Dollar: Yes, ma'am.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: We were satisfied at anything they did. And I'm married now. 1902.

David Dollar: How old were you then?

Mrs. Hattie Harris: Well, I married in my 17, but a few days over, in February, I was 18.

David Dollar: You were 18. Almost 18. Well that's about right. Folks are getting married these days at then. Go ahead.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: Yeah. And through that, my husband was pretty rough. But he kept it hidden quite a bit before I come to know, lived with him. He acted like he's all right until you got over with... You know how that is.

David Dollar: Yes, ma'am.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: So he was pretty rough. He didn't never fight. He didn't fight.

David Dollar: Well that's good.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: No. Now, he'd hit a lick.

David Dollar: Oh, goodness.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: But now he'd have to hit another if he was going to hit because I [inaudible 00:08:52] you. I was going to tell him what I had to say. I was going to tell him.

David Dollar: That's what I've heard about you. You need to say what's on your mind all the time.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: I'm going to say.

David Dollar: That's good.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: Knock me down. I'm going to say. It's nothing but right. Or what I think right. What I knows right. And it's true.

David Dollar: That's your opinion and what you think is right.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: That's right.

David Dollar: That's what you need.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: That's right.

David Dollar: I want to ask you something else before we get too much further in the show. I know when we were riding over here, you were kind of concerned over those things in the news. We've been hearing about some of these cows getting killed and showing up. What do you think about that? We were talking about it might be UFOs. What do you think that there might be anything to that? What do you think about folks coming from outer space?

Mrs. Hattie Harris: Well, the outer space, under space one, it's not us here. It's not of us. I don't believe it. I don't believe we that dirty or would do such as that. I called... I told them this morning, that's somebody from out round yonder, unknown to any of us because I just can't understand it. I, naturally... And another thing somebody else must be thinking because they don't seem like the media holding it close enough.

David Dollar: Think they might be scared of what they might find, huh?

Mrs. Hattie Harris: Yeah, yeah. And it is such thing. You can see strange thing. And then we have different monsters to come out. You know?

David Dollar: Oh yeah.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: We have that. And now it takes the Lord to tell which he is telling you. These things going to be. The half ain't told.

David Dollar: That's right.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: This is the beginning of sorrow.

David Dollar: Could be.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: And it is. It's just the beginning of sorrow. Care what come up. It's just the beginning and, the way I see it, it's unnatural to us. And I noticed on the TV. Now, I haven't been over there. The people over there, it appear to me that they're different to us.

David Dollar: What? People in other countries?

Mrs. Hattie Harris: Yeah. They're real different. You can't hardly understand 'em. And what you do understand, they're different. Their ways is different and their belief is different.

David Dollar: That's right.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: I can't see. I don't know. And another thing, I feel like we got some enemies over there.

David Dollar: Oh, yeah.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: They don't get us in America over here.

David Dollar: That could surely be true.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: They don't. They don't.

David Dollar: From the news we've been seeing lately, I think everybody would agree with you like that.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: Well, we got some enemies and ain't just not had it, but they're coming up a little stronger and stronger.

David Dollar: That's right. We don't know who our friends are anymore.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: No, no. Uh-uh.

David Dollar: It's getting pretty...

Mrs. Hattie Harris: No. We really don't know.

David Dollar: We're going to need to try to bring our program to some kind of end here. We like to close our show with a closing memory every time. And if you've got one and you could share with us now, we'd sure like to hear it.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: Well, we have plenty of sickness and so much cancer. And it just stay with me, staying. Man, I've been wanting a chance to tell it to a congregation. Not in this way because-

David Dollar: Yes, ma'am. Well, you'll reach a pretty good audience here.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: Yeah. This is all right since I'm here now.

David Dollar: Good.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: It's a good reason why we're having cancer so much today.

David Dollar: Why is that?

Mrs. Hattie Harris: Well, the beginning, within my mind, and that's what stays, everything we eat is fertilized. Everything we eat. Don't care what it is. Rice, bread [inaudible 00:12:29].

David Dollar: That's right.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: All your vegetables rushing to the market. Some of the vegetables so green when you cook it, the water, you have to pour it all and the greens is too green. But through this, that's fertilizer. They used to do it. Grind up anything, bones of any sort, sick or well. They grind that up and rush it and put it in the ground, but the suction of it coming up in the vegetable. Well, humans can't stand what beasts can. That's what it takes. And another thing about the cancer: The water, I got a zinc bucket that got every color but the right color. It was a brand new and God knows every which way this water turn here, that's the way the bucket, the mop. And you can't wash it out.

David Dollar: So you're saying kind of we need to get back to eating natural food?

Mrs. Hattie Harris: Yes.

David Dollar: And drinking real water. Not all this chemical businesses that folks are putting in it.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: That's right. So long as we was using the mother dust of the Earth, it wasn't no such back there.

David Dollar: But we've been messing with it, haven't we?

Mrs. Hattie Harris: That's all you do now.

David Dollar: Putting that stuff in it and putting stuff in water.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: That's all you're doing. And then the next thing, the women's don't nurse the babies no more. They do not. Put them on a bottle. Well, where'd that milk go? What become of it?

David Dollar: Don't know.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: If you didn't eat a mouthful for two days, when your baby born of your natural self, your milk coming down, that's made up out of you from the suction of you.

David Dollar: That's right.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: And since you are eating everything and anything you want and you ain't nursing your baby, this milk come up. This going to give you a little feel, natural, until that milk finish up on you. Well then here, you're going to rub it down. Do this and do that and turn it back. Well that milk is clotting. You got kernels already in your breast. That milk is not going out of you.

David Dollar: It's not going to be good for it.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: No. It's not good.

David Dollar: I tell you what, Ms. Harris, we thank you for being with our show this morning, and we just might have you back on a special medical show one day telling us some things we might need to do to keep us all a little healthier. Okay? You think you could come back and do that for us?

Mrs. Hattie Harris: I can come back if I'm living. I can come back.

David Dollar: Well, we're going to hope for it. We'll be looking forward to your 92nd birthday come February the 12th. We'll have to send you a birthday card or something or say hello.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: Yeah. Yeah.

David Dollar: We thank you for being with us this morning and we thank you folks at home for joining with us this morning on Memories. Ms. Hattie Harris was with us. If you enjoyed the program, why don't you call the folks down at People's Bank and let them know it because they're bringing the show to us and they'd be glad to hear from you. If you are over 60 and would like to get involved in the community, we would invite you to call the Retired Senior Volunteer Program. Their office number is 352-8647. We'd like to wish you a Merry Christmas. I know I would. Ms. Harris would and all the folks here at [inaudible 00:15:51] and People's Bank. And we thank you for joining us today on Memories. Good day.

Mrs. Hattie Harris: All right [inaudible 00:15:56]. Yeah.

David Dollar interviews Hattie Harris, 92, about growing up in Natchitoches, her father’s work as a ferryman on the Red River, attending school in the area and her love of learning, the death of her mother, Christmas memories, UFOs, and her thoughts on the rise in cancer.

Tags: podcast, oral history interview, memories, red river, ferryman, christmas memories, school

January 29, 2026

53. Gracious Prudhomme

Transcript

Transcript

David Dollar: Good morning. This is David Dollar, and we're going to visit this morning on Memories. This is Gracious Prudhomme of Natchitoches, a retired schoolteacher, and we're going to begin our program right after this message from People's Bank & Trust Company.

Hello, once again. In case you've just joined us this morning, this is David Dollar on Memories. We're visiting in the home of Ms. Gracious Prudhomme of Natchitoches today. Ms. Prudhomme, why don't we start things off by you just telling us a little bit about yourself, when you were born and a little background information, how about?

Gracious Prudhomme: I was born on Boyd Street, February 6th, 1902. I was born there what we call a normal school at that time, which was a very interesting spot to be around because to see the children going back in the valley, it was really something.

David Dollar: About, in your estimation, I guess, about how many students attended here at that time?

Gracious Prudhomme: Attended normal school?

David Dollar: That came to the school.

Gracious Prudhomme: Well, I was very young at that time. I couldn't say, but I don't imagine it wasn't anything like it is now.

David Dollar: Bet so.

Gracious Prudhomme: But they had a lot of them up there. Children of all ages went there. Because they had the elementary and high school.

David Dollar: Oh really? I didn't know that. Well, they were producing teachers then too, weren't they? They forgot. So the kind of same situation as the lab school out there.

Gracious Prudhomme: That's right. Yes, sir.

David Dollar: What were your folks doing when you were born there growing up?

Gracious Prudhomme: Well, my father was a carpenter and my mother washed and ironed. At that time, they had no laundry at the normal and we didn't know anything about washaterias, so our mothers would wash for those girls up there and sometime they'd have a lot of them that the wash for.

David Dollar: Oh, I bet so.

Gracious Prudhomme: At that time.

David Dollar: I bet that again, at that time, that was quite a service to the young ladies, especially at the college too.

Gracious Prudhomme: It was quite a service.

David Dollar: Now.

Gracious Prudhomme: They had no way of doing their clothes like they do now.

David Dollar: Right. Yeah. We just take things like that for granted now. Got washaterias right off campus.

Gracious Prudhomme: That's right.

David Dollar: And even in some of the dorms,

Gracious Prudhomme: We didn't know what a washateria was at that particular time period.

David Dollar: And most families probably didn't have the washing machines, as we know with that.

Gracious Prudhomme: They didn't have them, at least we didn't know anything about a washing machine. They used the old wash tub and washboard at that time, and wash pots to boil in, you see?

David Dollar: Did you ever do any of that around the house?

Gracious Prudhomme: Sure, yes. Around the house. When I grew up, it was going on. And as I grew, well naturally I got into all hose things.

David Dollar: You inherited some of the work around the house.

Gracious Prudhomme: Yeah, I inherited some of that too. So if I couldn't iron, I could press. You see?

David Dollar: Right.

Gracious Prudhomme: I could help out like that.

David Dollar: And didn't you mention too that you had two brothers but no sisters?

Gracious Prudhomme: I had two brothers, and no sisters.

David Dollar: You got kind of stuck with the ladies work.

Gracious Prudhomme: That's right. That's right. Because they helped out with whatever was to be done around the house. Naturally boys helped in those days, just like the girls helped.

David Dollar: Just, if there was work to be done, it got done.

Gracious Prudhomme: There was work to be done and it was everybody's job to see that the work was done.

David Dollar: Do you think that's the same case in homes today?

Gracious Prudhomme: It should be. I don't know how far it goes now.

David Dollar: Maybe not.

Gracious Prudhomme: But everybody should feel responsible for the home and helping to keep up things.

David Dollar: I believe that, for sure. Tell me about going to school.

Gracious Prudhomme: Well, I started to school when I was six years old. One particular thing I remember my mother kept telling me, "Be sure you tell him you was six years old." And that's one thing that makes me remember that I was six years old.

David Dollar: Because your mother instilled it so much.

Gracious Prudhomme: You see instilled it in my mind when I started in Shiloh Baptist Church. The same church is down there. It's a different building, but the church still stands there. It's on 4th Street.

David Dollar: Down on fourth Street.

Gracious Prudhomme: And I can remember how crowded this church was and the grades must have been about first through fourth or something like that. But-

David Dollar: All the children were right into one church.

Gracious Prudhomme: All of those were in one church and they had two teachers there. I remember that well. My first teacher was Miss Ola Barlow. I remember her.

David Dollar: She must've made quite an impression on you.

Gracious Prudhomme: She did. She made quite an impression on me. And of course the upper grades went to a school that we now call, we used to call it Green Valley. Professor Thomas taught that school. That was the upper grades. And I guess when you get about fifth grade or something like that, you would go up there.

David Dollar: We need to take a short commercial break at this time. We'll come back and kind of pick up where we left off in just a minute. David Dollars on Memories is visiting with Mrs. Gracious Prudhomme, we'll be right back after this message from People's Bank, our sponsor. Hello once again. In case you've just joined us. David Dollar, visiting on Memories this morning with Ms. Gracious Prudhomme. Miss Prudhomme, we were talking about you attending school and we know that you're a retired teacher. How about talking a little bit about why you decided to go into teaching and start telling us about when you first taught?

Gracious Prudhomme: Well, I always thought from small that I would enjoy teaching, because some of the teachers that I had gone to, it impressed me very much about learning and about helping others. And I was encouraged through friends that would be a nice thing for us to do. We would start teaching and so we did.

David Dollar: How old were you when you first started teaching?

Gracious Prudhomme: Oh, I guess about 18, about that. At that time, we had no schoolhouses for colored schools. The only colored schoolhouse that I remember at that particular time here when I started the school was the Catholic school down on Truder Street. I attended there for a while and then, when I started teaching, well, we only had church houses or other houses to teach in.

David Dollar: And that was still around, what about 1920 to 1922?

Gracious Prudhomme: 22.

David Dollar: 25 somewhere in there.

Gracious Prudhomme: 22 or something, maybe a little bit earlier.

David Dollar: Where did you first teach? Was it in Natchitoches?

Gracious Prudhomme: I taught at Rockfold. At Natchitoches Parish.

David Dollar: Where is that in relation to today? That doesn't ring a bell for me.

Gracious Prudhomme: It's kind of hard to tell you, but it's down on what we call Old River. Part of Old River.

David Dollar: Okay. I know where Old River is.

Gracious Prudhomme: If you want to go down there, you know where the old dump used to be, past there.

David Dollar: Across the new bypass there?

Gracious Prudhomme: Like you going towards Holiday Inn. But then you will cut off on a short road before you get there.

David Dollar: Right. Oh yeah. And just it follows Old River down to the church out there.

Gracious Prudhomme: Yeah.

David Dollar: Okay. So was it that same church?

Gracious Prudhomme: No, that church, they tore it down. I think it's torn down, but I know they're not using it anymore. It's partly down anyway. They have a new church, a very nice brick church there.

David Dollar: But it was on that same site, so, that you first taught.

Gracious Prudhomme: Just right on that same site.

David Dollar: Tell me about your first day of school. The new teacher walking in, wanting to make a big impression on her students. What did you find waiting on you when you went into the school?

Gracious Prudhomme: Well, I found quite a few children, if I remember well, I had 132 children on roll.

David Dollar: My goodness.

Gracious Prudhomme: And we were in one big church house with a big wood heater sitting in the middle.

David Dollar: One heater in the middle?

Gracious Prudhomme: In the middle.

David Dollar: And benches to sit on.

Gracious Prudhomme: And benches to sit on. The children had no desks.

David Dollar: My goodness.

Gracious Prudhomme: And of course I was lucky to use that collection table for my desk, you see. But other than that, we only had a system for water and the children brought their lunches. We were unlucky like the children are now. They have a good hot lunch. At the time, you had to bring all lunches in paper bags and buckets.

David Dollar: And you were teaching all the elementary grades.

Gracious Prudhomme: All the elementary grades from first through eighth grade.

David Dollar: You had children that had never even seen an alphabet before all the way up to those who had learned to read and write and everything. That must have been a tremendous challenge as a teacher.

Gracious Prudhomme: It was.

David Dollar: To say the least.

Gracious Prudhomme: It was to have all those children and to try to get around to them all day.

David Dollar: I bet.

Gracious Prudhomme: But you see, if we had children in upper grades, they could help us with the little children in the afternoon, for instance. I could hear them all myself in the morning, but they did expect the little children to have at least two reading lessons a day. Well, then the children in upper grades could help out-

David Dollar: Would help you.

Gracious Prudhomme: With the little children.

David Dollar: That sounds like a good system and one that you would almost have to use because like you said-

Gracious Prudhomme: You couldn't get around.

David Dollar: You couldn't get around to every student. There's no way.

Gracious Prudhomme: Every one, twice a day like that, especially the small folks.

David Dollar: We are just about out of time on our show this morning. We like to close our show with what we call the closing memory. Why don't you share with us again about education that which we talked about a little earlier on the program?

Gracious Prudhomme: Well, I would like to say in the closing, I would like to encourage all the young people to go to school and to try to learn because they don't have the disadvantages that we had when we were coming along. They have good schools now. They have the chance to go to college at home, and they can use these things and this will make better men and women out of them if they would just hold on to it.

David Dollar: Words of wisdom for every young person, whether in Natchitoches Parish or anywhere else. Miss Prudhomme, we thank you for taking your time out and sharing with us these memories today. We thank you folks at home for joining us and The People's Bank for bringing it all to us. If you folks at home have memories that you would like to share or you know somebody who in your opinion does have memories and would like to share, maybe a relative or a neighbor, why don't you give us a call and tell us about it? We are able to go into homes now as we're visiting in Miss Prudhomme's Home today. The number of the retired senior volunteer program is 352-8647, and they're helping us get our taping schedule set up. We thank you again, Miss Prudhomme for having us in your home and you folks for joining us. David Dollar, visiting with Ms. Gracious Prudhomme on Memories. Have a nice day.

David Dollar interviews retired schoolteacher Gracious Prudhomme about growing up with two brothers, attending school as a child, becoming a teacher at 18, and her encouragement to young people.

Tags: natchitoches, oral history interview, school, teaching, podcast, memories

January 22, 2026

52. Gerald De Louche

Transcript

Transcript

David Dollar: Good morning. This is David Dollar on Memories. We're glad you've joined us. We're visiting down in Cloutierville this morning with Mr. Gerald De Louche, and we'll be back in just a minute to start our program, right after this message from our sponsor, People's Bank and Trust Company. Good morning again. This is David Dollar on Memories down at Cloutierville, visiting with Mr. Gerald De Louche. Mr. De Louche, how are you doing today?

Gerald De Louche: Pretty good.

David Dollar: Good? Why don't we start things off just by you telling us a little bit about yourself when you were born and some things like that.

Gerald De Louche: I was born in 1892, on the eighth day of August. I'm 83 years old. Nine months because it...

David Dollar: Almost another one, huh?

Gerald De Louche: Yeah.

David Dollar: Yeah. You were born where? Around these parts or somewhere else?

Gerald De Louche: Yeah, I was born between Grand River and Cane River on what they call Little River.

David Dollar: Mm-hmm. So right around Cloutierville, huh?

Gerald De Louche: Yeah.

David Dollar: Spent most of your life around here, I guess.

Gerald De Louche: Except about three or four years. Well, I worked three years at Herriman over there in the store. Then I went to Mississippi after the war. I stayed there two years.

David Dollar: What were your folks doing when you grew up around here?

Gerald De Louche: Farming.

David Dollar: Cotton farming, I suppose. You told me when we were talking earlier about something that some other folks that we've talked to, especially right around here, around Natchez and Cloutierville talked about. That's the steamboats. Tell me what you remember about the steamboats.

Gerald De Louche: Well, the only thing I remember about the steamboats is when they passed in Red River, seen three steamboats at one time at the [inaudible 00:01:44] over there.

David Dollar: Do you remember the names of those boats?

Gerald De Louche: I believe it's one of the Roberta and Alberta, I believe. And the George L. Bass.

David Dollar: And the George L. Bass? Yeah. You said you remembered Mr. Bass?

Gerald De Louche: No, no, I don't remember him. [inaudible 00:02:03] George L. Bass. That's the boat, name of the boat.

David Dollar: And the company that owned-

Gerald De Louche: The oil company [inaudible 00:02:10] on it.

David Dollar: So what did they put on those boats?

Gerald De Louche: Nothing but cotton seeds. George L. Bass. That's all he carried. Cotton seeds.

David Dollar: I see.

Gerald De Louche: And they others carried freight coming up the river.

David Dollar: And so the folks would meet the boats and get the supplies-

Gerald De Louche: They had landing at [inaudible 00:02:29]. That's where you get your stuff if you order from New Orleans or Alexandria by the boat. They'd put your stuff down there at the [inaudible 00:02:39].

David Dollar: I see. But all the cotton seed was loaded on the George L. Bass.

Gerald De Louche: Oh yeah. All the cotton seed.

David Dollar: And so that was pretty important for the cotton families around here, like your own, I guess, huh? That's the very money you had there. I remember you said one time that a couple of the neighbors were finigling on how cotton they put on a bale. Didn't you tell me something like that? Tell us that again.

Gerald De Louche: Yeah. We had two fellows that worked on the plate. Two half-hands. One make bale at about 600 pounds. Nothing under, and the other was from 375 to 400.

David Dollar: Cheating a little bit, huh?

Gerald De Louche: And the boat that sunk while back, going back to New Orleans, and they paid us $50 a piece for every bale.

David Dollar: Goodness. So the boat that they put it on sunk.

Gerald De Louche: Yeah, it sunk.

David Dollar: The company had to pay you?

Gerald De Louche: Yeah, the company paid us $50 a bale.

David Dollar: So the man that was making $375-

Gerald De Louche: $375. He won on his. He done all right. But the other one lost.

David Dollar: Lost money on the deal, didn't he?

Gerald De Louche: Yeah.

David Dollar: Yeah.

Gerald De Louche: Cotton was worth about 10 cents a pound then.

David Dollar: Goodness.

Gerald De Louche: That's what they paid. 10 cents a pound, 500 pound bale, so $50.

David Dollar: 50 bucks. And the 500 pound bale was a standard and I guess still is.

Gerald De Louche: Yeah, that was standard. That's what it paid on. 500 pound bale.

David Dollar: You mentioned another incident with one of your friends and who was in a little skiff running into one of the steamboats or something, didn't you?

Gerald De Louche: Oh, that's James Bale.

David Dollar: Tell me about that.

Gerald De Louche: He was going to go and get some whiskey on the boat. He was in the skiff, and when the skiff hit the boat, it sunk and he had to swim, pass under the boat and come out on the back.

David Dollar: He went under the big paddle wheel, huh?

Gerald De Louche: Mm-hmm.

David Dollar: And if he hadn't been a good swimmer, he'd have been in trouble.

Gerald De Louche: Oh, I'm sure he'd have been drowned.

David Dollar: Yeah.

Gerald De Louche: But he was a good swimmer and he swam to the shore.

David Dollar: I bet that was scary.

Gerald De Louche: I guess so.

David Dollar: Yeah. Well, I'll tell you what, we need to take a short commercial break. We'll be back and talk a little bit more right after this message from People's Bank. We'll be right back.

Hello, once again. In case you're just joining us, this is David Dollar. We're visiting down in Cloutierville this morning with Mr. Gerald De Louche. Mr. De Louche, we're talking about growing up on a farm around Cloutierville when you were growing up. You mentioned you had a brother and a sister, but your sister died.

Gerald De Louche: No, one of my sisters.

David Dollar: One of your sisters died.

Gerald De Louche: I had two sisters and one brother.

David Dollar: Okay. Had two sisters. Fill us in a little bit about that. We were talking about some of the things that families had to live with during these times.

Gerald De Louche: I don't know much about that because I just had come out the service.

David Dollar: She died of typhoid fever?

Gerald De Louche: Typhoid fever.

David Dollar: And you mentioned too, when you were, what about five? You remember the quarantine?

Gerald De Louche: Oh yeah. I remember the quarantine. I was about seven years old. I believe it was 1902 when I was born in 90, so I was about 10 years old.

David Dollar: Almost 10.

Gerald De Louche: About 10 years old. When the quarantine, when the yellow fever broke out at Bayonetschie, the quarantine, Cloutierville quarantined against the back, [inaudible 00:05:52]. And Old Man Raul and them quarantined down there. He was justice of the peace down there, and he quarantined where I lived and they had another quarantined there. Self and pop and them, they all got together and quarantined that big territory between the Cane River and Red River.

David Dollar: What happened to the man who said he was going to come through and come back?

Gerald De Louche: I don't know. I don't know. I can't tell you what happened, but he never did come back.

David Dollar: You said a man needed to get through right before the quarantine?

Gerald De Louche: Yeah.

David Dollar: What did your dad tell him?

Gerald De Louche: He come from Texas, I believe. I don't know where he come from. He was going down somewhere in the low country and he said he had to come back and they told him he couldn't come back through there because of the quarantine. You see, he'd come back with his rifle and then father answered, "Why [inaudible 00:06:49] get that back with a rifle? We had a rifle waiting for you."

David Dollar: That's right. But he didn't come back to you, huh?

Gerald De Louche: No, he didn't come back.

David Dollar: It's pretty wise on his part, I guess.

Gerald De Louche: You're damn right. He'd have got killed.

David Dollar: You told me too, that you were a big hunter even when you were-

Gerald De Louche: Oh God, I was a big hunter.

David Dollar: What was your specialty? What did you like-

Gerald De Louche: Duck. Duck was my specialties.

David Dollar: I guess they used to have some boughs around here, as well as Cane River and Red River. Was it pretty good?

Gerald De Louche: I got a big lake on the back. It was shallow lake, shallow water, lots of oak in there and they'd come to feed there in the morning.

David Dollar: Used to be good duck hunting, huh?

Gerald De Louche: Oh yeah. Hunting was good. [inaudible 00:07:27] around.

David Dollar: I'll tell you this, I got to confess, I've really never been duck hunting because-

Gerald De Louche: You never have been?

David Dollar: I never have because it's so cold in the morning. Was it as cold back then as it is now?

Gerald De Louche: I knew it was cold.

David Dollar: I believe it.

Gerald De Louche: I've gone hunting where I had get in the water without no boots because we didn't have no boots in them times.

David Dollar: Yeah.

Gerald De Louche: I'd get on a log and make me a fire before daylight. You could hear them ducks coming about. They'd let loose and I had a lake on the other side of the Red River. You could hear them a mile coming.

David Dollar: Must've been a big flock of ducks.

Gerald De Louche: Oh yeah. They coming. You could hear them hollering about a mile.

David Dollar: Goodness.

Gerald De Louche: When they'd get started hollering, I'd throw the fire down in the water and I didn't get cold no more.

David Dollar: You're excited then.

Gerald De Louche: Yeah.

David Dollar: You said too, that you didn't have real good ways of keeping meat. So what did you do with the extra ducks that you would kill?

Gerald De Louche: We'd trade them for shells.

David Dollar: Trade a couple of ducks for a box of shells.

Gerald De Louche: A box of shells.

David Dollar: Well, I'll be. And that would work pretty good, I guess.

Gerald De Louche: Oh yeah. We'd get all the shells we want to shoot.

David Dollar: Kept you in shells and the grocery man in ducks.

Gerald De Louche: In ducks. And he was selling the shells.

David Dollar: One more thing before we close. We like to usually end up with what we call our closing memory. You told us one time about, back again, the steamboat story about your teacher when you were in school one day. Why don't we use that as our closing memory? Close things up.

Gerald De Louche: [inaudible 00:09:01].

David Dollar: All right, tell us that story.

Gerald De Louche: I was going to school on Red River. We had a teacher by the name of Raleigh Dean. He was rough, but one day the steamboat stopped at [inaudible 00:09:16], which is about 50 yard from the school. He went and got on the boat. I don't know what he went to get. I don't know. He didn't drink that I know of. So he went on the boat to raise the gangplank. Before he could get off, he had to stay on the boat.

David Dollar: Took him down river?

Gerald De Louche: He went about five or six miles and let him out.

David Dollar: And y'all were still in the schoolhouse when he-

Gerald De Louche: We were having fun.

David Dollar: What did you do when he was gone?

Gerald De Louche: We just took the old goat and put it in the schoolhouse with the girls. We were going to school in the single room.

David Dollar: Oh, yeah.

Gerald De Louche: I believe it was '44, '45 during, going to school in a one room in the schoolhouse.

David Dollar: And you took a goat and put in there with the girls.

Gerald De Louche: Those boys took the goat and put it in there with the girls.

David Dollar: And they didn't like that much.

Gerald De Louche: No. [inaudible 00:10:09].

David Dollar: What did Mr. Dean have to say when he got back?

Gerald De Louche: He didn't say nothing. He wouldn't have told you nothing, but as long as he wasn't in school. But when he was in school, you had to walk straight. He'd put the rattan on you.

David Dollar: The rattan? What is that?

Gerald De Louche: Yeah, that's a vine.

David Dollar: Oh yeah?

Gerald De Louche: And make a switch.

David Dollar: So he was kind of probably embarrassed that he got caught on the boat. So he didn't cause you much trouble.

Gerald De Louche: [inaudible 00:10:40]. When he got back at three o'clock, it was time to let us out.

David Dollar: Already out of school then. He couldn't say anything. Well, that's good. Well, Mr. De Louche, we thank you for joining us today. We had a real good time down here at Cloutierville. We're going to have to come back and visit some more with you. If any of you folks, Cloutierville, Natchez, anywhere in the parish have got some memories you'd like to share or you know somebody who does, why don't you give us a call. We'll try to get in touch with them and set up an appointment. We're able to come out into your home now or wherever you would like us to come. The number that we're using to get these reservations, the phone number is 352-8647. That's the retired senior volunteer program who's helping us schedule these taping sessions. We thank you folks for joining us today. We thank you, Mr. De Louche, for having us down here. We thank the People's Bank for bringing this program to us, and y'all have a nice day. Enjoy it.

Gerald De Louche: See that they got a telephone, but I use it sometime, but I never use it. Sometimes I'm by myself, the telephone rings, well I'll answer, but I never...

David Dollar interviews Gerald De Louche, 83, about growing up in Cloutierville, watching the steamboats, arguments over cotton bales, the yellow fever quarantine, and duck hunting.

Tags: cloutierville, natchitoches parish, oral history interview, memories, podcast, steamboat, yellow fever, cotton

January 15, 2026

51. Emmiline Armond

Transcript

Transcript

Speaker 1: Good morning. This is Hubert Laster, and this morning on the Memories Program, we'll be visiting with Mrs. Emeline P. Armond. We'll be back in just a few moments after this word from Peoples Bank and Trust our sponsors. This is Hubert Laster, and this morning we're visiting with Mrs. Armond. We're pleased to have you on our show.

Speaker 2: Hello.

Speaker 1: Well, anyway, we were talking earlier about, you said you were born in 1902.

Speaker 2: I was born in 1902 and on September 21st, and I lived a happy childhood life, and I was attended a little school in Granicole for two years, and then my father died and I went to the Sisters of the Divine Providence in Natchitoches until I got in high school. And after my high school days, well, then I rode horseback for the high school, for the four years of high school. And then when I finished high school, well, I married and I moved to Cottonport. And I'd been living in Cottonport until two years ago when I got sick. And then I come and lived here with my daughter in Natchitoches, Mrs. Buell Stevens. And then I come up to the home. I've been up here at the home at the Natchitoches Manor two months, a little over two months.

Speaker 1: Do you like it here?

Speaker 2: I like it here. It's fine. They have a lot of things that keep you busy. We go on picnics once a month. We have movies twice a week, and I do all kind of craft work, all kind of embroidery and crochet, and I just keep real busy all the time. I pick the menus in the dining hall and I introduce some of the people around when they come in.

Speaker 1: Yes ma'am.

Speaker 2: Newcomers come in, well I introduce them to the other patients. And I have an exercise class that I'm the head of, and that's about all I need.

Speaker 1: I bet you do more than that. Do you have a boyfriend?

Speaker 2: No.

Speaker 1: Are you sure now?

Speaker 2: No, I'm sure of that, I don't [inaudible 00:02:37].

Speaker 1: Do you have parties up here?

Speaker 2: Yeah, we have parties once a month. They have a party for Old Osborne in that month. And then Ms. Campbell, Dr. Campbell's grandmother, had a party the other day and I was invited. It was her 90th birthday.

Speaker 1: My goodness.

Speaker 2: And they had a party in her room with the flowers and had a big birthday cake.

Speaker 1: You were talking earlier about when you were in the convent. I know our listeners would like to know what was the daily routine then?

Speaker 2: The first thing we get up in the morning, we'd have to say prayers. They'd wake us up with the prayers in the morning. And while we were washing and dressing ourselves, we were praying. And then after we got dressed, we walked down the hill. The convent was up on the hill, we walked down the hill and went to church. And then after church went back to the convent, we ate breakfast, and we went to school. And after school, where we could play and do whatever we wanted to do until it was time for study period, time for supper. And then we studied and had to go to bed at nine o'clock. We didn't have too much of the interest in life, but...

Speaker 1: Oh. You never did do anything to have a little extra fun?

Speaker 2: Well, we never did-

Speaker 1: Cause a little bit of trouble?

Speaker 2: No, I never did cause any trouble. I try not to cause any trouble anywhere I go.

Speaker 1: Oh, you look like a troublemaker to me.

Speaker 2: No, I'm a happy, go-lucky person. I love to laugh and joke and cut up. All these people up here, every one I pass, I tap them on the shoulder, I shake hands with them or something, tell them hello and give them a good word. And I go around to all the rooms and visit all the sick that I know. Some of them, I don't know, but a lot of them I know and I go visit the sick. Sometimes I sit down on the porch, big crowd of us get out there. And every once in a while... We had a pea shelling contest the other day. They had six bushels of peas and we shelled those peas. We had a real good time shelling peas. One of the boys sang while we were shelling the peas. And the 4th of July, they celebrated with homemade ice cream. Homemade ice cream, a little cupcakes with a flag stuck in them.

Speaker 1: How does that differ from the 4th of July celebrations you used to have?

Speaker 2: Well, I didn't, one 4th of July was just like the other one to me. Just like the other days to me. We didn't celebrate much in Cottonport. They do now though, but in my time they don't celebrate much because they had a big to-do in Cottonport this year, 4th of July.

Speaker 1: Y'all didn't barbecue or get together with-

Speaker 2: Yeah, some of them did.

Speaker 1: Big picnics and all that?

Speaker 2: Picnics. Uh-huh.

Speaker 1: How about dances?

Speaker 2: Well, I didn't go to dances anymore. I went when my husband was living, but after he died, I never went to any dances.

Speaker 1: What kind of dances were they? Were they square dances?

Speaker 2: No, it was the two-step and the waltz and the one-step.

Speaker 1: What about at Christmas-time when you were a little girl and you were at home then?

Speaker 2: Well, when I was at home, Santa Claus would come and bring us our toys. We'd hang our stockings on the mantelpiece and Santa Claus would come down the chimney.

Speaker 1: Did you ever see him?

Speaker 2: No. One night I peeped and I saw who Santa Claus was.

Speaker 1: Oh, well. We need to take a break right now for a word from our sponsors, Peoples Bank and Trust. In case you've just joined us, this is Hubert Laster visiting with Mrs. Armond on the Memory Show. We were talking a little while ago about your life on the farm.

Speaker 2: Well, my husband and I had a farm. He raised cattle and hogs and goats and chickens and turkeys, and we'd kill these pigs and we didn't have a deep freeze anything to put it in. So we'd put it in, we'd fry the fat from the pig and make cracklings, and we'd put those cracklings in jars without any salt and we'd screw them up. And then maybe a month afterwards, we'd both eat them. Well, they'd be just as fresh. And then we'd bake sausage in boudin and we'd have that and we'd take the real little ribs and fry that and put that in lard. And the sausage, we'd fry that and put that in lard, and we'd have that to eat. Just warm it up and we could eat it anytime we wanted.

Speaker 1: Did you make red boudin or white boudin?

Speaker 2: Both of them. Both kind. We made red boudin and white boudin, both them.

Speaker 1: Which one do you liked the best?

Speaker 2: The red.

Speaker 1: Oh yeah, red's good. What about canning?

Speaker 2: And I used to can, he made a good garden and I would can as much as 325 jars. But we didn't have... just plain water bath cook. I had just a plain can. I didn't have a pressure cooker, just a plain can. And every day I'd cane seven quarts of whatever vegetable I had. But he'd plant all beans and peas and just everything. Cucumbers and squash and ah, cushaw and watermelons. You'd have all that. You'd have everything. Even raised sugarcane. He even raised the broom straw to make brooms, and they would make the homemade brooms over there in [inaudible 00:08:49].

Speaker 1: Okay. Did y'all sell this broom straw?

Speaker 2: Well, no, we just made that for our own use. You see, you couldn't hardly buy a good broom and we'd make our own brooms and could make them big. See, they had a man that would make the brooms. We'd bring him the broomcorn and he'd make the brooms.

Speaker 1: Do you know how to make a broom?

Speaker 2: Not me, no. I don't know nothing about making a broom. I knew how to use it.

Speaker 1: Oh, okay. I'd never heard of that before.

Speaker 2: You never?

Speaker 1: No, I'm serious.

Speaker 2: Well, sure. You make brooms. It makes just like a sugar cane, but it's a little smaller and they take the top of it off and they cut it and make brooms out of it, put it on a broom handle. And they got a machine that ties it around, ties it up.

Speaker 1: What kind of stick did you use?

Speaker 2: Broom sticks, we'd saved from one broom to the other. When one would wear out, we'd save the stick. So when we'd bring the broomcorn to have the broom made, we'd bring the sticks along.

Speaker 1: How did you? Okay, I know how you preserve pork, but what'd you do with the goats and the cow-

Speaker 2: Well, we'd kill that and we had a small deep freeze. We put that meat in the deep freeze, but it wasn't a very large deep freeze. We didn't have deep freezes like we have now, those big upright and big chest types and all that. We didn't have that. We had deep freezes at the top of the icebox.

Speaker 1: Do you remember when they used to have block ice? You have an icebox and they'd bring in a chunk of ice to put it in there?

Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah. I used to, when we first married, that's the way they had. We didn't have a fridge there. We had just a icebox and it would bring the ice and that's where we kept our milk and all our vegetables and everything that we had left over. That's how we kept it fresh.

Speaker 1: We're just about out of time. Is there maybe one last thing you'd like to tell the folks out there?

Speaker 2: Nothing else to say.

Speaker 1: Nothing else to say?

Speaker 2: No.

Speaker 1: Well, thank you very much. Okay. It's been a real pleasure visiting with you.

Speaker 2: [inaudible 00:11:24].

Speaker 1: If you would like to share your memories with us, please call 352-8647 and someone will be there to make arrangements with you. Thank you.

Hubert Laster interviews Emmiline Armond about going to school, horse riding, the daily routine at a convent, 4th of July and Christmas celebrations, farming, making boudin, and canning.

Tags: memories, podcast, oral history interview, natchitoches parish, convent, christmas

January 8, 2026

50. Alma Poole

Transcript

Transcript

Hubert Laster: Good morning. This morning on The Memories Program, we're going to be visiting with Mrs. Alma Poole. We'll be back in just a moment after a word from our sponsor, Peoples Bank & Trust.

Good morning, I'm Hubert Laster, and this morning we're visiting with a lovely senior citizen, Mrs. Alma Poole. She's going to tell us about life on a farm in Campti and her life. Good morning.

Alma Poole: Good morning.

Hubert Laster: What about when your father first moved to Campti?

Alma Poole: Well, when he first moved to Campti, they built, he homesteaded 90 acres of land, 97 acres of land.

Hubert Laster: And that was just pine woods?

Alma Poole: Yeah, pine woods, that's right. So oak, too. And he first built a little home, small home on the place. And then he cleared the land. And they were Mother, Daddy, and one brother, and my sister and me over at [inaudible 00:01:10].

Hubert Laster: Rather small family for those days anyway.

Alma Poole: That's right. And after he got the land cleared, he started farming. And after we got large enough to help, we'd help do the farm chores. In the mornings we'd have to do it. When there was more in the family, we needed more land. So he rented some land, about three mile, four miles from home.

Hubert Laster: Was this land already cleared?

Alma Poole: Yes, it was already cleared. He rented for cotton. Our land was just hill land. This was [inaudible 00:01:52] land. And we'd have to get up three o'clock in the morning, [inaudible 00:01:57]. And my sister and I would have to milk 10 or 12 cows, because we had hogs in the pen. And that was our meat.

Hubert Laster: 10 or 12 cows, how much? That's a lot of milk.

Alma Poole: It's a lot of milk.

Hubert Laster: What did you do with all of it?

Alma Poole: Well, we fed it to the hogs. Fed milk to the hogs to fatten them. Fed it with corn and a little beef. And then after we'd get the cows milked, mother was up fixing breakfast for us. And then we'd go take our dinner with us. She had dinner fixed for us too, to take with us. And we'd go out to this land, to this land he had rented, and either hoe, when it was hoeing time we hoed. In cotton-picking time we'd do the same thing. Then we'd come back in and milk those cows again. And we raised all of our [inaudible 00:03:04]. Then we had to bring in wood, carry water in. It's not the convenience that we have today, I'll assure you.

Hubert Laster: It sounds like it.

Alma Poole: And then, after we finished supper, my sister and I would wash the dishes. My oldest sister and I would wash the dishes, and then we'd retire. We'd get up the next morning, do same thing over again.

Hubert Laster: Sounds like some long days.

Alma Poole: Well, they were some long days, I guarantee you.

Hubert Laster: Picking cotton, how much cotton could you pick in a day?

Alma Poole: I could pick over a hundred.

Hubert Laster: Oh my back.

Alma Poole: I could beat my sister in row picking cotton. Papa used to give us a bonus, who should pick the most. And I'd most of the time get the bonus.

Hubert Laster: What did he give you?

Alma Poole: He'd give us so much, a hundred. And then, which ever one picked the most, we'd get a little extra money.

Hubert Laster: Now your house was made out of slats? Boards? What?

Alma Poole: Boards. It was made out of boards. And it was a shingle, we had a... The roof.

Hubert Laster: Wood shingles?

Alma Poole: uh-huh, it was wood shingles, but I was trying to think of the name of it. Cypress shingles.

Hubert Laster: They don't rot.

Alma Poole: No, they don't. It was on there for years and years. I don't ever remember him shingling the house, but the one time when he remodeled it.

Hubert Laster: What about a fireplace?

Alma Poole: Well, we had a double fireplace in the middle of the house. And we had to get in the afternoons when we'd come in and work, we had to help get the wood in. The boys usually did that. Sometimes we'd have to help with it.

And we used the fireplace for several years until we got where my daddy decided then he's going to tear the fire. When he remodeled the house and tear the fireplace out, and just put a flue, put a heater in, an iron heater. And that's why we had firewood.

Hubert Laster: Did you used the fireplace for a stove? Or did you have a stove?

Alma Poole: No, we had a wood stove we cooked on, a big range stove that Daddy bought that we cooked on.

Hubert Laster: What did he make the chimney out of?

Alma Poole: Brick.

Hubert Laster: Oh, he bought his brick?

Alma Poole: Uh-huh, brick and mortar.

Hubert Laster: My goodness. How big was this house? Let me...

Alma Poole: Well, it was, let's see. It was five rooms.

Hubert Laster: Five rooms.

Alma Poole: Five rooms.

Hubert Laster: You had a barn?

Alma Poole: Oh yes, we had a big barn that we kept-

Hubert Laster: Were they made out of boards, too, the barn?

Alma Poole: Yep, made out of boards too.

Hubert Laster: Did he buy these boards or did he make them himself?

Alma Poole: He made them himself.

Hubert Laster: What tools did he use to make boards? Do you remember that?

Alma Poole: Well, I don't know. He had some kind of a flat tool that he'd make the boards out of. He did it by hand.

Hubert Laster: [inaudible 00:06:27] them down when he got through?

Alma Poole: Yeah.

Hubert Laster: Splitting them out. It's a lot of work for one board.

Alma Poole: Well, I mean, but that's the way he made them. I've forgotten what he call that tool what he made them with. I can't remember it. Been so many years ago, I wasn't very big then.

Hubert Laster: We need to take a break right now. We'll be back in just a moment. If you've just joined us, we're visiting with Mrs. Alma Poole, and she's going to start talking about The Depression and how it was like for her and her family.

Alma Poole: Well, I can remember when we didn't even, we couldn't get sugar, didn't have the money to get it with. And we had a lot of times, of course, we had some time where you could get some, but a lot of time we used the syrup that we raised. My daddy had a mill that he grind his cane on, made his own syrup. And that, at a certain state, sometimes when he cooked the syrup, it made this crystal sugar in the bottom of the buckets, put it up in gallon buckets. And a lot of time we'd have to use that sugar for our coffee. Couldn't get-

Hubert Laster: Well, it's not bad, is it?

Alma Poole: No, it's not all that bad. Of course, it's not as good as the granulated sugar, but still, it does sweeten it. And the most of the cakes mother would make them with syrup. We'd make our cakes with syrup. Of course, we kids loved that. We always loved the ginger cake. And my daddy, during that, the W-

Hubert Laster: WPA?

Alma Poole: ... PA, that's right. He and a friend of his, Mr. Barbers, had to walk from Campti, which is to our home, where we lived, to Campti. It's about, well, it's six miles from Campti about where we live, our home place is. Mr. Barbers, he lived just above about a mile and a quarter from us, between Campti and our home. And anyway, they'd walk to Campti and work all day long for a dollar and a half a day, and they walked back home. That was a convenience they had, they walked. They did that for quite some time. They have a little extra money to help them along with their crops.

Hubert Laster: Now, did you have to pay taxes on your land during all this? Or during The Depression?

Alma Poole: Yes, they had to pay taxes.

Hubert Laster: But there wasn't any money.

Alma Poole: Well, the taxes weren't high like they are now, though.

Hubert Laster: Oh.

Alma Poole: It wasn't compared up with what are now. But they had to pay taxes.

Hubert Laster: But y'all always had plenty to eat?

Alma Poole: Yes, we always had plenty to eat. During the weather time, when it got cold enough, Daddy killed his hog that he had in the pen. And we made, cured our own meat and made a lot of lard. Now you can't eat that. Now it will kill you. That's with the tell now, "You can't eat that, it'll kill you." Bacon, use bacon grease and things like that.

Hubert Laster: Well, I eat it.

Alma Poole: And that's all we used. And we grew up with it. And we made, we put up sausages. Mother smoked them. Smoked means what we call a smokehouse, where we had the meat, we'd cure the meat. And my daddy would pickle a lot of meat in barrels.

Hubert Laster: Pickle it?

Alma Poole: Pickle it, in brine.

Hubert Laster: How do you pickle it? In brine?

Alma Poole: In brine.

Hubert Laster: Okay.

Alma Poole: He'd put the brine, and so much water, and then so much salt, and keep putting that salt until, when it would boil, it'd float an egg.

Hubert Laster: Fold an egg?

Alma Poole: Float an egg. And then-

Hubert Laster: Oh, okay.

Alma Poole: Float an egg, and then it would be done. There'd be enough salt in it. And he'd pickle it.

Hubert Laster: Did he crack the egg first?

Alma Poole: No, you just put it in. Then when it got enough salt in there, and you stir-

Hubert Laster: That's pretty thick.

Alma Poole: And that egg would float. Come up, it would just float, then knew you had enough salt.

Hubert Laster: Well, Mrs. Poole, we've certainly enjoyed visiting with you today. And oh, by the way, if any of you would like to make a tape for us, share your memories, would you please call the Retired Senior Volunteers Program? That number is 352- 8647. This is Hubert Laster wishing all of you a very pleasant good day.

Hubert Laster interviews Alma Poole about growing up in Campti, farming and picking cotton, fireplaces, making boards, the Great Depression, making sugar, and pickling meat.

Tags: memories, podcast, campti, louisiana, natchitoches parish, oral history interview, great depression

December 25, 2025

49. Marie Smith

Transcript

Transcript

David Dollar (00:00): Hello again, in case you're just joining us, this is David Dollar. We're glad to have you on Memories with us this morning. We're going to visit with Ms. Marie Smith of Natchitoches, and we're going to start things off. Ms. Smith, you've visited once with us already on Memories, and we'd like to maybe pick up where we left off last time. Talking earlier, you mentioned some things about, you remember playing games and things you did as a child and in school. Why don't we start there?

Marie Smith (00:25): Well I was fortunate in one way, and another way, I wasn't. I had a brother, older, and one younger. And, actually, I was on the side with the boys, and I did what they did. And they'd play dolls with me at times, but the most of time our activities were outdoors. And especially in the summer, we didn't have any trouble finding something to do. There was horses to ride. And we didn't have any place to swim. That's one thing I regret. We didn't learn to swim. But we would go crawfishing, and we would go berry picking. Lots of times in the spring, my mother would come in and tell us, "Well, we got a bunch of little new chickens this morning." We'd go to the chicken house and see that hen with all the little-bitties. That was a pretty sight.

David Dollar (01:19): Where were you growing up at this time?

Marie Smith (01:19): Culbertson Lane. On the farm.

David Dollar (01:19): On the farm.

Marie Smith (01:28): And then maybe our daddy would come in and tell us, "Well, we got a new litter of pigs." Well, that was a pretty sight, too, a big old sow with about 10 or 15 little pigs. That was pretty too. And, when the chicken business came, when she went to sitting the hens, I always wanted to own something. So I said, "But why can't I have this one?" She says, "Well, you can have that one, when they hatch. But you got to feed it." They taught us responsibility. And, of course, I fed it until it got to where it eat corn off the yard. And I forgot about even owning the chickens.

David Dollar (02:02): You didn't want to take up that [crosstalk 00:02:06]

Marie Smith (02:06): No, no. So... But we had, in the wintertime, we had a good time. Because the days were short, we went to school, and there wasn't much you could do between that and dark. Because we went to school at four o'clock.

David Dollar (02:22): Four o'clock in the morning?

Marie Smith (02:22): Evening.

David Dollar (02:23): Oh, in the evening?

Marie Smith (02:24): Evening. Now, we got back home and everything. And at night we'd sit around, especially be the cold weather. We would sit around the fire and play Jack in the Bush. That was with pecans. Everybody had him a pan of pecans, and you'd cup your hand up and you'd have to guess whether I had five or whether I didn't have any. And if you didn't guess it right, you paid the difference. Well, we got a kick out that. In the meantime, we were watching birds. We had some robins. Then you could kill robins, and we dressed them. And my daddy had four, five little small legs on the fireplace where we could hang them and roast them. And mother put a big old iron griddle to catch the drippings, and we'd watched those birds cook. And they just tasted so good. And we didn't have too many games. And what we lacked in the home, then, with most people was music. We didn't have much music. And when you heard some music, oh, you just fell for it.

David Dollar (03:37): Where did you hear your first music that you remember?

Marie Smith (03:37): At school.

David Dollar (03:43): At school? Did the teacher have you all singing some songs?

Marie Smith (03:44): Songs. And then we rehearsed the Christmas programs, Maypole dances, that was twice in a year, and Thanksgiving. Now, the Christmas lasted quite a while because we helped hung everything that went on that tree. We made these paper chains. And we would thread the popcorn, and we'd bring in sweet gumballs, and she would dip those in something. But those chains, we just made oodles of those out of colored paper. And that was part of the occupational therapy in the school. When you didn't have a class, well, that would give you something to do. So we'd look forward to Christmas and I can just smell those apples now. I've never smelled the apples that smelled as good when we got them then. They were shipped in. You didn't have the apples, but once a year.

David Dollar (04:41): Oh, really?

Marie Smith (04:42): And that was Christmas?

David Dollar (04:42): Where'd they come from?

Marie Smith (04:44): Well, I don't know. I guess we got them from New Orleans, and fruit was shipped in just about once a year.

David Dollar (04:51): That was a big occasions when it got here, I bet.

Marie Smith (04:58): Ooh, apples and oranges in your stocking. Because we bought candy, and lots of times you could get a candy, but... And raisins, raisins were in a big wooden box, loose raisins. They were dried, and they were delicious. So that went into our Christmas stocking too. But we had a good time. We were never idle, and we would make... Now, the boys would make the traps to catch these birds, deadfall. We'd put them out, and we'd go out there and catch them, and they weren't dead. They were alive. And, in the spring of the year, we played tops and marbles. And they fixed the tops and they-

David Dollar (05:43): Your brothers made their own tops?

Marie Smith (05:45): No, you bought the tops, but that little thing it spin on, it wasn't very sharp. So they'd go and get a nail and sharpen it on this old wheel that we'd sharpen axes on and things and made it real sharp.

David Dollar (06:05): A grindstone or something.

Marie Smith (06:05): That's right. And when they spinned my top, I'm telling you now, I would really move, but we got another one.

David Dollar (06:15): So I tell you what. I want to hear about the tops and about the food and school and all that, in just a minute. We need to take a short commercial break. So let me interrupt you, and we'll pick right back up here. You're making me hungry. We'll be right back after this message from People's Bank, our sponsor. (06:34): Hello. Once again, in case you're just joining us, this is David Dollar visiting this morning on Memories with Ms. Marie Smith. She's got me right in the middle of a story about tops and baby chicks and some of the best fruit you ever had. And some of the things that kids were involved in when she was growing up, don't let me interrupt you again. Go right ahead. Let's start talking about the tops again and school.

Marie Smith (06:57): Well, that was our outdoor activities because there wasn't no place to play in the house. And you certainly didn't run through the house. There wasn't that much room to run through because... And you weren't sent to a room with a TV to look at. So that kind of punishment we didn't get, but we had swings. We had a lot of shade trees. And we would swing in those swings sometimes until nine o'clock at night, until our mother or father told us we had to come in and go to bed. Well, we had about three swings out there, and we would swing on those and play, and play hide and go seek.

David Dollar (07:31): Let me ask you this. While you're talking, you mentioned the types of punishment that you didn't get. What happens if one of the kids kind of stepped out of line? What sort of things did your parents do to you as punishment?

Marie Smith (07:44): Well, I don't remember many, any of us getting too many whippings.

David Dollar (07:49): Oh really? That was really severe then.

Marie Smith (07:49): Yes.

David Dollar (07:49): You really had to do something bad.

Marie Smith (07:51): The last one we got, I remember, was we were romping in the house and our father told us to quit, and we didn't quit when he said. And he gave us a whipping for that. That was the last whipping that I remember [inaudible 00:08:06]-

David Dollar (08:05): And probably the last time you romped in the house too.

Marie Smith (08:07): Yes. Well, we had to mind. It was too many of us, and they had to have some system. Now, my mother said the older children, see 13 of them, and I come along around eleven-

David Dollar (08:19): There were 13 children in your family?

Marie Smith (08:20): Yes.

David Dollar (08:21): My goodness.

Marie Smith (08:22): So some of the older ones were gone. And my brother used to say that he never saw a star unless he woke up and looked out the window. Because mama had them all in the bed by six o'clock.

David Dollar (08:34): My goodness.

Marie Smith (08:35): So you had to have routine, and children had to mind. My father used to say that we weren't as good as the first ones because he got tired of worrying with us.

David Dollar (08:47): I bet that is really true. [crosstalk 00:08:49]

Marie Smith (08:49): But we had a good home. We enjoyed our parents, and we did things that we thought they wanted us to do. Now, once a year, my father took us to see our grandmother, lived on the other side of Carencro. The little houses are still there. And we had to cross on the ferry. That was like going to Europe, as far as we were concerned.

David Dollar (08:49): I'd bet it was, kind of scary.

Marie Smith (09:13): The red river was bank to bank then. And when we got to the river, they put their wagon and team on the ferry boat. We all got out in case some animal would get unruly or something. And crossing that river, ooh, those big waves. And we spent about two or three days with our grandmother. And then ,once a year, she came to see us. That's all we saw of grandmas. And, to me, she was almost a stranger. I respected her, but I don't know as-

David Dollar (09:48): You didn't know who she was.

Marie Smith (09:53): ... who she was. And I feared her, in a way, because when she came to see us, we had to all be on our best behavior. I don't know, but boy, I wasn't glad when she's gone.

David Dollar (10:01): I bet so. Well, I tell you what that was... you have really brought back a lot of memories for me, even, same sorts of things, playing with brothers and sisters and sort of standing back in awe and, like you said, very much respect to grandparents.

Marie Smith (10:18): Oh, yes. We even respected the old negros on the place. We really had a respect for old age. And we weren't allowed to talk ugly to them or anything.

David Dollar (10:27): Let me take this and turn what we're talking about right now. We had talked a little bit about... We like to try to end our program with a closing memory. What do you think about that today in terms of tying what we've talked about today in our show. Do you think the children that are growing up today have got the same sort of respect for not only age but position, like grandparents, maybe age in general? What do you think about that?

Marie Smith (10:27): I don't think so-

David Dollar (10:55): And where have we gotten away from this practice?

Marie Smith (10:57): I have a lot of grandchildren, and I have 29 great grandchildren. And I kind of pal with my grandchildren. I played with them and played cards and things. And we argue, but they love me. They weren't afraid of me, and I didn't want them to be.

David Dollar (11:15): Do you think it's that, by all the newfangled things, we've got transportation and telephones and all that, you are much closer to them than you-

Marie Smith (11:15): I am closer.

David Dollar (11:26): You see them more often.

Marie Smith (11:28): And you weren't allowed to talk when there was company. You had to be quiet. And I always said, if I got old enough we could talk, I was going to do my share.

David Dollar (11:38): Well, I tell you what we're mighty glad you joined with us today, sharing with us on this Memories program, Ms. Smith. We're glad to have you. If you keep making tapes like this, I'm sure we'll have you back on this-

Marie Smith (11:38): Oh, I can tell you about more.

David Dollar (11:55): I bet so. We thank you for joining with us today. If any of you-

Marie Smith (11:58): Well, I enjoyed it.

David Dollar speaks with Marie Smith about growing up in Natchitoches, and her school-year memories.

Tags: podcast, oral history, school, christmas traditions

December 11, 2025

48. George Kirkland

Transcript

Transcript

David Dollar: Good morning. I'm David Dollar and we're glad you're joining us on Memories. We're visiting down Cane River this morning with Mr. George Kirkland, and we'll be back to start our program in just a second, right after this message from our sponsor, People's Bank and Trust Company. Hello. In case you're just joining us, this is David Dollar on Memories, visiting down Cane River again with Mr. George Kirkland. Mr. Kirkland, why don't we start things off by you just giving us a little background about yourself, some family history and things like that.

George Kirkland: I was born September the 19th, 1903, down Cane River, Melrose, Louisiana. And I first went to school one day in our own yard. Then after that I went to school, that same school house, old school house, with a lady by the name of Juanita Dupree.

David Dollar: How old were you when you started school?

George Kirkland: I imagine I was about nine years old.

David Dollar: What did you do before then? I know we were talking earlier, you mentioned that y'all didn't go to school quite as young when you were growing up, as most of the kids do now, like at age what? About five or six, they begin at kindergarten or school. What were you doing around the house right before you started school?

George Kirkland: Well, I was helping with the crop and...

David Dollar: So your dad was farming?

George Kirkland: Yeah, my daddy was farming and I'd help him on the farm until we got a certain age.

David Dollar: Okay. Right. All right, tell me this, how did it come about that you got to go to school in your own yard that you were talking about?

George Kirkland: Well, my daddy built that school house with some of the neighbor people. John Ian-

David Dollar: Just got your own school together?

George Kirkland: ... And built that school house.

David Dollar: And who was the teacher.

George Kirkland: [inaudible 00:02:06] private.

David Dollar: Who was the teacher?

George Kirkland: Juanita Dupree taught school in there. And I went to school I believe one time and then one year, I'd say. And then after that I started school at St. Augustine, 2 miles-

David Dollar: You mentioned, I think, that your dad and the neighbors again had a little trouble with the private school that they started. What was the hassle?

George Kirkland: Yes. The first day they started school, the teacher from New Orleans, they wanted a public school and it had to be 24 miles from Natchitoches and it wasn't.

David Dollar: That was just the law, huh?

George Kirkland: Yeah. That was the law.

David Dollar: Natchitoches had a school and they didn't want any competition around out here.

George Kirkland: That's right. It was the law-

David Dollar: And so-

George Kirkland: ... That it had to be 24 miles.

David Dollar: Did somebody come and shut the school down?

George Kirkland: Yes.

David Dollar: Who would be in charge of that? I guess the sheriff, huh?

George Kirkland: Yes, I think so.

David Dollar: My goodness.

George Kirkland: Yeah.

David Dollar: So they didn't want you going to school?

George Kirkland: Well, they-

David Dollar: At least, not where you wanted to go to school.

George Kirkland: That's right, yeah. And they wasn't allowed to have that public school, you see? The state was going to pay for the school, but after that.

David Dollar: But you had to be outside a certain limit?

George Kirkland: Yes, 24 miles.

David Dollar: When we were talking about it first, it didn't register. There's so much talk about busing these days and busing is so bad. When you were growing up, they wanted to send you into Natchitoches. They didn't want you to have a school here by your own house. They were going to make you get into Natchitoches somehow and go to school. Seems like they've turned the tables just a little bit.

George Kirkland: Well, you see, at that time, we all had to get to the Catholic school up here at the church house, St. Augustine Church. See, we was too small. Now, when I started school up here, my daddy had to build a boat.

David Dollar: Had to build a boat?

George Kirkland: For me to cross the river. He had to cross me and put me on this side of the river. See, I live on the other side of the river.

David Dollar: I take it there wasn't a bridge down here then?

George Kirkland: No, there wasn't no bridge. See, he built a boat, a little boat, for me to across the river. And then I walked from down there, which is about two miles to the school house.

David Dollar: To the school.

George Kirkland: Yeah.

David Dollar: Take a boat across there in the morning.

George Kirkland: We had to take our own lunch, you know? I had a little bucket, see. And-

David Dollar: I guess that could be pretty rough on cold, wet days. You have to paddle a boat across Cane River and then walk down there to the school house.

George Kirkland: My daddy bought me a raincoat and a rain hat and boots.

David Dollar: My goodness, you were all decked out, huh?

George Kirkland: Yeah, and we had to bring our own lunch, you see. Whatever we had, which that wasn't much.

David Dollar: But all the children were probably in just about the same shape. Everybody had to bring their lunch.

George Kirkland: Or a little bit worse, yeah. Yeah, some were all ...

David Dollar: Let me interrupt you just a second. We're going to take a short commercial and we'll be back and talk a little bit more in just a second. We'll be right back with Mr. Kirkland right after this message from our sponsor, People's Bank and Trust Company. Okay. Mr. Kirkland. David Dollar, visiting again down Cane River with Mr. George Kirkland. In case you've just joined us, we were talking about growing up down here on a farm on Cane River. Let's skip a few years and talk about some other work that you did. You said you had worked doing some chores around the farm, picking cotton and such, and as well as working in a store around-

George Kirkland: Yeah.

David Dollar: Why don't we talk about some of the things. Economics is big on everybody's mind now, why don't we talk about some of the things you mentioned that you carried in your store there and what they cost when you were working in the store there.

George Kirkland: Well, at one time I was waiting in the store, they were selling meat, dry salt meat for 3 cents a pound.

David Dollar: I can't believe that.

George Kirkland: And we was buying pecans for 3 cents, three and a half cents.

David Dollar: My goodness. And bologna costs about $2 a pound today. Think about it.

George Kirkland: And we picked pecans. We had a lot of pecans grow and we picked on the end of week, on a Saturday, we would haul the pecans down to the store and about maybe 2 or 3000 pounds of pecans, three and a half cents a pound.

David Dollar: You picked that many pecans?

George Kirkland: Yes. My brother, the family.

David Dollar: The whole family get together. I can understand that, but boy, that's a lot.

George Kirkland: And we'd get together and [inaudible 00:07:29] Severan, he would haul the pecans one Saturday and we would haul them one Saturday.

David Dollar: Taking turns.

George Kirkland: Yeah, taking turns.

David Dollar: How did you get them to town?

George Kirkland: We hauled them down to the store, to Nate's store, to the corner store, right below, about a quarter of a mile below where we lived. We didn't haul them to town.

David Dollar: Okay. So all the transactions took place down there at the store, huh?

George Kirkland: And he, in turn, he would haul them to Derry to the station, load them on boxcars. We had to haul all those pecans. We'd load 13 carloads-

David Dollar: Of pecans?

George Kirkland: One seat.

David Dollar: My goodness. I can't imagine. 13 boxcar loads of pecans.

George Kirkland: Yes.

David Dollar: That's a bunch.

George Kirkland: Yeah. By hand too. Load them on a truck.

David Dollar: Oh my goodness.

George Kirkland: Yeah.

David Dollar: That sounds like some sore fingers to me-

George Kirkland: So we had-

David Dollar: And tired backs.

George Kirkland: And we had sugarcane. We growed sugarcanes for the year and we'd pick pecan, and we stripped cane, sugarcane, cut them down, haul them to mill. We had our own mill, and we had our own furnace, and my brother used to cook the syrup and we'd make about 4 or 500 gallons of syrup. We'd sell the syrup. I used to haul syrup to Derry Sawmill and sell it. And vegetables.

David Dollar: So the family wasn't involved just in cotton, one thing?

George Kirkland: No.

David Dollar: They just had to do a little bit of everything all year round.

George Kirkland: Yeah.

David Dollar: Different seasons brought you different kinds of work.

George Kirkland: Yes, that's right. Yeah.

David Dollar: Tell me, before we run out of time, about one time that your dad caught you doing something you shouldn't have been doing. I got a kick out of this.

George Kirkland: Well, I was in the kitchen with my mother and I was smoking a cigarette and I heard my daddy coming, so I threw the cigarette out the window. And when he got to the door and I saw the motion he made, I know he was going to get a hold of me. And I jumped through the window and my mother got after him [inaudible 00:09:55] and said he oughtn't to do that because he could have caused me to break my arm on my leg, see? And that's the...

David Dollar: They got it on the package today that smoking can be hazardous to your health, but so can jumping out of windows if your daddy's after you.

George Kirkland: Yeah, I guess so.

David Dollar: We like to try to close the programs on Memories with what we call our closing memory. Why don't you share with us what your mom and dad told you about, about going to school and...

George Kirkland: Well, Mama, I had to get up early in the wintertime especially, to walk that about two miles across the river, you see. And Mama used to get up and fix my lunch and she'd fix well, whatever we had. I used to carry a lot of syrup to school, put the syrup in a bottle, see? And it served like, I say, a whiskey, put it in my back pocket.

David Dollar: You played like it was whiskey?

George Kirkland: Yeah. Yeah. And...

David Dollar: What did they tell you about going to school and church or something? Didn't they say that...

George Kirkland: Yes. My daddy told me for whatever I do, to learn arithmetic. He'd say, "When you know how to figure, you can keep people from beating you."

David Dollar: I guess you can. I guess you can.

George Kirkland: And my mother used to dress me up on Sunday morning. I dressed myself, but she'd see that my face and everything was all right-

David Dollar: Everything just right-

George Kirkland: ... And clean. Yeah, just right.

David Dollar: Just like mothers always do.

George Kirkland: Yeah, that's right. And so, I'd leave and she'd say, "Be careful when you cross that river." And my brother, the oldest brother, they would put me across the river and they would go to church too and see, we'd be a bunch going to church and a Sunday evening we went to Catechism. And Sunday evening we went to Catechism to perform.

David Dollar: Let me ask you this, just as one who used to be a little boy to another who used to be a little boy, did you ever try to get out of going to church and school? Did you ever try to play sick or something? Didn't your folks have a remedy for that though?

George Kirkland: Yes. I used to play sick and wouldn't want to go to school, but my daddy would give me some medicine.

David Dollar: What kind of medicine would he give you?

George Kirkland: Castor oil.

David Dollar: Castor oil? And so you stayed well all the time.

George Kirkland: I stayed well, pretty much all the time.

David Dollar: Because you didn't want to take it.

George Kirkland: I didn't want to take that castor oil.

David Dollar: Well, Mr. Kirkland, we thank you for having us in your home today. We appreciate you sharing these memories with us. If any of you folks at home have any memories you'd like to share, we would like for you to share them with us. We'd like for you to get in touch with the Retired Senior Volunteer Program office. Their number is 352-8647. The telephone is ringing and if you hear any other noises in the background, like a little crackling, we're in front of a nice warm fire down here and it's raining and cold outside. We are able to come in your house now. But right now, it's warm and nice and everything's fine. We thank you for joining us on Memories today down Cane River with Mr. George Kirkland. Y'all have a nice day.

David Dollar interviews George Kirkland about taking a boat to school, working in a store, shelling pecans, growing sugarcane and cotton, jumping through windows, and avoiding castor oil.

Tags: podcast, oral history, pecans, school

November 27, 2025

47. Fanner Rochelle

Transcript

Transcript

Hubert Laster: This morning on the Memories program we're going to be visiting with Mr. Fanner Rochelle. We'll be back in just a moment after a word from our sponsors. Bon matin, that's "Good morning." This morning we're going to be visiting with Mr. Fanner Rochelle. Well, tell me about when you were born and how you were raised.

Fanner Rochelle: Well, it was October the 4th, that was my birthday. The year was '80 or '81.

Hubert Laster: Well you go back a ways then, don't you? How was it like? What was it like when you were growing up as a boy?

Fanner Rochelle: Oh, planted pecan trees, lots of pecan trees. Lots of good crop, cotton and corn. And people wouldn't hardly never go to get a doctor, and bring [inaudible 00:01:12] people. They would make the medicine over at home themself. Take an ax and a sack and go along the hill and pick a little root, little stuff, and come and boil and put that in jar. Strain it good, put that in jar, for medicine.

Hubert Laster: What kind of root? Do you know how to make that medicine?

Fanner Rochelle: Well, my father used to. Plus me, I never was close to that, that I can tell you how was it start to make it. But my daddy could make it. He died young. Him died 62. 62 or 63, my daddy.

Hubert Laster: Now, y'all planted pecan trees, raised cotton, corn. Where were you brought up at, in Akedish Parish?

Fanner Rochelle: Uh-huh. Mr. Alphonse Prudem's plantation [inaudible 00:02:22]. There by Mr. Alcanon Eugene, on that bayou there, about a mile and a quarter, over on the right-hand side though.

Hubert Laster: So y'all worked for him?

Fanner Rochelle: We worked for ourselves, but we was given rents.

Hubert Laster: I see. Now, Mr. Prudem owned the land, and you rented from him?

Fanner Rochelle: Uh-huh.

Hubert Laster: So how much did you give Mr. Prudem of the crop?

Fanner Rochelle: Of the crop?

Hubert Laster: How much did you keep out of every bushel?

Fanner Rochelle: Oh, like corn and cotton?

Hubert Laster: Mm-hmm.

Fanner Rochelle: Every [inaudible 00:03:08] of corn, he got one, I got three. Every full bale of cotton, I got three, and there's one of them go to him.

Hubert Laster: I see.

Fanner Rochelle: That was, what you call it, a fort.

Hubert Laster: The fort? Share-cropping?

Fanner Rochelle: Yeah.

Hubert Laster: I never heard it called the fort before.

Fanner Rochelle: No sir? No?

Hubert Laster: No. Never have heard that before.

Fanner Rochelle: All my life.

Hubert Laster: And you lived out on the bayou.

Fanner Rochelle: Oh, yeah, I was living at Montrol by 23 years, right on Paul Johnson's place. Sometime we were sending rent from the company. Sometime we was giving, let's say $50, sending rent this year. Some year, it was $70. Some year, it might have been maybe $80. Some year, it's come pretty close to 100, $80, but come [inaudible 00:04:20] pretty close to 100 after a while.

Hubert Laster: I see. Now, when'd you quit sharecropping? How long ago?

Fanner Rochelle: 45.

Hubert Laster: 45 years? What'd you do after that, after you quit sharecropping?

Fanner Rochelle: Mama got on, a little bit on relief and I got a little bit on relief. And I had to [inaudible 00:04:57], if it wouldn't hurt me if I would get a little job, like to go cut some weeds for a living, for a man and pick it up, take it out the way for him. I'll go work on a little crib, on a little ranch home, on a little fence, piece of fence like that. She say, "No, go ahead." And I got that chance to make that little bit too. And I was on the relief and mama was on the relief, you see.

Hubert Laster: Okay. Now, you were talking about working in a sawmill, you used to do that.

Fanner Rochelle: And no money to it, no money to it. There was no money. I'd truck along by, me and my daddy, from 6:00 to 6:00, maybe for less than $1.40.

Hubert Laster: $1.40 what? A board foot or what?

Fanner Rochelle: A day.

Hubert Laster: A deal?

Fanner Rochelle: Chucking lumber from the mill. They wouldn't pay nothing in them time.

Hubert Laster: $1.40, what is it, a load or a day?

Fanner Rochelle: No, a day.

Hubert Laster: Oh, a day.

Fanner Rochelle: A day. They wouldn't hardly pay us nothing.

Hubert Laster: How many hours a day did you work?

Fanner Rochelle: About, let's see, from 6:00 to 6:00.

Hubert Laster: Five days a week?

Fanner Rochelle: Uh-uh. Oh, yeah, about five and a half.

Hubert Laster: Five and a half days a week.

Fanner Rochelle: Days a week. It was poor, poorly. And I had to buy my [inaudible 00:06:53], buy my soda, buy my salt, buy me a little piece of meat, buy my sugar, buy my coffee, buy my lard.

Hubert Laster: We need to take a break right now and we'll be back in just a moment. If you've just joined us, we're visiting with Mr. Fanner Rochelle, and right now, did you ever get married?

Fanner Rochelle: No, sir, raise my right hand to God. I never have got married.

Hubert Laster: Never have gotten married.

Fanner Rochelle: Uh-uh.

Hubert Laster: Why?

Fanner Rochelle: Well, I say, maybe I get married, it'd be a hard feeling between me and her, and I say, "I'm not going to do that." I don't want to have a hard feeling against you and you don't want to have no hard feeling against me to hurt me. I say, "I'm not going to marry."

Hubert Laster: So, you never did?

Fanner Rochelle: No.

Hubert Laster: Well, being an old confirmed bachelor then, I bet you have a lot of recipes in your head. Weren't you telling me something about blackbird gumbo?

Fanner Rochelle: Blackbird gumbo.

Hubert Laster: Blackbird gumbo. How do you make blackbird gumbo?

Fanner Rochelle: Well, after you've got them all cleaned and gut up and all clean, I kind of scotched them on the wire. I washed them good, good, good. Let them dry a little bit. Put a little lard in it, just so that it wouldn't burn. Let them sit with a little flour bread, flour bread. Till it gets kind of roast a little bit. Then I get me some water, about a half boil, I put it in there. Not no cold water. Water half boiled, in there, and let them boil till 12:00.

Hubert Laster: Now, what time did you start?

Fanner Rochelle: In the morning.

Hubert Laster: Okay. You let them boil till 12:00. All right, I've got all this. Now, keep going.

Fanner Rochelle: Then I have to have my good gumbo to make my filé, filé gumbo. It all worked in bottle, put in bottle from the hill. We do that and dry up to the [inaudible 00:09:35] them leaf and grind them up. We chop them down good, good, and fine, and put them in a bottle.

Hubert Laster: What kind of leaves?

Fanner Rochelle: Gumbo.

Hubert Laster: Gumbo leaves?

Fanner Rochelle: Gumbo leaves. You get them off of trees. Let's see. [foreign language 00:09:56] is a...

Hubert Laster: Little gumbo and big gumbo.

Fanner Rochelle: You got to dig to pick the little gumbo and you got to dig to pick the big gumbo, the large gumbo.

Hubert Laster: So, making a filé gumbo, and we got the blackbirds cooked, so what happens now?

Fanner Rochelle: Now, I cook me some rice and I cook me some sweet potato, bake some sweet potato, and make me some cornbread, and sit down at 12:00 and dig it out.

Hubert Laster: And that's how you cook it, huh? Okay, good enough. What is the best way to cook deer, bake it? How do you bake it?

Fanner Rochelle: Just cook it a long time in the stove.

Hubert Laster: That's after you butcher it.

Fanner Rochelle: Yeah.

Hubert Laster: For a minute there, I thought you were talking about you were going to cook the whole deer.

Fanner Rochelle: No.

Hubert Laster: How did you preserve your meat? You couldn't eat a whole deer by yourself, so how did-

Fanner Rochelle: Oh, we'd freeze them. Yeah, we bought a whole deer, me and my boss man. I don't know how much we had to pay.

Hubert Laster: But pork is your favorite.

Fanner Rochelle: Oh, yeah.

Hubert Laster: What's your favorite way to cook pork?

Fanner Rochelle: Roast.

Hubert Laster: Roast it?

Fanner Rochelle: Yes.

Hubert Laster: Over an open fire?

Fanner Rochelle: Yes. Kind of slow.

Hubert Laster: Hickory smoke?

Fanner Rochelle: No, on the stove, just slow. Slow cooked though.

Hubert Laster: Slow cook on the stove.

Fanner Rochelle: Slow cook on the stove.

Hubert Laster: Well, we've enjoyed visiting with you, but it's time to go, so I'll see you some other time, okay?

Fanner Rochelle: Uh-huh.

Hubert Laster: 352-8647 is the number to call if you have memories to share for us. That is a retired seniors volunteer program. This is Hubert Laster and Mr. Fanner Rochelle wishing you all a very pleasant good day.

Hubert Laster interviews Fanner Rochelle about growing up in Natchitoches, sharecropping, working in a sawmill, and his recipe for Blackbird Gumbo.

Tags: podcast, oral history interview, natchitoches, sharecropping, sawmill, gumbo

October 30, 2025

46. Freeborn Holland pt. 2

Transcript

Transcript

Hubert Laster: Good morning. This morning on the Memories program, we're going to have a follow-up visit with Mr. Freeborn Holland.

Freeborn Holland: Freeborn.

Hubert Laster: Freeborn Holland. We'll be back in just a moment. If you listened to the program last time, Mr. Freeborn Holland was recalling his World War I experiences. This morning, he's going to talk about hard times and growing up in Dry Creek, and it should be very interesting.

Freeborn Holland: Well, I was about six years old when my daddy moved off of Dry Creek up here in the South Mill Community. He bought 120 acres of land and traded the 40 acres that he had there on that land and raised cotton, five cents a pound, some of it sometimes three, to finish paying that place. But it didn't cost all that much like one would now. But, anyhow. He lived and raised cotton and a living on the farm and paid for that place, 120 acres. And I'm living on 40 acres of it at the time now.

But, anyhow. After we moved there, I had a hard time. All of us did. But we had plenty to eat, and we had a good time. We could play, play ball, swim, play bass, and ever such as that. [inaudible 00:01:56] all the playing we had back there then. We could dance, old country dancing, such as that. And we went on, and we had so long a time. Then one of my brothers got oxen up and broke them. My daddy would sell them to the railroad to haul logs with. And sometimes sell cattle to the cattle buyer who'd still come through once in a while. And cattle sold, as a general rule, for six and seven dollars a head at auction after they was broke. Best ones I [inaudible 00:02:51] to the railroad, got $14 a piece for them.

Hubert Laster: That was a good price?

Freeborn Holland: Oh, yeah. At that time. But I sure did hate to see them go, because me and my brother could ride them. We could set up on them sideways and go anywheres in the woods and haul out whatever we wanted to, whatever they could pull. And we didn't have to keep ropes on them. They drove good. We could drive that wagon thick through trees where the thimbles would sack the trees a little, go right along.

Hubert Laster: Now, how long did it take to train an oxen?

Freeborn Holland: Well, not too long. But we didn't try to train them the way the old n*****, Luce Mills, they called him, trained them. He didn't handle them like we did. We put the yolks on them and tied the tails together so they couldn't turn the yolk, put ropes on them, then went to working them. After a day or two, we had them minding us, doing what we wanted them to do. We fed them some with the yolk on. That old guy Luce Mills put the yolks on them and tied the tails together and turned them loose in his pasture a day or two. And whenever they'd get so aggravated with them yolks, they'd come up where they was put on them at. He'd feed them, feed them with a yolk on. And then after a day or two, he'd go working them. Wouldn't take him but a few days. They'd be broke.

Well, it went on, and just before I come grown, I told my daddy that I's going to hang on with him ‘til I was 21 years old and then I's going and getting me a job, and if I could make enough, I'd still help him. But I wanted to buy me a place and settle down and make my own living and he agreed. And we went that year to Robeline and sold two bales of cotton, and he finished paying his debt, what he owed them, and he had $5 left, and he forced me to take it, had never had nothing to give me. And I says I didn't want to. I wanted him to keep it for the others. But I took it. He told me to go buy me some better clothes than what I had. And I went down there to a store, dry goods store, and bought me a nice pair of pants and a coat and a pair of shoes and a hat, and I had six bits left out of that $5. Now, that's truth. [inaudible 00:05:58].

Hubert Laster: I believe you.

Freeborn Holland: And I want to know what it'd cost him now. If you go and buy clothes like that now, would you pay $150 or $200 for them. Which would it be?

Hubert Laster: It depends on what the quality of the merchandise is.

Freeborn Holland: But then, it wasn't a suit. Just the same color. But they was tailor-made clothes. It was a nice pair of pants and a nice coat.

Hubert Laster: Tailor-made?

Freeborn Holland: Yeah. But separate colors. The pants was a blue striped, and the coat was a solid blue.

Hubert Laster: I would imagine, for a tailor-made suit, a minimum of about $200.

Freeborn Holland: Yeah. Well, anyhow. Well, I was about 13 years old now. He was buying stuff on credit to make the crop, and he's buying from Stille and Yarbrough in Robeline. And this is another thing I'll never forget. He had all the rest of them, the oldest ones, he had them in the field at work. Had a lot of grass and a lot of work to do. And he yoked up the oxen one morning before daylight and told me to take that order to Robeline and have Stille and Yarbrough to fill it. And I went up there in the ox wagon 18 miles from home and give them that order. And he put on that order a piece of bacon and didn't say how much, nothing about it. Just a piece of bacon. And Stille and Yarbrough took me in the war room, and they had a table about four-foot wide and about 10-foot long. And it was piled way up about three or four foot high with big old cured middlins and hams and shoulders.

And he went and got him a big old piece of wrap paper and pulled a big old thick middlin that was about around close to three-foot long and over two-foot wide, about five or six inches thick, had two streaks of lean in it. And he rolled that up in that big paper and told me, he says, "Boy, can you put that on the wagon?" And I told him, "I guess so." And he said, "Well, go put it on the wagon." I said, "You ain't going to weigh it?" He says, "I know just about what it weighs. That's all right." And I took it and put it on the wagon, and it was heavy. And whenever I went in, he charged 10 percent interest, but he put it on the bill right there. There wasn't anything added to it. When you got ready to pay it, that's what you paid. The 10 percent is added right there on the dollar. And whenever we got that bill and looked at it, that piece of bacon, that middlin to bacon cost him $1.65, 10 percent interest. Now, I'm going to-

Hubert Laster: We need to take a break right now, and we'll be back in just a moment.

If you've just joined us, we're visiting with Mr. Freeborn Holland this morning, and he's going to finish off the program this morning with the way it used to be in the woods. How many wild things were you able to eat?

Freeborn Holland: We was able to eat turkeys and deer, rabbits, coons and possums and squirrels. And there was a lot of turkeys. Of course, I was the middle. They eventually thinned them out of clearing up the land and coming in farming, different homesteading places and such as that, and cleaned them up, and they eventually killed the turkey. Then there wasn't hardly wasn't very many. But I can remember when I was big enough to go hunting, going with my oldest brother one morning. He knowed where there was a bunch of them roosting in a big old tree. And that was on the place we called Rye Creek, that we'd done moved away from there, that we went back over there before daylight and got in the bushes and hid under that old tree. And it was black with turkeys all over up there. And he just had a single-barrel shotgun, and he loaded and shot it there shooting them turkey three times, and that ground was just loaded around there with turkeys falling.

And of course, we had a good dog with us, but he had just broke the wings or crippled them some. He didn't get a one. The other one got away from us. And they got away from that dog.

Hubert Laster: What about the ... You used to tell me about pawpaws that used be in the woods.

Freeborn Holland: Pawpaws was more like a banana. They growed on big bushes, had big wide, pretty leaves, more like a sycamore leaf. Not exactly but more like that. They wasn't a straight, long leave. They was wide. And them things growed ‘til they got five and six and seven and eight inches long. They'd get full grown, then they'd ripen. They got ripe, they turned yellow. They looked like a banana and peeled like a banana, and in fact, they'd just eat like one. But they wasn't called a banana. They was a wild pawpaw. And we'd eat lots of them, and they was good. And then the blackberries in the country then, some of them was right around two inches long. Just as big and pretty as you ever looked at, especially in Round Bottoms. And mayhaws, the Bottoms had them all about. And chinquapins, there's just a whole lot of them all up and down the side of the hills. Even on our place.

Hubert Laster: Now, what is a chinquapin?

Freeborn Holland: It's a little thing that makes, and it's got a big kernel in it. You'd take the hull off of it, and it's a great big kernel in there about so big. Don't take but two or three of them to get peeled before you got a mouthful. And they're good. They turn red when they get ripe, so you'd eat them, then they got a hull over them, like a pecan sort of. That hull spreads out, berry's out then, and it sheds off. And of course, they eventually fall. Then we'd take that hull back and pick them off the tree a whole lot. I picked as much as a five-pound bucket full right over here on this place that was mine, right over here on the butt of that big hill under just a few trees there. A time or two, I was fine just to pick me a bucket full of them.

And now them things, now there was a hickory nut. It was called a scaly bark hickory nut. And I can remember going down here in the Bottoms whenever I was a boy where there were five big scaly bark hickory nut trees in the summertime, and took me a stick, sat down betwixt two big roots there, and raked them up close to me. And I could bust them with my teeth. Just sat there and eat me a bit of hickory nuts. That's the best kernels I ever eat, scaly bark hickory nut. And there's big hogs walking around there. They'd pick up one and bust it and eat it once in a while and go on. And they's fat.

Hubert Laster: Well, we've enjoyed visiting with you, but now we have to go. If you have memories that you would like to share with us, would you please call the Retired Seniors Volunteer Program? That number is 352-8647. This is Hubert Laster wishing all of you a very pleasant good day.

In a follow up interview by Hubert Laster, Freeborn Holland discusses growing up in Dry Creek, raising cattle, training oxen, hunting, and harvesting food in the woods.

Tags: oxen, farming, cattle, hunting, dry creek, ncptt, memories, podcast

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