Memories (U.S. National Park Service)

Episodes

November 21, 2022

11. C.E. Dugdale

Transcript

David: Good morning Dr. Dugdale, good to have you here with us. Why don't you start us off today by telling us a little bit about yourself, your background. C.E. Dugdale: Thank you very much, David. Well, I'm a native of Louisiana. I was born and reared in a little village of Sibley, north of Choudrant, Louisiana and I don't know whether people know where Choudrant is. And I was born in 1897 on a farm near Camp Alabama. My father was English from sunny Devon. He came to this place over there. He had a brother and two uncles in this country and he bought some land there in the, on a hill farm. He paid $2 and 50 cents an acre for it. About 10 years ago, a sister of mine sold some of that land for $250 an acre. And I thought she didn't get enough at that time. We were on a small farm ,north Louisiana farm, hill farm, and the going was a little rough in those days. My memories of course are school and church primarily. They were the centers of our life. And I started a school when I was five years old. At the end of that year, the teacher very unadvisedly promoted me to the third grade. The next year, there was a new teacher there who demoted me to the second grade, very much to my disappointment. I attended this rural school, it was a two room school until the high school was established in Choudrant. And I was in the second graduating class of the Choudrant High School, 1916. And at that time, since the school here, the state normal [inaudible 00:02:03] was considered the teacher training institution in the state. I enrolled here because I intended to become a teacher. I remember I had a cousin, Velma O'Neal who was here at the same time. And on Friday evening, we had a picture show in the auditorium on the second floor of Caldwell hall. Well, Velma and I went together to this picture show and I sat with Velma. There was some 50, a hundred girls. I mean, men and the rest were girls. And I was there talking with Velma and somebody tapped on the shoulder. It was the Dean of Women informing me that men and women did not sit together at the picture shows at the normal school. And I had to get up and move down with the 20 or 30 men who were there at this show. Oh, this was in 1916 that I came to the state normal. And after I graduated, of course, it became a college very shortly thereafter. I was in about the second graduating class with a degree here from this school. And then I became a high school principal and was served in that capacity for several years. And every time, every summer during that period, I was given a position at the normal college. Mr. Royal was a good friend of mine, a very dear friend whom I remember with a great deal of pleasure and joy. He gave me a position every summer and I taught here and it was during the summer of 1926 I was teaching here that I became ill and had surgery. And of course there's a rather sad story. After that surgery, I was ill for a number of years and I was in the veteran's hospital. And of course I, that means that I had spent some time in the service during World War One. I would never have been drafted because I was a little too young to be drafted at that time, but I did volunteer and got in just for a little while. And the federal government of course had veterans hospitals for people in my situation. And it was my misfortune to be at a veterans hospital for some time. But I am very thankful that there was initiatives of that kind to take care of such people. David: That's true. C.E. Dugdale: Well after I got out of the hospital, was discharged in 1930, I decided that graduate work was in store for me. It was the best course I could follow. And I went to the University of Texas and registered at the Stephen F. Austin Hotel. And about one o'clock that night, I was seriously ill, called for a doctor. And the result was that I never got to register. I had to come home and lost a whole semester and went back at midyear. Well, I intended to register in Mathematics to do graduate work in Mathematics. It happens that at midyear, there was not a single graduate course available for me. And there I was, had already lost a semester and now could not get graduate Mathematics that I needed for the second semester and you could imagine how disappointed I was. And there I was talking about my disappointments, not being able to get the Mathematics and a Dean who was listening nearby said, by the way, I noticed that you were qualified in English. What about studying English? And I said, "am I"? I had no idea I was. And he talked me into that. And he said, you can get back into Mathematics if you don't find this interesting. But I got some of the best men that I've ever met in my life as teachers, Dr. Calloway, Dr. Law, Dr. Griffith. And I continued in English until I got my Master's. And then I was asked whether I would continue for my Doctorate. And I said, yes. And I was given a position as teacher there while I got my Doctorate and incidentally, I took Mathematics as a minor. And one of the finest men in Mathematics with international reputation, Professor Van Den Bergh was talking to me. I'd had courses with him ever since I had been there, and he asked me whether I would continue for my Doctorate. And I told him yes. And he volunteered to give me a position in Mathematics if I wished to continue my doctorate. Well, I had just accepted one in English. And though mathematics was my first love, I have never regretted getting into English and I have thoroughly enjoyed teaching it ever since I talked there for 10 years while I was getting my Doctorate. And incidentally, when my father, when I graduated, got my doctorate, he came down to Austin and my mother and father and a friend of his was talking with him, Mr. Lindsay and father said "well, I'm going to Austin, Texas. My son is graduating". Mr. Lindsay said, "my heaven is that boy still going to school"? So I could understand that I went to school much of the time until I was about 40 years old, you see. David: How did you come about coming back to [inaudible 00:07:52] C.E. Dugdale: I came to Southwestern in Lafayette and taught there for a year and the Principle here, I mean, the President here at the college, a good friend of mine, Joe Farah came down and asked our President whether he would release me to take the headship of the department of languages up here. I didn't see Joe Farah on his visit down, I didn't know he had come, but our President down there called me in shortly after and assured me that he would release me if I cared to go. And after all the transactions I finally got here, mainly because I know the people here, I had many friends in this area and I knew that I would enjoy living in [inaudible 00:08:35] and I certainly have enjoyed it. David: What are some of the things that you did, say, you said you were growing up around Sibley. I'm a little bit familiar with that area around camp Alabama it means a lot, especially, I guess, us Presbyterians. C.E. Dugdale: Yes. David: But what are some of the things you did around there growing up? Did you, were you able to fish or hunt or- C.E. Dugdale: oh yes. David: Were you much taken up with farm duties? C.E. Dugdale: Well, I certainly did that. It was a very busy time. We were all very busy, but my mother and father enjoyed fishing, though he was an Englishman. My mother was reared and her father enjoyed fishing. I used to go fishing with my granddad a great deal. Of course it was on a local stream and we fished with cane poles and caught Catfish and Brim mainly, sometimes Bass, but principally Brim and Catfish. And we thoroughly enjoyed those fish fries that we would have, community would join very frequently in fish fries. And we always were confident enough to be dependent. We depend upon catching the fish. And as I recall, we always did. David: Still doing that to an extent [crosstalk 00:09:49] C.E. Dugdale: Oh, yes I am. But we have a camp out on Celine. It really belongs to my sister and brother-in-law, but we use it 10 times more than they do and we thoroughly enjoy it. David: Well Dr. Doug, we really want to thank you for joining us on memories today. C.E. Dugdale: It's a very great pleasure to meet you, David.

Dr. C.E. Dugdale: Born in 1897 on a farm. His father was English and brought some land. He primarily remembers school and church as the main focus of his life. He intended to become a teacher, worked at Normal College every summer. Earned his doctorate in English.

November 28, 2022

12. Carmen Breazeale

Transcript

David Dollar: Hello, once again. In case you've just joined us, David Dollar today on Memories, visiting with Ms. Carmen Breazeale. Ms. Breazale, we thank you for your taking time out and visiting with us today. Carmen Breazeale: I'm very glad to do it, and particularly nice since you could come up to the office. David Dollar: Well good. And it's no problem at all. Glad to. Why don't we start things off like we normally do, by you giving us a little family background and all. Where you come from. Carmen Breazeale: Well, [inaudible 00:00:24] 87 years old. David Dollar: 87. My goodness. Carmen Breazeale: And members of my family, on my father's side of the family, been in Natchitoches since 1716. David Dollar: My goodness. Carmen Breazeale: First stock, anybody that's from around here was sent from France to be positioned for St. Denis and his wife at the fort, St. Jean Baptiste. And at present time, the 8th generation of the family is living in Oakland, the family home, my paternal grandmother's. David Dollar: My goodness. Carmen Breazeale: I've lived here always. David Dollar: Sounds like all the Breazeales have, huh? Everybody is around. Goodness. Carmen Breazeale: And I was asked the other day how long I had been connected in any way with the Red Cross. I'm the executive secretary of the parish chapter now. I started doing volunteer work in 1914, with the Red Cross, and kept it up until about 1957, just volunteer work. I served as chapter chairman. And I was very fortunate in having recognition in the Southeastern area, and also committees from the national organization. David Dollar: Nice. You were born on Oakland here? Carmen Breazeale: No, my grandma. David Dollar: Your grandmother was. Carmen Breazeale: My paternal ... No, I was around here in town. And I was born in the home of our present mayor. New mayor, Tom [inaudible 00:01:49] home, which was an old family home. And my mother and father lived there when they were first married. David Dollar: What were your parents doing at the time? Carmen Breazeale: My father had just started the Natchitoches Enterprise. He had started doing it for the, fight the Louisiana Lottery Law, which he didn't approve of. He also had a plantation. He had held quite a few public offices. And he had been superintendent of schools and different things of that kind. And my mother, who had been born and raised in ... Born in New Orleans. She wasn't raised there, because her parents died when she was very young. And she came to live with an older married sister. And the interesting thing, that a lot of people are interested in, she started school at the old Sacred Heart Convent here. Then she went over to Mansfield Female College. And from there she went to a school in Kentucky, that was particularly a music school, because she was [inaudible 00:02:44]. And at the age of 17, she had her masters degree. David Dollar: My goodness. Sounds like she had a busy life. Carmen Breazeale: She did have a very busy life. David Dollar: Very productive. Carmen Breazeale: Particularly very busy life, because my father died very young, and left my mother widowed with four children. And the oldest one was not seven years old when he died. David Dollar: She was busy even after she got her masters. Golly, gee. Carmen Breazeale: And as in those days, ladies didn't work. David Dollar: Of course. Carmen Breazeale: But she, very much, at first, to the family's distress, she took over the newspaper, the business. And ran it by herself until 1913. And in 1913, I had graduated from Northwestern [inaudible 00:03:25] in 1907. And I taught four years at the state, and then I taught two years at [inaudible 00:03:33] at what they call the model school, in those days. David Dollar: We had a model school here? Carmen Breazeale: Instead of the training school, they called it the model school. David Dollar: Model school. Carmen Breazeale: Because it was a model school for training teachers. David Dollar: I see. Carmen Breazeale: And I taught up there for a couple of years. And then in 1913, went down in the [inaudible 00:03:50] 1913, and took over the ... David Dollar: The newspaper. Carmen Breazeale: Running the office, the business, and [inaudible 00:03:55], and just the whole thing. David Dollar: I want to ask you. One thing you brought up. Was that the lottery law you were talking about? Carmen Breazeale: The Louisiana Lottery Law. My father did ... I don't know too much about it. David Dollar: Tell me about that a little. I never knew we had a- Carmen Breazeale: They had a lottery law there, and he didn't approve of it at all. David Dollar: I never knew we had [crosstalk 00:04:09]. Carmen Breazeale: Now, there had been several papers before that in Natchitoches. There's quite a good many interesting things about that. But he took over and published the Natchitoches Enterprise. And [crosstalk 00:04:21]- David Dollar: Was he successful in getting the lottery law stopped? Carmen Breazeale: Yes, they changed a good many of the laws right there and then. I don't know enough about it, because that was before I was born. David Dollar: Mm-hmm (affirmative). That's right. Carmen Breazeale: It was a year before I was born. David Dollar: Yeah, that's a little early I suppose. Carmen Breazeale: Then, he had just run the paper about four years when he died. And I stayed at the office, due to my mother's ill health. In 1951, I sold the paper, and I went up to the Chamber of Commerce for secretary manager of it. So my whole life, practically, has been doing things in public. And the nice thing about it is things that I liked and enjoyed doing. David Dollar: That's great. Sounds good. Carmen Breazeale: I had the privilege of being the president, for the nine years of its existence, of what we called the Community Welfare League. And the first thing we did, and [inaudible 00:05:10] was kind of interested in this, was we, the river bank on the East side of the river, they allowed any and all kinds of billboards and advertisements put up. And when you get to Front Street, the first thing you saw was a billboard advertising Bull Durham tobacco. I was president, and Mrs. Henry Jordan was secretary treasurer. And we went before the city council, with one or two others of our members, and got them to pass an ordinance prohibiting billboards on the river bank. Which was really one of the first things we done to beautify Natchitoches and the river bank. David Dollar: [crosstalk 00:05:50] Carmen Breazeale: And that was one of the things I've always treasured in having a part in. And I also am a charter member of the Historic Association. David Dollar: I guess you should be with the family background that you've got. Carmen Breazeale: I also had the privilege. I've been an officer ever since it started. I started out being secretary, and then treasurer, and then I was president for eight years, and I've been first vice president ever since. And one of the most interesting things I do in connection with the Historical Association is I do the publicity [inaudible 00:06:26] publicity for that. David Dollar: That sounds great. I tell you what. I want to get back to this in just a second. We need to take a little commercial right here. I want to talk some more about the historical side of Natchitoches, though. David Dollar and Ms. Carmen Breazeale today on Memories. We'll be right back after a message from our sponsor, People's Bank and Trust Company. Hello, once again. In case you're just joining us, David Dollar visiting with Ms. Carmen Breazeale today. She's had a busy life, and a busy family, going back, I think you said, in Natchitoches, all the way to about 1716, right? Sounds like you've got your roots pretty firmly planted here. Carmen Breazeale: He was the first, it was Jean-Pierre Prudhomme, and he was the first doctor ever sent over here. He had been a doctor to the king, and he was sent over by the king of France to help St. Denis. He was given this large tract of land, and Oakland Plantation is the family home. And is under eight generations. One of the things that interested me so much is we have so many of the instruments that he brought over from France. David Dollar: You still have those? Carmen Breazeale: They're down in the museum, in Oakland Plantation. David Dollar: Wow. I'll be. Carmen Breazeale: And one of them is an electric contraption for giving the shock treatment for mental cases. The inside of the little oblong box [inaudible 00:07:52] is a little silver plate, with engraved on it what it is to be used for. And when I was quite young, they still had the wires extending from the side, and you could grasp the little handles, where they took a crank to generate the electricity. David Dollar: They would crank the electricity? Carmen Breazeale: And you had to turn it up. You could crank it enough. David Dollar: I'll be. Carmen Breazeale: And when I was young, we could ... See, that's a long time ago. There was still enough, you could generate enough electricity to feel a little tinkle. David Dollar: Mm-hmm (affirmative). A little tingle, a little pop. Carmen Breazeale: They can't do that no more. However, there are any number of his instruments on display down in the basement of the main house of the Oakland Plantation. And when we have our fall tours here, that always creates a great deal of interest. David Dollar: Oh, I'm sure it does. That sounds great. Carmen Breazeale: I always get a kick out of that, because I go down and stay there the two days of anything, and showing them the different things. It makes it very interesting. I have in my home one of the family clocks. It's a ten foot high grandfather clock. And I have a companion French mirror with a gold leaf by the wall mirror [inaudible 00:09:04]. It came over by ... The family history is about 350 years of each one of them. David Dollar: My goodness. I don't see how you keep up with all that stuff. I tell you. I have trouble remembering my grandparents and great-grandparents, and now you're all the way back to France, 350 years ago. That's amazing. Carmen Breazeale: My father was interested, and my mother was very much interested, in historical things and events. And she always ... And I was thrown with her constantly. And she died in 1956. And she and I were together from 19 ... All the time. But [inaudible 00:09:40], I came back and taught since 1911. From 1911 to 1956, you'll absorb a whole lot, if you're interested. David Dollar: You've had a long history lesson, huh? Carmen Breazeale: I had a long, long history lesson. David Dollar: I'll tell you. No, that's great. Carmen Breazeale: [crosstalk 00:09:52]. One of the things that interested me so much is some of the old customs in Natchitoches. And there's one that I remember, having seen any number of times, that as far as I know, it has never been celebrated anywhere else. And that was the Easter Beef Parade. David Dollar: Easter Beef? Carmen Breazeale: The Easter Beef Parade. David Dollar: You better tell me about that one. Carmen Breazeale: A day or two before Easter, the different butchers in town ... We didn't have markets and things kind of like they have now. The different butchers in town would select the beef that they were going to slaughter for Easter. They shine them all up, and shine the horns, and put flowers around the horns, and a bell around the neck. And the parade would be led down Front Street by this old man, who was call Mr. [Tabor 00:10:36]. And he played what he insisted was not a violin, but was a fiddle. David Dollar: A fiddle. Carmen Breazeale: And he would go down, dancing down the street, and people ... When your butcher, whom you regularly got your beef came along, he would stop, and you could go out and show what part of the beef you wanted, and how much you wanted. David Dollar: Wow. Carmen Breazeale: And they would write it all down. And then just after the slaughter, then that beef was brought to you for you consumption. David Dollar: Well, goodness. Carmen Breazeale: That's one thing I wish they would start again, because it was very picturesque, and very, very unusual. David Dollar: I'm sure it was. Find a bunch of cows and a fiddle player, you could do it. Carmen Breazeale: Another very happy recollection I have is when the cotton boats would come up the river, during the season. And one of them was called the Scobol. David Dollar: Scobol. Carmen Breazeale: The Scobol. And it would stop at what is [inaudible 00:11:25] Street now, and we'd go down to the bank and get on, and ride the boat up as far as about to where the Chamber of Commerce is now. David Dollar: Oh, you got to ride it, huh? Carmen Breazeale: And one of the things that all the children lived for was getting a glass of lemonade from one the boat. David Dollar: Oh goodness. They had it on the boat there. Carmen Breazeale: For some reason, that lemonade was much better than any that you got anywhere else. David Dollar: I'll be. Goodness gracious. Ms. Breazeale, we're just about out of time. You've told us so much here I don't know quite what to pin down. We try to close the program, though, with a closing memory. Speaker 3: [crosstalk 00:11:56] David Dollar: And if you have something that you'd like to share with us at this time, or anything that stands out. That's really a silly question to ask you, I guess. Any one of the things you've told us could be a great one. Carmen Breazeale: I think the thing that stands out the most with me is that I'm very proud of the history of Natchitoches. Not only in my family, but all the history of Natchitoches, as a whole. And I think that we have a workflow opportunity right now to preserve that history and make grow through [inaudible 00:12:29], and the Louisiana [inaudible 00:12:31]. David Dollar: Right, right. Carmen Breazeale: And I hope it does. And I hope that all of us, listen, won't ever forget the Red Cross, and the things it has done, even recently in Natchitoches Parish. David Dollar: Right. Amen. We thank you very much for joining us, and for sharing all this with us. Thanks a lot.

Carmen Breazeale's family has lived in Natchitoches since the 1700s and has family living at Oakland Plantation. Has worked with the Red Cross as chapter chairman. She mentions that her father published the Natchez Enterprise and was against the Louisiana lottery law.

December 5, 2022

13. Carmen Roberts

Transcript

David Dollar: Good morning. This morning we're going to be visiting with Mr. Carmen Roberts. You'll remember that our last program we visited with his lovely wife and we're still in Provencal, Louisiana, having a wonderful time. Good morning, Mr. Robert. Carmen Roberts: Good morning. How you doing, sir? David Dollar: Tell me about when you were a boy, what it was like growing up here? Carmen Roberts: Well, I was raised about seven miles Southeast of the city of Provencal here, just beyond the army community, what you know as an army community. And as a child, I was the oldest of three children. I had two sisters and no brothers. And during my early years, I remember especially going through, started to school. Well, we had to walk about a mile, to a one room school, one teacher and the way we kept it warm, in the winter time, we had an old heater that we used pine knots in. And we got our drinking water with a couple of buckets. Us boys would go get it about a quarter of a mile there from the spring. So that's the way got our water. So we had this one room school I said, and we had a nine month school back in the those times. And I attended this school known as Blue Spring, which has long been gone. And then in the meantime, on other side of the, what would you call it the bottom out there in the army community. We had another school, about four miles from that known as Harmony School. So they decided that they would build a school in between there and, which they did, and named it White Star. And we all, all of us, they consolidated them and we went to White Star School. And I went, the best I can remember, about the fourth or fifth grade at Blue Spring. And naturally we went and started at White Star, why I went there until, through the seventh grade, and then started going to Provencal. I stayed here in Provencal with the Voight family and went to school there for a year or so. A couple of three years. And I believe I went through to the 10th grade and decided I had enough education and just quit. David Dollar: Just dropped out. Carmen Roberts: Just dropped out for no apparent reason. I thought I would change the world. I've regretted it many times that I didn't finish. But that's the way it was, I just dropped out. David Dollar: We were talking earlier that your family has been in this area since at least before the civil war. Carmen Roberts: That is right. I've heard my father tell me about it several times. And his grandfather was handed on down at, they been in this Natchez Parish here fo a great number of years there. And the place I was raised in, it was a... The house, it was a six room house with a front porch and a hall and a back porch. It had three large fireplaces in it. And we could burn a four-foot wood in each one of the fireplaces. And we also had one, at the time what we would cook on the fireplace back there I've seen my mother, my grandmother, who lived with us, but they would do some cooking on this third fireplace back in the kitchen that way. Of course we had no electricity, no gas, no modern day conveniences, but we was, we liked that real good, that life because we, that's all we knew. And so we liked it, this is a great deal. So we farmed. My father did all his all life. He was farmer all of his life. And so we farmed 30 to 40 acres and we raised everything that could be raised. You just name it, and then we raised it. And so we didn't go to town very often, probably every two weeks. And sometime it would be a month before he would come to town to Provencal here. And we'd get necessary supplies, flour, and a little fuel oil, and things that we didn't have at home that way, which was in the wagon. My father never owned an automobile in his life. Never drove one, as far as I know. David Dollar: Did y'all raise sugarcane? Carmen Roberts: Oh yes. We raised a sugarcane and as far back as I can remember my father, he had a syrup mill. We made our own syrup and he also would make it for the neighbors all around. And he'd start about the last week in October and wind up sometime the latter part of November, which would last from two weeks to sometimes a month or better. And we'd get up early in the morning and the mill that we ground the juice with, and the power that we use to dry it out, were pulled by mules and horses. David Dollar: Y'all owned this mill? Carmen Roberts: We owned it. My father owned it himself that way. And we'd get up around four o'clock in the morning to get a supply of juice. So we'd have a good day's cooking. With a good day, why we'd cook from, anywhere from 75 to a hundred gallons of syrup a day. David Dollar: You didn't do this for free did you? Carmen Roberts: Oh no. The neighbors, why he would charge them every 4th gallon [inaudible 00:05:44] . And that was his pay for cooking his neighbors all around him there. And so, I believe, if I remember right one of the problems he did have he did have [inaudible 00:05:57] That they would furnish their own pine. We used pine as fuel to cook the syrup with. And so I always enjoyed it very much. And another thing that I really enjoyed too, was when I was a child, is hog killing time. There's something about it that always thrilled me. And we had to always kill them down at the back of the house on a little creek. David Dollar: We have to take a break right now and we'll come back to hog killing right after this word from our sponsors. We're visiting with Mr. Carmen Roberts this morning in Provencal. And before we were talking about hog killing. We're going to talk about it some more. Carmen Roberts: Especially want to talk about the hog killing and cooking out the lard. We'd cooked out in a large wash pot and we'd make several, 45, 48 pound cans. Enough to do us all a year. And especially why, what was so good was the sausage that my mother would make. And later me and my wife, we would make it. We would take it, grind it with a hand mill. My mother would put seasoning in it, and then she would get the inner part of a shuck and sprinkle it with a ... David Dollar: This is a corn shuck? Carmen Roberts: Corn shuck, to make it pliable and soft, then she would wrap those sausages in netting and tie each end of them, two together and put them over a hole in a large smoke house that we had. And we'd smoke them with a Hickory smoke, anywhere from three to seven days. They was the most delicious a sausage that's not going to be bought. That none would compare with the flavor of these sausage that way. I can almost taste them right now. David Dollar: Back when you first started hog killing, were there any fences around here? Carmen Roberts: The owner, it was open range. All the hogs and the cows while they run outside, but the fields where we raised our corn and cotton and all our crops, they had to be fenced. But back in those days, why we used rail fences. And I helped my father split out many a rail that way, and we would use 10 foot rails around most all of it. And so I was quite a large boy before I knew anything but a rail fence. And so they would last anywhere from, a rail would from five to 15 years, depending on the quality of it, whether it was oak or pine or whatever like that. David Dollar: Did you ever hunt when you were a boy? Carmen Roberts: Oh, yes. Quite a bit. And it was anything I liked to hunt, my most favorite hunting was squirrel. And of course I liked to hunt ducks. Back when I started out hunting, they were just, you could just kill any amount of squirrels that you wanted to. Just, I was raised on the little bottom out there. Why you could go out and just kill a limit just in a short while that way. And we would rabbit hunt and then at night, me and my father, in the winter time, we would hunt the opossum and coons, and we didn't eat those, but we sold fur off of them. And doing during the winter we'd make a quite few dollars, hunting those opossum at night. David Dollar: Did you ever deer hunt? Carmen Roberts: No. That's one of the hunting that I never got into was deer hunting, but I never did. David Dollar: Well, back in those days, there weren't any limits on how many you could kill where there? Carmen Roberts: Well, yes sir, there was a limit, but back out there was sometime not all of us stopped at the limit. Not every time. David Dollar: Well you weren't a farmer all your life. Carmen Roberts: No, sir. I farmed, I was about 29 years old. Then I went to work for the Texas Pacific Railway Company and spent 34 years with them before retirement. And during those years with the railroad, I worked anywhere from East Texas, around Overton, Killgore, all the way into New Orleans, including all the branches that PB had that way. And there was some of those days, when it was cold out there and snow covered the ground, why we didn't know whether we was going to make it or not. But anyhow, well we just buckle up a little tighter. The weather got cold and we just stayed with it for 34 years out there. David Dollar: Well, by the time you were in the railroad business, everything was, well it wasn't steam anymore. It was just a, was it a diesel engine? Carmen Roberts: No, sir. When I first started, we had nothing but a steam engine. The diesel come along several years after. David Dollar: When was that now? Carmen Roberts: Well, if I were to, it would have to be a guess, is when the diesel would come along, I would say it was... The diesel come along in the late forties or early fifties. David Dollar: That late? Carmen Roberts: Right. David Dollar: We're just about out of time. When did you retire? Carmen Roberts: November the first, 1974, like I said before, I had spent 34 years out in the railroad. David Dollar: How do you like retirement? Carmen Roberts: Well, I'll tell you, like I've told most everyone else that has asked me about how like retirement, if it was any better, I just don't think I could stand it. David Dollar: Mr. Roberts, we've enjoyed visiting with you. Carmen Roberts: And thank you. And it's been a pleasure, you folks being in our home and we really enjoyed it.

Mr. Carmen Roberts: He and Mr. Dollar recalls memories of growing up and living in Provencal.

December 12, 2022

14. Clara Schuler

Transcript

David Dollar: Hello, once again, this is David Dollar on Memories. We're glad you're joining us today. We're going to visit with Mrs. Clara Schuler of Natchitoches this morning, and we're going to start off our program right now, Mrs. Schuler, by asking you a little bit of background family stuff, like where you were raised. Clara Schuler: Well, in Bienville Parish, the town of Bienville, we lived about a mile and a half from town, right down the railroad track. And we lived there with our grandmother and an uncle. Our parents had died when my brother, who was Prince Dan, everybody in town knows him. He was about a year old when our father died and he was about four years old when mama died. So we lived with our grandmother and she was a wonderful grandmother. When I talk about him, I'd always say what grandma talked now, no one say that, but mama told me things. It was always, grandma told us. And we lived on a farm. David Dollar: What kind of things did you do as a little girl in Bienville Parish, on the farm? Clara Schuler: We washed and we ironed and we scrubbed the floors and we hoed the fields sometimes. And we did go to school, some. David Dollar: Did your grandmother have a washing machine? Or did you do a lot of [crosstalk 00:01:26]. Clara Schuler: No. We had to fill up the wash pot and draw the water out the well. Best well in Bienville Parish. David Dollar: You had it. Huh? Clara Schuler: We had it. David Dollar: That was a blessing. Clara Schuler: We had to draw that water and wash it over the battling block. We had a battle block. David Dollar: You're going to have to explain that to me just a little bit. I'm not quite a battle block. Clara Schuler: We had a block and we made our own soap. We made live soap and we put that on there and then put this garment on the... David Dollar: On just a block of wood? Clara Schuler: A block of wood and then take that battle block. It was made kind of like a paddle, but it was heavier than a paddle. And that's what we do that, we didn't always have a rag board. But fine, we did get to where we did have the rag boards. David Dollar: But you just beat the paddle on the block [crosstalk 00:02:13] Clara Schuler: Yes, beat the clothes on the block and rearrange them a little bit and put them in the pot where they soap was. And that's the way we did our washing. I don't know, sometimes I liked it. When it was cold, I didn't like it. [crosstalk 00:02:28] Didn't like cold weather. David Dollar: I bet. You mentioned some things about the uniqueness, kind of your marriage, you and your sister. Why don't you tell us a little bit about that. Clara Schuler: Well, we married brothers. She had one of the best husbands in the world, I guess. And he was such a good brother-in-law. He really was good to us. He just did everything in the world. He was just as close to us as our own brother was. And he bought us lots of things because he was working. And then about 4, 5 or 6 years, I guess. Well, I married Victor. David Dollar: His brother? Clara Schuler: His brother. And we lived in the house together most of the times. And the children hardly knew which their one was. Wayne Schuer, is one of the nephews. And of course I lost my son about five years ago. But they always loved one of us, just like they did the other. David Dollar: Just one big happy family. [crosstalk 00:03:25] Well, that's really something. Tell me about when you came to Natchitoches. Clara Schuler: Well, we moved over here from Robeline. We moved from Bienville. We chartered a car from Bienville and moved to Robeline and first thing I didn't like about Robeline was the next morning I asked for a drink of water and the girl went to the cistern. That old outside cistern, not a tank. David Dollar: Not a deep well? Clara Schuler: No, it wasn't a deep well, it was just an old, tin cistern outside the house. That water was just as hot as it would come out of the tea kettle. Oh and I fussed them because we had left an artesian well in Bienville. David Dollar: Oh goodness. Those things were hard to come by, weren't they? Clara Schuler: Good soft water. So then we lived there 10 or 12 years. And then we moved over here to Natchitoches. And I remember we brought our cows and everything with us from Robeline. And we unloaded the truck, and backed up, what used to be the old Catholic church up there. You know where the Catholic church was up on the hill. David Dollar: Right. Clara Schuler: Well, we backed that truck up there and led the cows off. And I moved in one of Mr. Jim Tucker's house right across the street. So we lived there a long time and then we moved several place in town. I guess I was the biggest mover, the woman that moved the most. Always trying to find a place cheaper, probably, I don't know. David Dollar: I guess. Clara Schuler: But I enjoyed moving. It didn't bother me. David Dollar: Nothing wrong with it. I'll tell you, let me interrupt you just a second here for commercial. We'll be right back. Talk to Mrs. Schuler a little bit more about life in Natchitoches, right after this message from People's Bank, our sponsor. Hello, once again. In case, you are just joining us. This is David Dollar visiting with Mrs. Clara Schuler today on Memories. We've been talking about coming from Bienville to Robeline and over to Natchitoches. And why don't we pick up with the things that you were doing here in Natchitoches. Didn't you say you were running a boarding house? Let's start right there. See what we can do. Clara Schuler: The boarding house, it was a hargrove house and next to the Baptist church. And I helped them build that church, that Baptist church. I helped to build that. I was there the morning when they drove the first stake down. Of course, I was nosy, as I told you before, I was nosy. I had to find out what they were doing. And they were fixing to build the church. So we lived there a long time and then, I don't know, 10 or 12 years I was there. And then we bought out a little cafe, Little Cane Cafe from the Lacoure girl, I believe it was. And I didn't stay, that was a little bitty thing. And that wasn't big enough for me, I didn't think. So, then we bought the Riverview and Miss Camp, Mandy Camp, was a girl that was in there with me and we had a good business there. David Dollar: Where was the Riverview Cafe? Clara Schuler: It was between what used to be Nichols and the labor store. David Dollar: Right on Front Street. Clara Schuler: Right on Front Street. David Dollar: Viewing Cane River, hence the name Riverview. Clara Schuler: That's the reason it was named that, because it was on the river. David Dollar: Before my time. Clara Schuler: We stayed there a long time and I enjoyed that very much. And then we bought the Rendezvous Cafe. David Dollar: Oh I remember the Rendezvous, surely do. Clara Schuler: And that's memories to me really. I guess that was the best part of my life ,was right down there with those kids. David Dollar: You served a lot of the college students? Clara Schuler: We almost took it away from Mr. Perther. David Dollar: I remember that. Clara Schuler: But that was really... Now, when I think back now, I guess that was the best part of my life. I really enjoyed the students then. I see them on radio now, not radio, on TV. I see them on TV, and "I know you that's Jared, that's Don". I know I'm going to see a lot of them. David Dollar: See them growing right up now. Huh? Clara Schuler: Yeah. They're all big men, lot of them. David Dollar: Well, Northwestern, surely put out a lot of folks in the community here and around the state too. Clara Schuler: Yes, they have. David Dollar: I bet the students appreciated it more, a good home cooked meal too, down there than some of the dining halls. Clara Schuler: I don't think they ever come down after the thing that I didn't have it. And if I didn't know how to fix it, I'd ask them how to fix it. They would tell me and we would go fix it. David Dollar: You would go try it out. Clara Schuler: We would go try it out and see how we do. And I really enjoyed that part of my life down with all those students. Mr. Miller and Dr. Doug Dale. Let me see, there was Mr. Miller and Mr. Simpson, Dr. Doug Dale, and one other one that was always down there. They'd come down there and they'd talk to Mr. Schuer. And, of course Mr. Miller and Mr. Schuer, neither one were too pretty, and they'd call each other old ugly. David Dollar: Oh my goodness. Well, we've had both Mr. Miller and Dr. Doug Dale too, on our program. Clara Schuler: You have. I heard Mr. Miller. Well, they were good [crosstalk 00:08:51] David Dollar: Still calling each other names, Huh? [crosstalk 00:08:58] At the Rendezvous. We are just about out of time Mrs. Schuer. We would like to try to end our programs up with what we call our closing memory. And we were talking earlier, why don't you relate the little story you told me a minute ago? Clara Schuler: About my brother. David Dollar: That's right. Clara Schuler: We just had a little money and we were living with our grandma and her retirement. And so he came and he bought a barrel of syrup. It was a 5 gallon keg, at least. David Dollar: Goodness. Clara Schuler: And so they had to cut wood, they cut stove wood. And they'd take that bottle and put that pine straw in the bottle and they'd sprinkle that on the saw to cut the turpentine, that what on... David Dollar: What was in the bottle? Clara Schuler: Coal oil David Dollar: Coal oil to cut the turpentine when you saw it. Okay, I'm with you now. Clara Schuler: So they'd take and sprinkle it on so, well that cut the turpentine. So we were fooling around in the smokehouse one evening, and Prince got that coal oil out of that bottle and just sprinkled it all. We poured the whole thing in the syrup. And we had to eat that syrup. We didn't have no money and you couldn't buy the syrup either. And Bienville Parish has the best syrup in the whole United States, David Dollar: The whole United States, that's what I hear. Clara Schuler: So he poured that in and we had to eat that coal oil syrup. We laughed about it. They didn't rip him about it. But if it had been one of us, we three girls, they would've given us a spanking about it. But they didn't him, because he was a pet. David Dollar: He was the pet. Clara Schuler: He was a pet. We didn't spank him. David Schuler: Let me ask you one thing before we go, what did the molasses taste like with coal oil in it? Clara Schuler: It tastes like coal oil. David Dollar: It tastes like coal oil. Clara Schuler: It never did get out. When it went to rock candy, it still tasted like coal oil. David Dollar: Still tasted like coal oil and you had eat every bit of it. Clara Schuler: You had to eat every bit of it. David Dollar: Well I'll be. Mrs. Schuler, we thank you for being on our Memories program this morning and we're going to have you back. Cause I got a feeling we got some more stories we might need to hear from you.

Clara Schuler: Ms. Schuler grew up with her grandmother and brother and lived on a farm in Bienville Parish. She and sister married brothers, and was fond of her brother-in-law and all lived in the house together.

December 19, 2022

15. Christell Roberts

Transcript

Hubert Laster: Good morning, this is Hubert Laster, and this morning we're in Provencal, Louisiana, and we're going to be visiting with Mrs. Christell Roberts. We'll be back in just a moment. Good morning, this is Hubert Laster, and this morning we're visiting with Mrs. Christell Roberts, on the Memories Program. We're happy to be here in your home. Christell Roberts: Thank you. Hubert Laster: We were talking earlier about when you were born and raised, and you were born in Celine Parish? Christell Roberts: Sabine Parish Hubert Laster: Sabine Parish, okay. Christell Roberts: Just over the line from Natchitoches Parish and my father was a farmer, and of course we did everything farmers do. We raised corn, cotton, potatoes, peanuts, sugar cane. We made our own syrup. We had our own peanuts, so we made our candy of peanuts and syrup, and then we... I'm just about to stall here. Hubert Laster: What did you buy the store or did you- Christell Roberts: We bought practically nothing other than flour and coffee and sugar. Now, the other things we raised in the garden and in the fields. We didn't need much money because we had no electricity, no gas, no car, no telephone, and so it just didn't take money. Our cash crop was cotton. The things that we bought... And if we didn't have money, we traded syrup or maybe potatoes, something like that for it. In our home, of course, everything was primitive living. My mother, when she would go to wash, well, of course she had to use a washboard. There was no electricity for a washing machine or anything like that. She had what she called a battling block. She'd take the work clothes and use an old battling stick to beat the clothes, instead of rubbing them on the rubber-board. We used our old homemade soap, that we made ourselves, and that was used to scrub the floors. The floors were made of, about, 1 x 12 planks and they were very white. So, when we scrubbed them clean, we would go to the creek and get a bucket of coarse, white sand to put on this floor. That would keep it clean for several days because no dirt or anything could go through that white sand. So, our floors were always real clean. Hubert Laster: Well, what about whenever you cooked with grease and things, splattering on the floor? Christell Roberts: Well, if the grease splattered out of the skillet when we were frying something on the stove, well it spattered into the sand and it didn't get on the floor. And so that way we always had good, clean floors. Hubert Laster: How did you clean up the floors? Did you have a broom or did- Christell Roberts: We'd go to the Sage Patch, which most everyone around the farm would have, and we'd cut a sage that would be about four feet long and we'd get a little bundle of that and wrap string around it. And then we'd get the blooms out of the brush part of it. Then, we'd use that for brushing the floor up. That was our kitchen broom, especially. Of course, now we swept the other parts of the house with it too, but it was mainly the kitchen broom. Hubert Laster: When we were talking earlier, you said that you had a piece of board that you drilled holes in and put corn shucks in? Christell Roberts: That's right, that's what we scrubbed the floors with. We'd take a piece of, about a 2' x 10' piece of wood and cut it about 14 inches long and bore big holes, about an inch and a half in diameter, about three rows or four rows of them in that piece of wood. And we'd put shucks in that and then add a long handle to it. And that was our mop. That's what we scrubbed the floor with. Hubert Laster: Oh, well, what did your father do for a living? Christell Roberts: Well, he was a farmer. Then from the farming, he worked at Victoria Saw Mill, which is a couple of miles up the road. It was a big mill at that time. And he carried the clock at night. Then from that, he worked in the oil field. And then from that, well, he went to West Carroll Parish as a farmer, and that's where he retired. Hubert Laster: Now, did he move the whole family to Texas? Christell Roberts: No, we stayed at home here, just about a mile up the road. Hubert Laster: Oh. Christell Roberts: And he would stay off maybe two or three months and then come back on a little vacation for a couple of weeks, then he'd go back. And that was really my childhood. Hubert Laster: That's as much as you can remember, I think there's more. Christell Roberts: Well, for our pass time, we had to make our own fun. So we'd go hickory nut hunting in the woods. And there was old cemeteries way back in the woods. And we'd walk back there and walk over those old cemeteries and wonder about the people who were buried there years and years ago. Just little things like that, or maybe we'd go wading in the creek or something like that. We had no cars to run around in. And another thing we didn't have, a radio. I never will forget the first time I ever heard of a radio. A cousin of mine went to Deridder, I mean, Princeton. She came back, she said, "You know, I heard the most wonderful thing in the world." She said, "We all went to the auditorium at school and there was a little girl, we heard her singing all the way from the New York." And she said, "It was just as clear as if she had been in the room with us." She said it was the most marvelous thing she'd ever heard. Hubert Laster: Well, speaking of radio, we need to take a break right now for our sponsor. We'll be right back. If you've just joined us, we're visiting with Ms. Christell Roberts in Provencal. Tell me about the first car that you ever saw, okay? Christell Roberts: Well, my uncle in Robeline owned it. Of course, it was just a great thing for us to look out and see the car pass. But, my mother and her sister were terribly afraid that we'd be run over by it. So, every time they'd hear it coming, they'd run out and holler, "You children get in the yard quick, I hear Charlie coming with that car and he doesn't know how to stop it." Hubert Laster: Did it make a lot of noise? Christell Roberts: Oh yes, it made plenty noise. Even in the winter time he kept the top down because I guess they didn't know that it would [crosstalk 00:08:06] knock off some of the cold weather. He came to get us one day to take us up to Marksville and the frost was thick on the ground and he had the top down on the car. We were all wrapped up in quilts, down between the seats, to keep from freezing to death. Well, that was the first car that I ever did see. I guess you'd call it an old T-Model. Hubert Laster: Yes ma'am. Well, we were talking about appliances and you were talking about washing machines? Christell Roberts: Well, the first washing machine I ever saw belonged to my aunt. It was a big old wooden tub, about three and a half feet across and it was about two feet deep. There was a thing in the middle of it with handles on it and you'd push it and then pull it to agitate the clothes down and then get the dirt out of the clothes. And when you'd get through with it, well, you were more tired than if you had used the rubber-board. Hubert Laster: I would imagine so. When was this? About what year? Christell Roberts: This was 1922. Hubert Laster: Oh... You were saying that you were the second oldest in your family? Christell Roberts: Right. Hubert Laster: What about cooking? Did you learn how to cook? Christell Roberts: Oh yes, I learned to cook. Well, I was cooking good when I was 10 years old, but when I was 8, I cooked pretty good and I could cook a lot of things. But, by the time I was 10 years old, my mother would leave me to cook dinner. Or, get out and do the washing on the washboard or anything like that. Of course the cooking then was just like it is now, other than you cooked on a wood stove instead of a gas stove. And to me, well, it tasted a lot better than it does now. Hubert Laster: On a gas stove? No, on a wood stove? Christell Roberts: On the wood stove, yes. Hubert Laster: Did it burn hotter or something? Christell Roberts: No, you could keep an even temperature by keeping just so much wood in the stove. Our stove had a little thing on it to tell how hot it was. And so when it came to a certain temperature, I'd put my biscuits or bread in the oven and it would take it about 20 minutes to cook, just like it does on my gas stove now. Hubert Laster: Mm-hmm (affirmative). Okay. Christell Roberts: But now we cooked in big old iron pots because we had this big family and it took lots of vegetables. And so we had big iron pots and our water kettle on that stove was an iron kettle. Of course, on the side of the stove, there was what we called a reservoir, which would hold about six or eight gallons of water. And that would be hot to use as you needed it. Hubert Laster: I see. Christell Roberts: You would use that for your bath water and things like that. Because sometime, the water would get low and we'd have to go to the creek to get water to bring to the house, to take a bath or to wash clothes, or anything like that. Hubert Laster: You cooked for your whole family before you went to school every day? Christell Roberts: No, no, that was on vacation time. Hubert Laster: Oh, I see. Christell Roberts: And then after school in the afternoon and on weekends, well, I did quite a bit of cooking. Now, I cooked breakfast before I went to school. Hubert Laster: Well, what time do you have to get up? Christell Roberts: Four O'clock Hubert Laster: That's too early! Christell Roberts: We always got up at four o'clock and his folks did too. All farmers did then. Hubert Laster: Do you like it more now, or then? Maybe that's a- Christell Roberts: Well. Hubert Laster: Bad question to ask. Christell Roberts: We didn't know the difference then. Every one, all farmers live like that then. We didn't know what we were missing. We didn't miss it because we didn't know anything about it. But, I would hate to think I had to go back to that permanently. Hubert Laster: Four o'clock in the morning, that's early. Christell Roberts: That's right. Hubert Laster: We're just about to run out of time. Is there one last memory you'd like to share with us before we have to go? Christell Roberts: Well, I don't know of anything that I haven't mentioned. Hubert Laster: Well. Christell Roberts: Other than our entertainment, as we were speaking a while ago, we'd have parties and the young folks would gather together. They called each thing that we played a different name, but it all boiled down to square dancing. Then, other recreation we'd get out and go walking in the afternoon. A bunch of us would get together, maybe go to the woods and hunt hickory nuts or walnuts or something like that. We would especially hunt the Shellbark Hickory Nuts. Hubert Laster: Were they the best? Christell Roberts: Oh yes. Hubert Laster: Oh, okay. Christell Roberts: And just different things like that. We had no cars or anything like that. Oh yes after we finally did get a radio, well, we'd heard of TV, but I didn't think that I'd ever see one because I didn't think I'd live long enough to see a TV. And of course now, it's a common thing and a place without TV, you can't imagine Hubert Laster: Mrs. Roberts, it's been a pleasure visiting with you.

Christell Roberts: Born in Sabine Parish, and her father was a farmer. She remembers her life while growing up on a farm.

December 26, 2022

16. Clementine Hunter

Transcript

Speaker 1: Clementine, how long have you lived at Melrose? Clementine: About 20 years or more. Speaker 1: Did you work for Ms. Cammie Henry? Clementine: All right, yeah. I cooked for her. Speaker 1: How long did you cook for? Clementine: About seven or eight years. Speaker 1: Did she have any particular food she liked? Clementine: No, just most anything. Speaker 1: Did you find it a hard job to cook for Ms. Cammie? Clementine: No, a fine job. Speaker 1: What was the big house like when Ms. Cammie was alive? Clementine: Well, just like the same thing, now. It ain't no different. Speaker 3: [inaudible 00:00:46]. Speaker 1: Clementine, did Ms. Cammie have a lot of company? Clementine: Sometimes. Speaker 1: How many families did she have on the place? Do you remember? Clementine: I don't remember. Speaker 1: Did she treat the Negroes on the place well? Clementine: Fine. Speaker 1: Did most of them like her? Clementine: They all liked her. Speaker 1: Do you remember her children? Clementine: Yeah, I remember all of them. Speaker 1: Do you remember when she taught school for them? Clementine: No, I don't know. I don't remember that. Speaker 1: Could you tell us something about [Mr. Lyle Saxon 00:01:22] ? Clementine: No, I can't tell you nothing. No more than he'd come most every week or every month he'd come. Stay a while at that old hospital. Speaker 1: Did he write some of his books there? Clementine: I don't know if he did or not. Speaker 1: Did you like Mr. Saxon? Clementine: Yeah, I liked him. He was a nice man. Speaker 1: At the time you were the cook, did you bring his breakfast to his house, or did he come to the big house to eat? Clementine: Sometime he come to the big house. And then again, I take it to him. Speaker 1: Did he have anything he liked particularly? Clementine: Well, mostly sometimes fried eggs in the morning and coffee. He didn't eat too much. Speaker 1: Was there any special dish that Melrose was famous for? Clementine: No, not as I know, because just anything I'd cook, they'd eat it. Speaker 1: Were the roads pretty bad when it rained? Clementine: Oh yeah, pretty bad. Ain't nothing but a danger. Speaker 1: It was pretty hard to get to [inaudible 00:02:27], then? Clementine: Well, it was hard sometimes if it rain, but it was hard if it didn't rain because there's so much dust. Speaker 1: Did Ms. Cammie leave the plantation very often? Clementine: Not as I know. Speaker 1: Well, tell me a little bit about what Ms. Cammie was like. Did most people like her? Was she easy to get along with? Clementine: Well, she was easy for me to get along, because I sure got along with her and hated it when she died. Speaker 1: Mr. Saxon says that Ms. Cammie often cared for some of the Negroes who was sick on her place. Were you ever aware of this? That she went to the cabins and nursed them when they was sick? Clementine: No, no. They was all right there in the yard. Speaker 1: Some accounts say that Ms. Cammie had cabins moved from other parts of the place, or other plantations, up close to the big house where she made guest houses. Do you know anything about this? Clementine: I don't know, did she move them or not. But I know she got some over there, but I don't know did she move them or build them themself, I don't know. Speaker 1: Mm-hmm (affirmative). What did she have in the [Yucca 00:03:44] House? Clementine: In the Yucca house there wasn't nothing but a loom, but looms in there. Speaker 1: Did Ms. Cammie weave on this loom? Clementine: Yeah. Speaker 1: What sort of thing did she make? Clementine: She would make rugs and different things. Speaker 1: Did you ever help her? Clementine: No, I didn't help her because I couldn't. Speaker 1: Did you sometimes make the thread for her? Clementine: Sometimes I'd make thread. Speaker 1: Do you know if Ms. Cammie used some of this cloth that she wove to cover the furniture? Clementine: No. I don't know. Speaker 1: Do you know when Yucca House was built? Clementine: I don't know. I'm working here then. Speaker 1: There's another famous house called African House. What was in it? Clementine: The African House? Speaker 1: I think you call it the Mushroom House. Clementine: That's what we call it. They had nothing in there. They had a lot of stuff in there. You know, beds and different things, that nobody didn't steal. Speaker 1: Mm-hmm (affirmative). And Mr. Saxon lived in the old hospital. Clementine: Old hospital. Speaker 1: Which was probably a civil war hospital. Clementine: Yes, it must have been. Because when I come here it was there, mm-hmm (affirmative). Speaker 1: Is this the building that Mr. Francois [inaudible 00:05:05] lives in now? Clementine: I don't know where he live. Speaker 1: Where Mr. Saxon used to live? Clementine: That's him. Speaker 3: [inaudible 00:05:15]. Speaker 1: You mean Israel? Did you know uncle Israel? Clementine: Yeah, I know him well. Speaker 1: Well, could you tell us a little about him? Clementine: Well, I don't know. He used to work here. He got sick and he was old. He had to still lean down half of the time because he was old and sickly, but he kept on. Speaker 1: Ms. Cammie took care of him after he was sick. Clementine: Took care of him. Took care of him after he was sick. Speaker 1: This shows her good side, right? Clementine: Yes sir. She fed him when he was couldn't eat his self. She kept fed him on till... Speaker 3: What'd she feed him? Clementine: Feed him soup, you know. The sick foods, different things. She was really good to him. Speaker 1: Did you ever hear that at one time colored people owned Melrose? Clementine: No, I don't know. I didn't hear it. Speaker 1: Do you know of any pictures of August [inaudible 00:06:15]? Clementine: August [inaudible 00:06:16]? He got one over there in the... Speaker 1: In the Yucca house. Clementine: In the old hospital. Speaker 1: In the old hospital. And he used to... He was a son of a colored woman that used to own Melrose. Did you know that? Clementine: No. I don't know that, but that's what tell me. Speaker 1: Have you heard that around here? Clementine: Yeah, I hear that over there. Speaker 1: At the big house. Clementine: I mean, I see the picture. I saw the picture. Speaker 1: Mm-hmm (affirmative). Are there any other pictures of people like that? Clementine: [inaudible 00:06:44] Speaker 1: Do you remember any of the other people who came to visit Ms. Cammie, like Ms. [Dorman 00:06:57] ? Do you remember Ms. Dorman? Clementine: I remember her. Speaker 1: Did she and Ms. Cammie plant flowers together? Clementine: They used to be in the flower garden, but I'd go home. I didn't know if they was planting there or not. Speaker 1: Well, what about Mr. Pipes? Do you remember Mr. Pipes? Clementine: I don't remember [inaudible 00:07:19]. Speaker 1: When did they first discover that you could paint, Clementine? Tell us about that. Clementine: Oh, well, I don't know. I just try and ignore them with company. They'd see me try, and then so, that's the way they got me. Speaker 3: What did you paint for the first time you painted? Do you remember? Clementine: I don't remember what did I paint the first time, but I tried to paint anything, just everything I could. Speaker 1: Well, Clementine, how do you decide what you're going to paint? Clementine: Well, just would come in my mind and that's what I paint. Speaker 3: Did you ever paint a picture of your grandson over there? Clementine: No, it never come in my mind. [crosstalk 00:08:05] Speaker 1: Have you ever had any dreams? Clementine: Well I dream it. I mean, I sees it in my sleep, what I ought to paint. Speaker 1: And then you get up and paint. Clementine: I get up and mark it if it's at night. Get up mark it and paint it the next day. Now, I don't be knowing if it's right or wrong, but I just paint. Speaker 1: You just paint. What comes to your mind in your sleep? Clementine: It's just what come to my mind, I paint. Speaker 1: And where did you get the first paint that you used? Clementine: Let me see. From Ms. Alberta [Kenzie 00:08:42] . Speaker 1: Ms. Alberta [Kenzie 00:08:42] . Clementine: She used to live in New Orleans. But she dead now. Speaker 1: And you used this paint that Miss Alberta Kenzie gave you to paint pictures on what sort of things? Clementine: Anything. Just an old piece of board right there, anything. Even like that board you got there. Speaker 3: You could paint up one on that? Clementine: Yes. Speaker 1: And that's how you learn to paint? Clementine: That's how I learn. Speaker 1: You quilt also, don't you Clementine? Clementine: Yeah, I quilt. Speaker 1: What sort of things do you, designs do you make? Clementine: Just anything tell me to put on now, I'll put it. Speaker 1: Do you ever make quilts with pictures of the big house? Clementine: Yeah. I'm quilting one now. I was sewing one, starting one, since last week, I think. Speaker 3: It's too hot to sew one. Clementine: I'll be sewing when it's cool. Speaker 1: Well, what about Mr. Francois [inaudible 00:09:32] ? When did he come here? Clementine: Well I don't know exactly what year Mr. Francois come here. Speaker 1: Does he get along well with the people at Melrose? Clementine: Oh, fine. They all like Mr. Francois. They all like him. Speaker 1: And where does he live? Clementine: In the old hospital. Speaker 1: Clementine, do you paint the pictures that are put in those plates that they sell? Clementine: I painted the pictures. Speaker 1: You paint those? Clementine: I do. [inaudible 00:10:03] Speaker 1: Clementine, when your husband was ill, tell us about how Mr. Saxon and Mr. Pipes took care of him. Clementine: Well, they just walked down to the school down there. [inaudible 00:10:28] Get a walk down there and see to him and bring him things to eat and nursing things, too. They was helping me with him. Speaker 1: Clementine, how old are you? Clementine: About 70-something. Speaker 1: You don't know exactly? Clementine: I don't know. I'm just guessing. Speaker 1: Were you born on this place? Clementine: No, sir. Speaker 1: Where were you born? Clementine: [inaudible 00:10:52] [Marco's 00:10:53] , way on down the road. Speaker 1: On Marco? Clementine: Marco. Speaker 1: On the plantation? Clementine: On the plantation. Speaker 1: And what was the name of the plantation? Clementine: That's all I know, Marco. Speaker 1: Marco Plantation. Who owned it? Mr. Sam [Lecass 00:11:07] ? Clementine: No, I don't think that was his name. I don't know who owned it. Mr. Sam and them, they lived down there in [Coocheyville 00:11:15]. Speaker 1: Right. Clementine: But I was way down here. [inaudible 00:11:20] Speaker 1: When is your birthday? Clementine: I don't know my birthday. Speaker 1: You don't know your birthday. Speaker 3: You don't get a cake? Clementine: They give me a cake, and Ms. Beth [Coochey 00:11:31] , she brought me a cake here. But she said [inaudible 00:11:34]. But she said, "I'm going to make one and I'm going to bring it to you." And she brought me a nice chocolate cake that time. Ms. Beth's something. Speaker 1: Well, tell me something, Clementine. How far was it to where the nearest white people live when Ms. Cammie was here? Clementine: Well, I don't know. I didn't pay attention. I don't know what. The neighbors, that's all. Speaker 1: What about Magnolia? The [Hertzog's 00:12:04] ? Clementine: The Hertzog's? They not too far. They right down there. Speaker 1: Did they visit Ms. Cammie? Clementine: I don't know. I didn't never see him. I don't know did they visit there or not. Speaker 1: Ms. Cammie died in 1948. Do you remember when she died? Clementine: I remember when she died because I went over there. I was the only person [crosstalk 00:12:23]. Speaker 1: Was she sick a long time before she died? Clementine: No, no, not too long. She didn't stay sick too long. Speaker 1: Were there a lot of people who came to the house when she died? Clementine: Oh, a lot of them. Just a whirl of people. Speaker 1: Was there a lot of people you didn't know? Clementine: I mean, I didn't know hardly none of them. Speaker 1: A lot of them must've been writers then. Clementine: I don't know. But I know they had a lot of them. Speaker 1: And did you work on at the big house after she died? Clementine: No, I quite after she died. Speaker 1: Was there any special reason why you quit? Clementine: No, I just hated she was gone and I just miss her, and I didn't want to cook. Speaker 1: You and Ms. Cammie must have been very good friends. Clementine: Good friends. I just make her laugh all the time. And sometimes she say, "Clementine? Where you at?" And I say, "I'm here in the kitchen." I put up things for her, you know? Hand her stuff and everything for her. Speaker 3: Canned peaches. Clementine: Canned peaches, and okra, and tomatoes, and just everything. Speaker 1: Well, did Ms. Cammie work in her library a lot? Clementine: Well, I don't know. Ms. Cammie, rather her yard. She'd rather go fool in her flowers. Speaker 1: But she did have a lot of books. Clementine: She had a lot of books. Speaker 1: Did she read a lot? Clementine: Well, she might read at night, you know. I don't know, but in the day, when I would be down in the kitchen. I wouldn't be up there, and you know, she might be reading up in the day, you know, I don't know. Speaker 1: Well, did you ever see the scrapbooks that she made? Clementine: No, I ain't saw them. Speaker 1: They were kept in the big arm, on the gallery, outside of her bedroom. Clementine: Well, didn't saw them. I never did pay attention. I didn't saw them. Speaker 1: So, you didn't clean up in the house? And you just cooked. Clementine: No, I just cooked. Speaker 1: She had someone else to clean the house? Clementine: She had someone else to clean the house. Speaker 1: Is her housekeeper still alive. Clementine: Let me see. Oh, well, I don't know. Some of them dead, I guess, because she would have different ones and you know, she [inaudible 00:14:26]. Speaker 1: Mm-hmm (affirmative). Well, is there anyone else that worked for her a long time that's still alive? Clementine: Yeah, Mary Randolph [inaudible 00:14:35] . Speaker 1: Mary Randolph? Clementine: Uh-huh (affirmative). She's a wash. Speaker 1: Where does Mary live? Clementine: She live over there. She's sick now. [inaudible 00:14:45]. Speaker 1: [inaudible 00:14:53] and Mr. Saxon were good friends? Clementine: Yes. Speaker 1: Mr. Saxon liked him? Clementine: He liked [inaudible 00:14:59]. Of them like [inaudible 00:15:01] call him [inaudible 00:15:03] . Speaker 1: They called him, what? Clementine: [inaudible 00:15:04]. Speaker 1: What does that mean? Clementine: They just call him that for a nickname. Speaker 1: For a nickname. What was some of the other nicknames that they used on the place? You didn't have no more, I don't believe. These are called [inaudible 00:15:21]. That was his name, [inaudible 00:15:25]. My daddy was John Reuben. He used to live on this place. Speaker 3: [inaudible 00:15:25] Your mother. Clementine: My mother, she died here. She was called [Antoinette 00:15:43]. Speaker 1: Well, thank you very much.

Clementine Hunter: This interview with Ms. Clementine Hunter is a q&a session to talk about her life on Melrose Plantation. Her friendships with Cammie Henry and Francois Mignon, as well as the unconventional way she became an artist.

January 2, 2023

17. Dave Antilley

Transcript

Hubert Laster: This is Hubert Laster, and this morning we're visiting with Mr. Antilley. We're pleased to welcome you to the show, sir. Dave Antilley: Thank you. What'd you want me to talk about first? Hubert Laster: Talk about what you did when you were a boy. Dave Antilley: Well, when I was a boy I used to hunt most of the time. And I done that. I hunted a lot. And then I worked from the time I was about 10 years old at sawmill on the river. There's old man firing pump down there on the river. And I used to go out every Wednesday, [inaudible 00:00:39]. I'd get up out every morning and fire up for him. I learnt how to fire a little bit. I'd fire it for him and he'd come right out ready and he's start his pumps up. I learned all about that. So one morning, he didn't come out. And I went down there and I fired up. He still didn't come out. I went down and the oil was pump up real good and started pump up and pumping water. And [inaudible 00:01:06] he come by and says, "Where's the fire man at?" I said, "He didn't come out this morning." He said, "Who's firing?" I said, "I'm firing." He said, "Who will oil the pump up?" I said, "I'll oil it up." He [inaudible 00:01:21] out the mill. We got the mill [inaudible 00:01:24]. I was nothing but a little kid. Hubert Laster: How old were you then? Dave Antilley: I was about 10 years old. Hubert Laster: Okay. Dave Antilley: And so here him, so, Tim, had come down there. Him and the [inaudible 00:01:37] down there. He says, "Where's the fireman at?" I said, "Well," I said, "the fireman, he didn't come out this morning. He was kind of sick yesterday." So he said, "You been firing this morning?" I said, "Yeah," I said, "I been firing here for most [inaudible 00:01:55] old man [inaudible 00:01:56]." [inaudible 00:02:01] said, "Well," he said, "your water's getting a little low. You ain't got [inaudible 00:02:06] gauge your water." Says, "Go put your water on. I'll see you put your water on. Come on, now." [inaudible 00:02:11] to put water on the boiler. I put water on the boiler. About a gauge and a half, I cut it off. He said, "What you cutting it off for?" I said, "Well, it's easier to [inaudible 00:02:21] like that." Gauge and a half, a half a gauge of water on that thing. He said, "Well," he said, "That's all right." Said, "Do you watch your toes?" I said, "Yes, Sir," I said, "I watch just like the old man did." And he said, "Well, so that's fine." And [inaudible 00:02:39] called him and told him, she said, "Well," she said, "let's go on back to the mill." Said, "He's all right," said, "I ain't pay [inaudible 00:02:46]." Said, "He's going to be fine. I've been down here and saw him. He been fine helping the old man." So they went on back to the mill. I remember having to fire that about six months, I reckon. Then I got [inaudible 00:03:01], gave me a job at the mill so I could be around some of the boys to talk to them. Hubert Laster: But wait a minute, you worked six months without getting paid? Dave Antilley: No, Sir. I got paid. Hubert Laster: How much? Dave Antilley: I got a dollar and a quarter a day. Hubert Laster: Was that good money? Dave Antilley: That's pretty good money then, pretty good money. Hubert Laster: Okay. Dave Antilley: So [inaudible 00:03:23] said, "Well," said, "I don't know when I'll have a job open." He said, "I'll give you a job [inaudible 00:03:31] if I can get somebody to fire down here, when a job come open." So I asked him one day, I said, "How come you didn't give me that job that come open?" I knew the job had come open. He said, "Well," said, "I knew [inaudible 00:03:45]." Says, "You're doing a good job down here." He said, "Why don't you just stay?" I said, "Well," I said, "I likes the job all right. I'd rather be up out on the [inaudible 00:03:57]." So he said, "All right," he said, "I'll give you next job opening." Wasn't but a few days, job tying [inaudible 00:04:06] come open. He gave me a job tying [inaudible 00:04:09]. That was a heavy job, too. And I tied [inaudible 00:04:13] there about two years. And every time the mill stopped [inaudible 00:04:19] saws, we'd go over to the [inaudible 00:04:25] and start it up. I'd jump on the [inaudible 00:04:27] and ride a little bit. If you got to work to ride the [inaudible 00:04:29] is pretty good. So one day he got short of a hand on the [inaudible 00:04:35]. He come down and said, "Dave," he says, "is that you [inaudible 00:04:39]the [inaudible 00:04:41]?" I said, "Yeah, I believe I can." I thought I could [inaudible 00:04:44]. I went up there [inaudible 00:04:46]. And Sawyer, he was the boss of that and he liked me pretty well and so they just kept me up there for a while. Kept me up about eight, ten months or maybe a year, something like that. So they got short of [inaudible 00:05:04]. But the old man knew I could fire. He said, "Dave," he said, "you reckon you can fire them six, seven bowlers down there?" I said, "Yeah," I said, "I believe I can." He said, "Now, be sure. I'm watching. Keep putting water on the boilers so they won't blow up." I said, "Don't you worry." I said, "I know as much danger that as you do." So he kind of laughed and I went on down and went for it. I went firing up [inaudible 00:05:35] down that boiler, oh, about 14 years. And my brother-in-law he was engineer. And he's good engineer, too. He's from across the water. He's good. Every time I had work for him he'd come get me to help him work on at night. And I learnt all about putting rings in, [inaudible 00:05:55] the boxes up, [inaudible 00:05:57] the main boxes. And I done pretty good. And he quit and they put a [inaudible 00:06:04] down there [inaudible 00:06:06] all time [inaudible 00:06:07] 10, 15, 20 minutes a day. [inaudible 00:06:12] said, "Dave," says, "can't you run that engine and make 8, 10 hours a day?" Of course I said, "I don't know." I said, "I don't mind trying." So I went down there, went to run the engine and [inaudible 00:06:29] both jobs. I'm firing and running the engine too. It was a pretty hard job. But I done pretty good. And I lost 10 minutes in a year's time. Just 10 minutes I lost in a year's time. Hubert Laster: Now where was this at? Dave Antilley: At Montrose Sawmill. Hubert Laster: We need to take a break right now for a word from our sponsors, People Bank and Trust, but we'll be right back. In case you've just joined us, this is Hubert Laster visiting with Mr. Antilley on the Memories Show. Dave Antilley: Well, [inaudible 00:07:06] I quit sawmill and I went farming. Hubert Laster: Now, this is what year now? Dave Antilley: This is about 1942, I believe. I don't remember exactly, but around 1942 [inaudible 00:07:25] sawmill. I went sawmill raising cotton and I liked it pretty good. I liked farming pretty good. [inaudible 00:07:32], you see? Hubert Laster: Better than sawmill? Dave Antilley: Yeah. I liked it pretty good. And I went out there and I'd go to work. I was up working some mornings have a half a day's work done before the other boys got up farming along there. So I had a good crop. I raised a pretty good crop every year. I raised 10, 12, 14 bails, sometimes 32 bails. And I done pretty good at farming. And my wife, she liked it. And if she had time, she'd come out there and help me and we went ahead. And I asked her I said, "Well," I said, "what you like best, sawmill or farming?" She said, "Well, we're doing all right." She said, "Let's just stay here." Hubert Laster: I think after a 12 hour day probably farming was easy? Dave Antilley: And Sunday, I was off on Sunday I had to get up and go to church on Sunday. And we done pretty good there farming. We didn't save much money but once in a while we saved a little. So one year I went down to the fellow I was trading with. I had 32 reels of cotton. And cotton went up that year to about 40-something cents. I don't remember exactly but it's 40-something cents a pound. So I went down and I said, "Mr. Haman, Mr. Haman Cohen," I said, "Mr. Haman Cohen," I says, "let's settle up this morning." "Well," he said, "I've got [inaudible 00:09:06] except two or three bails up there in the compress." "Well," I said, "you know what [inaudible 00:09:08]?" He said, "Yes, I [inaudible 00:09:10]." And I'd been buying on credit with him and I'd pay him off every year. So he said, "Well," he said, "Let me go figure it out." Went and figured it out. I owed him $250. And he owed me about $3008, I believe it was, $3008. He says, "Dave," he says, "that's a lot of money for you to take home." He says, "You better let me keep it." I said, "No, Mr. Haman, I said I want to keep myself." I said, "I'm going to [inaudible 00:09:47]." And he said, "All right, high golly!" He said, "Don't do that." He says, "I'll pay you all." I said, "Yeah," I said, "that's the way I want it." So he paid me all and then I paid him. He said, "Well," says, "that's all right." Say, "You be chill." He said, "You hide that money." And I come home, I brought the money home. Next morning my wife got up and jumped in the car and [inaudible 00:10:12] went to the bank. Well, I traded right on with him on credit. Every year [inaudible 00:10:21] always make a little more [inaudible 00:10:23] pay him. Some years I didn't make as much. Some years I made pretty good crop. So I [inaudible 00:10:30]. He tried to get me to come out [inaudible 00:10:32] farm with him. I said, "No, Mr. Haman." I said, "I got my own place and I'm my own boss." I said, "I'm pretty well satisfied." I said, "I just stay out here and farm." Hubert Laster: How many acres did you have? Dave Antilley: I had 40 acres. Hubert Laster: 40 acres. Dave Antilley: Yes, Sir. And but I didn't have it all then. Part of was in pastures. I had pastures [inaudible 00:10:54] milk [inaudible 00:10:54] my horses. And so he said, "Well, all right." He said, "If you don't come," he said, "that's all right." So I'd get a day or two off, catch up on my work, I'd go out and I'd help him a little, run the tractor for him or something. He tried to get me to come out pretty good. He had a Ford tractor. I'd go out there and plow with him and help him out. And he had a Ford. He must have had a sell 100 acres, working paid hands, [inaudible 00:11:32] hands and such as that. And he tried his best to get me to come out there and work with him. I said, "No, Mr. Haman." I said, "If I didn't have a job," I said, "I'd be glad to go work with you." I said, "I like you." I said, "I got a job." I said, "I think I'm doing all right." And he said, "Well," says, "if that's the way you feel about it," said, "there ain't nothing I can do about it, so." I said, "Well," I said, "that's the way I feel." I said, "There's no harm in telling the truth." He said, "No," he said, "that's right." So, he says, "Well," says, "yeah, we're taking [inaudible 00:12:08] if you want to come out here and farm." He said, "I want you to come out here and oversee farming." I said, "Well," I says, "I worked men and all such as that and followed men all day long." I said, "I'm just tired of that." I said, "I'd rather be my own boss. I'd rather just work on my farm." So he said, "Well, that's all right. That's fine." Hubert Laster: Mr. Antilley, it's been a pleasure visiting with you. So would you like to say goodbye? Dave Antilley: Goodbye. Hubert Laster: Goodbye. Thank you very much, Sir. Dave Antilley: Thank you.

Dave Antilley: Dave remembers his days as a young boy growing up on a farm and working as a farm hand. He came to own 40 acres of land as a farmer.

January 9, 2023

18. Dave Stafford

Transcript

David Dollar: Good morning again. In case you've just joined us, this is David Dollar on Memories. Today we're down in Marthaville at the home of Mr. Dave Stafford and Mr. Stafford is going to share some of his memories with us. Mr. Stafford, why don't we start things off by you just telling us a little about yourself, where you were born and something about your family? Mr. Stafford: Well, I was born in Rapides Parish. David Dollar: When were you born? Mr. Stafford: 1899. David Dollar: 1899. That was a good while ago, wasn't it? Mr. Stafford: I'm 77, will be 77 this coming July. David Dollar: Right. Right. My goodness. You were born in July, huh? Mr. Stafford: 3rd day. David Dollar: Almost the 4th. And the bicentennial year this year, huh? Well, I'll be. What were your folks doing when you were born?. Mr. Stafford: Best I can remember, they were farming. David Dollar: Farming, and I think you said some saw milling? Mr. Stafford: He left there and went to saw milling and then he come back to the farm, stayed a while longer. David Dollar: Talking to you and your wife a little bit earlier, I think you mentioned some pretty interesting things in your family tree. I think it was your great, great grandfather. No, your great grandfather. Who was he? Mr. Stafford: He was a Jackson. David Dollar: Right. And at one time, was the governor of the state. Right after the Civil War, I think? Mr. Stafford: He fought the Yankees. David Dollar: He fought them Yankees and then became governor later. Mr. Stafford: Become governor. David Dollar: Wait, now, I'm getting confused. That was Governor Wells, I think. The Jackson was on your mother's side. Mr. Stafford: Yes, sir. David Dollar: Governor Wells. Right. Okay. I've got my notes kind of confused. Thanks for clearing me up there. Also, tell me about your mom and dad. Where was your dad from originally? I don't think he was from around here, was he? Mr. Stafford: No, sir. He was from up north. David Dollar: I think you said New York City? Mr. Stafford: New York, up in there. City. David Dollar: And your mother was from where? Mr. Stafford: She was raised down in South Louisiana. David Dollar: But didn't she come over from France? Didn't you say that? She was- Mr. Stafford: Her mother was from France. David Dollar: ...French. And was raised in south Louisiana with other French folks, the Cajuns, down there. Well, I'll be. And they were doing some saw milling work, you said, down in Rapides Parish. Mr. Stafford: Saw milling and farming together. David Dollar: Little bit of everything. Mr. Stafford: When he was doing all that, we was just going to school running around like a bunch of young'uns. David Dollar: Yeah, like young'uns do. You said that you had kind of a little accident when you were about in the third grade. Tell me about that. I think you said a firecracker or something. What happened? Mr. Stafford: Yeah. Firecracker. Mama was sick. The doctor was visiting at home, you know? David Dollar: Right, right. Mr. Stafford: And Papa paid his doctor bills by the month. All you had to do was call him and he's come around to the house. He was there, and so he never did take any medicine along with him, but people there on the job had to go to his office. David Dollar: Right. Right. Mr. Stafford: Well, Papa was at work, so mama sent me. So I went and got the medicine. Then as I come back, right after Christmas, you know how young'uns get firecrackers. David Dollar: Got those firecrackers around Christmas especially. Mr. Stafford: One of them stems in there, you see. It failed to shoot when you threw it, so I was the fellow picked it up. Went back to the house, sat all the kids up against the wall. I sat that afire and it just spewed one time. I thought it went out. I gave it plenty of time to shoot. Had all my sisters and brothers and lined up. David Dollar: They were ready to watch it go off. Yeah. Mr. Stafford: So I went and got over it and blowed it. The first time I blowed her, she went off. David Dollar: Right in your face, huh? Mr. Stafford: Right in my face. David Dollar: You didn't lose an eye or anything, did you? Mr. Stafford: No. David Dollar: But it came real close, I bet. Mr. Stafford: My eyes is ruined. David Dollar: I bet that had something to do with it. Mr. Stafford: Yes. A month they said needed a [inaudible 00:04:28]. Doctor in Alexander said, "Now, Mrs. Stafford, I'm going to try my best to bring his eyesight back, but he's got..." David Dollar: Close call right there. Mr. Stafford: And said, "Don't be surprised if he don't. But I can tell you this, he'll never go to school." David Dollar: So you had to get out of school then because you couldn't read because of your eyes. Mr. Stafford: Because of my eyes. David Dollar: My goodness. Mr. Stafford: Said, "He may have enough eyesight to get about in the world. But as far as his education, you make him go to school, he's going to lose his eyes." David Dollar: Going to hurt his eyes. Strain his eyes. Mr. Stafford: You and your wife get together on this. And don't blame the kid. Don't get him all stirred up about it. If he goes to school, his eyes fail. The doctor said if you have to take him out, take him out. David Dollar: Let me interrupt you right here just a second, Mr. Stafford. We're going to pick up right here where we're leaving off right after this. We need to take a little commercial break. We'll be right back with Mr. Dave Stafford down in Marthaville after this message from People's Bank, our sponsor. Once again, this is David Dollar down in Marthaville today, visiting with Mr. Dave Stafford. We're out on his porch and it's real cool. Sun's going down while we're making this tape and it looks like rain tonight. We're going to go back kind of where we left off, Mr. Stafford. The firecracker... You couldn't go to school, so what did you do? Mr. Stafford: Just made the best of it I could. David Dollar: Uh-huh (affirmative). Mr. Stafford: And I didn't blame my folks with it. David Dollar: It was just one of those things that happened. Mr. Stafford: Just one of them things. David Dollar: Did you get a chance to help your dad work much after this since you weren't in school? Mr. Stafford: Yeah. I worked. Helped my dad. David Dollar: Saw milling, huh? Mr. Stafford: Saw milling, and he hauled the stuff on mules. I wasn't big enough, but I could shove the lumber down off the stack. The lumber stack was stacked flat. David Dollar: How old were you then? You were about- Mr. Stafford: 12 years old. David Dollar: ...10 or 12, and out there shoving those stacks of lumber. Mr. Stafford: I finally got big enough. Of course, I wasn't all that big then, but I got the job then at the Skidder. David Dollar: What is the Skidder now? Mr. Stafford: Gets logs of out of the lake. David Dollar: Oh yeah? Mr. Stafford: Water, about this deep. David Dollar: About up to your chest. My goodness. Mr. Stafford: 85 pounds on your shoulder. David Dollar: You had this thing on your shoulder and you were standing chest deep in the water? Mr. Stafford: My tongs weighed 85 pounds. David Dollar: And you were grabbing logs and they were about twice your size, I bet. Mr. Stafford: Them logs was [inaudible 00:07:16]. David Dollar: You said, I think another time, it sounds like we're talking to Calamity Jane here, some of the accidents you've had. Didn't a friend help you do in your ankle one time? Tell me about that. Mr. Stafford: Yeah. He come and visited me a lot. Played with me a lot. Help bring in wood and such as that until my foot got well. David Dollar: What happened when he hurt it? How did it happen? Mr. Stafford: He just shoved it over on me. David Dollar: What was it? You said a blow pipe. Mr. Stafford: A blow pipe. David Dollar: A blow pipe? Mr. Stafford: Yeah. From one mill to the another. David Dollar: Right. At the sawmill again. Mr. Stafford: So he helped me out a good deal. His daddy did... David Dollar: That thing caught on your ankle and almost took your foot off, you said, didn't it? And if hadn't had a doctor right there to put it back on, you'd probably been walking around of a peg or something. Mr. Stafford: I had about five or six men to hold me down. I just had to take it. David Dollar: What do you mean? They put it on right back there at the sawmill? Mr. Stafford: Right there on my daddy's front porch. David Dollar: My goodness. They didn't take you to the hospital, huh? Mr. Stafford: No. Didn't take me to the hospital. David Dollar: Where was the [crosstalk 00:08:29]. Mr. Stafford: The hospital was out of town. David Dollar: And you couldn't go, huh? Mr. Stafford: I couldn't go. David Dollar: My goodness. Wow. I tell you what, that sounds pretty frightening for a young man about, what, 12, 15 years old to be operated on the front porch with no anesthetic, just men holding you down. That sounds like something. Mr. Stafford: It was a job. David Dollar: Did you ever have any things that happened that were good? Sounds like we're talking about some of the really bad accidents that happened. What did y'all do... I tell you what, I know what young men do around here. Tell me about going fishing. You must've gone fishing sometime with your daddy. Mr. Stafford: I'd go once in a while, I didn't fish much. David Dollar: What about horseback riding? Mr. Stafford: Well, I wasn't too [inaudible 00:09:16] that. David Dollar: Or hunting? Mr. Stafford: I just walked. David Dollar: You just walked around in nature, huh? Seeing things. Mr. Stafford: When we went to a community on a big sawmill job, we'd just walk around that. David Dollar: Kind of look at things, huh? Mr. Stafford: And work. That's about all we knowed to do them days. Rest of the young'uns round the home there, they all go to school and I couldn't, so I stayed at the house. David Dollar: You stayed busy working all the time. Mr. Stafford: Oh yeah. Stayed busy. David Dollar: Well, I can understand that. Mr. Stafford: I ain't never been no burden to nobody. David Dollar: That's right. Always pulling, carrying your own weight and then some, I bet. Mr. Stafford: I took my own weight. I got up big enough to help my dad. He had a big family and I helped him all I could. Done it until I married. David Dollar: Then you had your own family to take care of. Mr. Stafford: That's right. And I helped until he got killed. I took my mother, seen after her. He had one boy left at home. He was nothing but a kid, didn't know nothing. David Dollar: So it's kind of been work for a long time, you had. Mr. Stafford: Yes. David Dollar: Well, I think that tells us about how things were when you were growing up and I think that's - Mr. Stafford: Pretty rough. David Dollar: ...a story for all of us, even in days today. We can remember times like that. We thank you. We're just about out of time and I'm going to need to put the little closing on our program with your permission. We thank you for having us out here at your lovely home in Marthaville and for sharing your memories with us.

Dave Stafford: Born in Rapides Parish in 1899. His parents were farmers and father worked at a sawmill. His great grandfather was the governor of Louisiana after the Civil War, Governor James Madison Wells. Because of an accident, he couldn’t see very well.

January 16, 2023

19. E.L. Roge

Transcript

David Dollar: Good morning. We're glad you've joined us for Memories today. David Dollar. I'm down the river visiting... I'm going to visit in just a few minutes with Mr. E.L. Roge, and we'll be back to start our program right after this message from our sponsor People's Bank and Trust Company. Hello, once again, in case you're just joining us, this is David Dollar down Cane River, visiting with Mr. E.L Roge. Mr. Roge, we thank you for having us in your home today and sharing memories with us. E.L. Roge: Well, I'm glad to have you in my home. And I hope I can be of some assistance to you. David Dollar: I'm sure you will. We like to start things off by talking about things that you remember earliest growing up. I'm sure you don't remember about being born and all that, but let's start about then, when and where you were born, and some things like a little family background and all. E.L. Roge: Well, I'll tell you I was born about 300 yards from where I live right now. My father owned the farm, and we lived on a farm there, and I was raised on the farm. Spent the biggest part of my life on the farm excepting about 20 years that I was off from home doing a lot of work after I grew up, but otherwise I've spent practically all my time- David Dollar: When were you born? What time was this? Which E.L. Roge: Year I was born in 1896. David Dollar: '96. E.L. Roge: The month before last I passed my 80th birthday. David Dollar: Okay. Sounds good. Congratulations on making those 80 years. E.L. Roge: Well, thank you. David Dollar: So your dad and your folks were farming here down Cane River, doing pretty much the same life that you've been doing, huh? E.L. Roge: Yeah, they did it in quite a bit different ways than what we do it now. In fact, I'm retired now. I don't farm, but the method of farming has changed quite a bit from then until now. David Dollar: Why don't we talk about that a little bit? What are some things that your dad did that you have come to see change or actually been a part of the change in farming methods now? E.L. Roge: Actually it's changed in a lots of different ways, but what you notice more so than anything else, when my father was farming, since I can first remember, that it was in the horse and mule days. They'd hook up one horse and maybe a pair of horses to a plow, they call it a turning plow, and break up the land, and they had some other small tool to pull by one animal, horse or mule, and they would use that. But they didn't have any mechanical planning, farming at all during that period of time. Everything was done the hard way, and it looked like the slowest way in the world. You'd plow all day long, and maybe you wouldn't get over seven acres of plowing with a pair of mules or horses. But now they have a mechanical for me. And these are implements they have now, they get over quite a few acres in a days time. I went back on the little river here about a couple of weeks ago, I looked at some of the farm back there that were using six and eight row equipment. And they told me that the fellow I talked with said that, well, he had planted 40 acres of, soy beans in three hours time. He had an eight row planter. David Dollar: What'd your dad have said about that? You think he'd ever think that could happen? E.L. Roge: No, he wouldn't have believed it. He wouldn't have believed it. And even I didn't believe it when the two-row cultivated first came out, those tractors. David Dollar: You thought that was amazing, huh? E.L. Roge: Yeah, I thought, well, while I'd watch one row, the other row would be plowed under maybe, but I didn't realize that the planner would place it just right so that if you cultivator was on this row correctly and set right, it would wouldn't have hurt the other row at all. David Dollar: So one of the big changes is seeing machines replacing animal labor, and two, all the worries. Your dad had to worry about making those roads straight. If they weren't straight and just right, it was his fault. Now you can kind of blame it on a machine or something. E.L. Roge: Yeah, that's right. And then too, any conversation that I had with this man, he said, well, he's not doing anything. He said they have planters and cultivators now that could take care of 24 rows at a time, and he said that even he's heard that they have up to 32 roles at one [inaudible 00:04:30]. David Dollar: I didn't know about that. That sounds amazing even to me, when I've grown up with all these fancy machines and all that. E.L. Roge: Well, it hasn't come to be practical, I guess, here in our part of the country, because, we're not out on a prairie or have large acres, but we have a lot of gates, and trees, and things like that, ditches and things of that kind to contend with here, and probably for that reason they haven't come here, but eventually I imagine they will be using them here. David Dollar: I guess so. Back to your dad. What did you and your dad do? How did he start you off learning the tricks of the trade, and farming, and all that? E.L. Roge: Well David, when I was nine years old, I went to school down here at Melrose and we had to walk and there was no school buses then. We had to walk to Melrose in the morning and walk back, which was about six miles a day then. And we were in school down there, and they had sharecroppers on farm then. My father had a family there that had gone off and left his crop half-finished which was in grass, and he didn't know what else to do, so he took us out of school to help clean that crop out with holes. And that is the beginning of my farming. Then I hadn't done any farm work at all, that is in field. Anything I did chores around the house, but didn't have never worked in the field. But after that, while he saw, I guess, that we worked so successfully, I'd say, my older brother and I, we had to do a lot of the field work after that. We took a hold, in other words, and helped him in the farm work. David Dollar: And been doing it ever since. E.L. Roge: Been doing it ever since, yeah. David Dollar: All the time. E.L. Roge: And it was done by man strength and awfulness then. Everything was done by man strength and awfulness. David Dollar: Okay. Sounds good. I'll tell you, let me interrupt this right here. Just a second. We need to have a little commercial break. David Dollar down the river, visiting with Mr. E.L. Roge, and we'll be right back to continue our visit right after this message from our sponsor People's Bank and Trust Company. Hello, once again, in case you're just joining us, this is David dollar. Today on Memories, we're down Cane River, visiting with Mr. E.L. Roge we've been talking about farming and some of the differences that he has seen in especially the implements and the methods of farming. Not so much in what was grown, though. I guess your family has always grown cotton, soybean, things like that. What was your dad growing around here? E.L. Roge: Well, at that time, cotton was a main crop. That was the money crop. But of course they had horses and mules, and they had the hogs and chickens to feed and everything of that kind, and people didn't buy their feed. They raised it then. They raised practically all the feed was corn. And they would raise the corn crop in the forest, and plant a large potato patch, and things like that. They didn't buy as much out of the stores as what they buy at now- David Dollar: You grew your own food in other words. E.L. Roge: Yeah, grew your own food. Yeah. And they'd plant maybe an acre in sugar cane, make syrup out of that. And that would help to make both ends meet, they [crosstalk 00:07:42]. They raised hogs, and cured the meat, and they'd have that for the year supply, and even have their own lard and things of that kind, raise the chickens on the yard, and have the eggs and different things that they needed. They didn't have to go to the store and buy it. David Dollar: Let me ask you this. You said the money was in cotton. Where and how did your dad go about marketing his cotton? Now was it local? Was there a gin here that he just turned his whole crop over to, and they did the processing work or... How did he go about making cotton in the ground pay off for his family, the whole process there? E.L. Roge: They would raise their crop, David. And they would, of course, when they picked the cotton, it was all handpicked, and it takes about 1600 pounds of seed cotton to make a bale of lint cotton. They take it to the gin, and gin out, and they'd wrap it, and they would ship it... My daddy would ship his cotton to New Orleans, most of it. David Dollar: How did he get it down there? E.L. Roge: Well, the most of the time with the ship be on freight, or if the river was low for the steamboat, couldn't come up, they would ship it by freight. Or if the ginners could catch the water high enough, the steamboat would pick it up right there at that gin. They were located right on river banks, and they would just load the seed and the cotton, and ship it on down to New Orleans if the water was high enough that the steamboat could come up Cane River. That was before the dam was put here in Cane River. David Dollar: Do you remember that, or just- E.L. Roge: Oh yeah. Yes. I've seen many a steamboat pass with bales of cotton and sacks of cotton seed. And we would run out there. That was a big scene for us. David Dollar: Oh I'm sure it was. E.L. Roge: We kids would run out there and watch that. And there was even one of the men fell off the steamboat one day, and- David Dollar: You saw that? E.L. Roge: And we thought sure the poor fellow was going to drown, but he said, "Slow that old steamboat up," and they picked him up, and everything was all right. We thought sure he was going to... It seemed like he was back there trying to grease that old stern wheel, and he fell off there. And the wheel didn't catch him, and he just stayed up and bobbed, he didn't try to swim anything. He just waited until they came and got him. David Dollar: That would've been scary for me. E.L. Roge: Well, it was! David Dollar: I'd be fighting to get out of the way of that wheel, I guarantee it. E.L. Roge: I guess he was too. David Dollar: But your dad would... They'd send it all down to New Orleans, and in turn, they would send back what? Cash money, or goods, or... How? E.L. Roge: Well, he'd send his cotton to what they call a commission house down there, and I forget the name of the commission house that he used, but anyways, they would hold the cotton there in storage on, [inaudible 00:10:22] to his order, which when he thought the market was high enough that he wanted to sell the cotton, and he just ordered them to sell the cotton, and they would sell the cotton, and whatever they would receive, they'd take that commission out of it, and then sent him the check. Of course, most of the time, cotton didn't bring but from 5 to 80 cents a pound at that time- David Dollar: Ooh goodness, that's other thing that's changed a lot isn't it? E.L. Roge: I guarantee you it changed. Because sometimes and even now that cotton is about 75 cents a pound- David Dollar: Sure changed. E.L. Roge: ... but everything else was cheaper though. David Dollar: The food in the goods that he in turn had to buy were a lot- E.L. Roge: You could buy 24 pounds of meal, then for 25 cents and 25 pounds sack of flour about 35 cents. And it's about 10 times that now, and everything else in proportion, [inaudible 00:11:10] eating well, even cars. I remember when we first started buying those old Model T cars, I think they were selling $375 a car, and of course you can't buy Model-T's anymore, but you buy a Ford now- David Dollar: Oh you can't buy any kind of car for $375, not even a bad used on. E.L. Roge: No, that's right. David Dollar: I'll tell you! That is something. Mr. Roge, We're just about out of time. We'd like to try to close our program with what we call a closing memory. Something of importance to you, maybe that you remember. Something real special that kind of stands out in your mind. Maybe one time you did something really good or got in trouble for doing something. I wonder if there's anything that stands out in your mind that you could share with us now. E.L. Roge: I've had a lot of experience that's happened to me in my life. When I was a child, I wasn't too good as a child. I was mischievous. And my dad had to worked me over pretty often. And I guess I need it every time. I remember he had an old stack of shingles out there in the yard. And when I'd get into mischief, he thought I needed it, he'd send me out there and get a shingle, and I knew what that meant. He was going to put the shingle on me, and not on the house. So I did something wrong one night, and he told me to go out there and get him a shingle. And I did. I went out there and got him shingle, but I put a couple of them in the seat of my little pants back then, and he caught me up, and he rapped me with the shingle out and brought him and I yell as loud as I could and left out. And he, as I left, I heard him say, "That sounded good. He sure did sound nice." He didn't know he'd beaten on the shingles instead of me. David Dollar: Did he ever find out? E.L. Roge: I don't think I ever told him. David Dollar: He'd probably smack you again. E.L. Roge: I don't think I ever told him. Get into a lot of trouble [inaudible 00:13:05] a little kid. Would get up on the old shingle roof, flip those shingle outside first, and we'd get up there and slide down a shingle roof. And he'd tell us not do it, but we'd get on the other side of the barn and slide down that new shingle roof, and my poor mother, when she put us to bed, she'd had to pick those splinters out our seat there at night. [inaudible 00:13:31]. David Dollar: Guys getting into mischief. Well, Mr. Roge, we certainly thank you for sharing all of this today about farming, and mischief, and everything else. E.L. Roge: Well, I enjoyed having you. David Dollar: I had a good visit down here. Thank you very much. E.L. Roge: You're quite welcome. David Dollar: If any of you folks at home have memories you'd like to share, we'd like to hear from you. The retired senior volunteer program office is helping us keep our schedule, and their number is 352-8647. If you've got any problem with your finances or you know somebody who does whether retired people, part of our program here or otherwise, why don't you talk to the folks at People's Bank? Give Roger Williams a call or any of the folks over there. They'd like to give you a hand. They're there, and that's their business. That's what they're all about. Give them a call. We thank you for joining us today. This has been David Dollar visiting with Mr. E.L. Roget down Cane River. You all have a nice day.

E.L. Roge: Mr. Roge’s father owned a farm. He was born in 1896 around Cane River and spent most of his life working on a farm. Talks about the shift between animals and machines plowing the farm.

January 23, 2023

20. Ed Harper

Transcript

Jim Colley: This is Jim [Colley 00:00:03], and today we're visiting on Memories with Mr. Ed Harper. And we'll be talking with Mr. Harper about his memories after this message from People's Bank & Trust. Mr. Harper, we're glad to welcome you to the Memories program, and we look forward to talking with you about some things. Ed Harper: I don't mind talking to y'all. Anything I know, I'll be glad to talk to you. Jim Colley: Well, I'm glad to hear that. You've been out here an awful long time. Ed Harper: Oh, 86 years. Jim Colley: That's an awful long time. Ed Harper: I'll soon be 87. Jim Colley: Going on 87. Ed Harper: January the first. Jim Colley: Happy birthday, in advance. We were talking just a few minutes ago about what it was like during Prohibition out here. Do you remember Prohibition in Louisiana? Ed Harper: Well, I'll tell you. Really they called it Prohibition. You couldn't go to a saloon and buy it, but you could go anywhere else, nearly, you wanted to and find it. In Louisiana and Arkansas both. You could find that stuff just anywhere if you'd keep your mouth shut. Jim Colley: No problem. Ed Harper: No problem at all, if you just keep your mouth shut, and tend to your own business, not tell on them, you can get whiskey anywhere, nearly. Jim Colley: Well, where'd you have to go to get it? Ed Harper: I'd go to them bootleggers. Jim Colley: Where did they get it? Ed Harper: They made a lot of it, most of it. Course there were some now ... Well now, back in the areas, there was some wet areas and dry areas. And I lived in the dry area one time, and there's an old boy, he'd drive his team, they didn't have trucks, and he'd take a wagon and go over to Monroe and buy it by the wagon load and bring it over. I want to tell you, one time, and I'm going to tell you this. Now, this here sheriff's dead or I wouldn't tell it. A friend of mine, here, was going out there to get us a quart. And he come by the sheriff. He knowed where he was going, he says, "Tell him to send me a quart." We just had us a horse and buggy. That's all we had. We were going right out there, and he got over there, and that old boy knew him. And he went out there, and he come [inaudible 00:02:06] hen. He went out where had a lot of hen nests. Had built upside of a wall, and [inaudible 00:02:13] pulling them quarts out from them hen nests. Had it hid out there. I told him I wanted to get some of them chickens, that laid them quarts. But that was [inaudible 00:02:23] we carried that sheriff, that next day. [inaudible 00:02:26] high sheriff, carried him back his quart of liquor. And after they got it dry all over, why they'd run it out of Arkansas, and a lot of them made it. I had some friends up there that made liquor all the time. And they'd make them out in the woods. Most of it, what we bought around Haynesville and Homer, and they was run out of Arkansas. Jim Colley: That's where the big stills were. Okay. Ed Harper: Yeah. That's where they made it up there. They had their big stills up there. And they really knowed how to make it, too. Jim Colley: Was that as good as stuff you get nowadays? Ed Harper: I'm going to frankly tell you, I believe some of it was better. Some of it was aged better. They aged it a little better. But some wasn't. Just like anything else. You can get good, and you can get bad. Jim Colley: But you never had any problem with it? Ed Harper: No, I knowed where to go to get it, and they knowed what kind I wanted, and so they always had that. And if it wasn't no good, they told me. Jim Colley: So it was a matter of knowing who to trust, and who to believe. Ed Harper: That's like everything else. Just like I imagine you doing trading at the store. You got a regular store you do most of your business with, and that's the way we had. We had our pet bootlegger, and we'd always go to him. Jim Colley: Friend of the family. Ed Harper: Yeah, that's right. Jim Colley: I see. Ed Harper: In other words, he knew we'd keep our mouths shut, see? Jim Colley: Apparently, the law wasn't much trouble for them. Ed Harper: Boy, some of them they'd get after some, but they had their pets just like everybody else. I know that sheriff did. I know that. That old boy, we give him that quart of liquor, you know. You'd buy it in barrels, you see, in wood barrels, and we'd come out there and bottle it, get the bottles and bottle it. That barrel stuff, it's [inaudible 00:04:14] was better after you bottled it. I don't know. But we could get liquor anywhere we wanted to [inaudible 00:04:22]. Jim Colley: I can understand that. Mr. Harper we're going to have to take a break, and hear a word from our sponsors, People's Bank and Trust. But we'll be right back. We're talking on Memories with Mr. Ed Harper. And we've just finished talking about Prohibition. I'd like to ask you about another part of life, that was building houses, and old mud chimneys and things. How did you build a mud chimney, or a dirt chimney? Ed Harper: I'd first cut a hole in the house, where they fit for the fireplace [inaudible 00:04:57]. Like they would for a brick chimney. They done that part just like they do today. They left the opening there. And then they set four wooden posts up, and they'd tie them together with pieces of wood. They'd round it up in auger holes, and pass them together. And they'd get out there and dig them up a bunch of clay, and mix it up with straw. And if they could, they usually use crabgrass for straw, dead. And they made what they called [inaudible 00:05:31], and they'd throw them up there, and they'd drop them sticks all up with that clay. They'd just put them up there, and bend them over. Just like you're just going that way. And they put it all up side of that post. Where the [inaudible 00:05:47] part could catch the post [inaudible 00:05:49]. And they made the backs and the jambs, just like they did the brick. Now, I think that's where they got the pattern of the brick [inaudible 00:06:00]. And they would draw just as good as any chimney you ever seen. Now, the only thing about it, that power in there enough, that kept all the [inaudible 00:06:15] out of the posts, and they'd last for a long, long time. I don't know how long. But I never know one to fall down. We never did stay that long in the place. Jim Colley: Your family moved around quite a bit? Ed Harper: My father was always buying and selling place. He'd only half [inaudible 00:06:33]. He'd sell and buy, and move about. Jim Colley: How many people were there in your family? Ed Harper: Let's see. There was ... I lost baby brother and the other one. Then I lost one in 1919. And that left me and one boy, and five sisters. So I might as well say that there was about eight of us grown, growed up. Jim Colley: That was quite a few folks to move around. Ed Harper: Yeah. But we moved them. There's not nothing to do, but haul them in the wagon. Jim Colley: You didn't have a car? Ed Harper: No. We didn't have a truck. Dad never did own a truck. Never owned a car. Jim Colley: He got around in a wagon? Ed Harper: Either that or horse and a buggy. He had a buggy. Jim Colley: How did your mother cook for that large family? Ed Harper: That was easy. She had that big old chimney there, and she'd put that turnip greens, and mustard, and all that stuff that she boiled. They had a rod run across that, over the head, above the fire in there. And she'd hang them things, maybe have two or three pots of them on there. And she'd put them under there, and build a fire under them pots, they'd just hang up there and boil, just like everything. When they'd make bread, they had a great big old skillet. They had big ones and little ones. They had a big old skillet, just like that, and it had legs on it, down there. And they'd put [inaudible 00:07:59] fire under there. And they'd use ash wood if they could get it. And she'd sit that skillet on there, and then put that bread, or biscuit, or whatever she was making in there, and had a lid went over there, just stir it up, and she'd put fire all on top of that thing. Then she had a rod of a thing, she'd hook that lid, had a hook on top of it, she'd hook that and raise that up, and [inaudible 00:08:24] them stuff, just ... When it got done, she'd take her out. You understand what I'm talking about? Just like you had something on top of the lid, just pick it up there, and she'd look in there, and set [inaudible 00:08:33]. Jim Colley: So cooking wasn't much problem? Ed Harper: Oh no, we had about ... Shoot, there was one time there we had four or five hired hands there all the time, and we'd cook for them. Of course, I had a sister big enough to help mother. But they cooked a great big old pot full of the thing. I expect it hold two and a half three gallons. I don't know. It was about that big around, and that hot. I mean, when they cooked full of stuff, they had [inaudible 00:08:57]. Jim Colley: Mr. Harper, I hate to cut this off, but we're almost at the end of our time. We're glad you came. We appreciate you sharing your memories with us. They mean a lot to us. Ed Harper: Well, I hope [inaudible 00:09:07]. Jim Colley: I'm sure you did.

Ed Harper: Mr. Harper remembers the Prohibition era, and getting his alcohol from bootleggers. He also remembers how to build mud chimneys.

January 11, 2024

21. Ada Rachal

Transcript

David Dollar: Hello again, David Dollar, this morning, visiting all memories with Ms. Ada Rachal. Ms. Rachal, we thank you for joining us today. Why don't we start things off with you telling us a little bit about yourself and your family and some history and things. Ada Rachal: Thank you. David Dollar: Okay. Ada Rachal: My father was named Nester Greeter, either your own layer styles, and they had quite a big family. They married, they lived together until death, for around 60 some years. David Dollar: Oh goodness. Where were they living at the time? In other words where- Ada Rachal: Right about in this neighborhood. Never did move far away until later. David Dollar: Right around Shady Grove, huh? Ada Rachal: Around Shady Grove, uh-huh (affirmative). He reared a big family. My mother was the mother of 18 children. David Dollar: Ooh, goodness. Ada Rachal: Five sets twins. David Dollar: Five sets of twins. Ada Rachal: Five sets of twins and four sets of- David Dollar: My goodness. Ada Rachal: Four sets of twins in succession. David Dollar: I can't believe that. Ada Rachal: It's real, though. It's real. David Dollar: Goodness gracious. Ada Rachal: Five sets of twins. And she had 18 children. And I'm thankful to say that reared, those children, and none of us are that in no serious trouble, and never had to go to jail. David Dollar: My goodness. Just by odds alone, out of 18 people, you could just about say, one of them at least, was going to get into some kind of trouble. Ada Rachal: That's right. David Dollar: But y'all managed to stay out of it. Well that's good. Ada Rachal: I always said I loved my daddy. I loved both of them. I love my daddy. He was very interested in children learning to read the Bible. He couldn't read other books. But the Bible, he could really read it. And he had a big dining table, he'll sit with us around the table two or three times a week, and how he got all the testaments he had, and the Bible story books, I don't know how he got them, but he had them. And he was sitting with us around the table and have us all read with him. Learning how to read the Bible. And he would explain it to us. Made a pretty good living, or some may call it a hard time now what we went through, but we all appreciated the things that our parent doing to us. David Dollar: Oh I bet so. Ada Rachal: And grow the nice crop, and planted peas and corn, and everything. David Dollar: What all were they growing then? Just things for, like vegetables or doing cotton too? Ada Rachal: Cotton, too. Big, big cotton crops. And we worked in the field. I learned to use every plow the boy use. David Dollar: Oh goodness. Ada Rachal: I plowed along with the boys. David Dollar: So there wasn't that much difference between the children there. Ada Rachal: It wasn't. The girls and the boys worked together. David Dollar: Not boys doing this and girls doing that, you did whatever needed to be done. Ada Rachal: You did whatever they done. Cut wood whole, pick cotton, plow, do all of those things. David Dollar: Goodness gracious. Ada Rachal: And I loved it. My mother was very conscious about seeing that we had a plenty to eat, regardless of what it was. If it was nothing but peas and bread. David Dollar: There's going to be enough of it there. Ada Rachal: Plenty of that. David Dollar: Right. Ada Rachal: And she was very careful in dealing with the children, wouldn't just treat one. She was a good seamstress. She could sew, make clothes on her fingers and do things like that. But the real thing that I loved to do was to go to school whenever I could, whenever that we had school. We didn't have but three months of school. David Dollar: Oh yeah? Ada Rachal: Uh-huh (affirmative). David Dollar: When did you have school? How old were you when you first started? Ada Rachal: I was six years old. David Dollar: Six, okay. Ada Rachal: I was six, mm-hmmm. David Dollar: And where was the school? Here in the community? Ada Rachal: Here in the community. Up there around [inaudible 00:03:38]. And we go to school. We go from old houses where it wasn't nobody living in. And we'd have school in a old house and in the church house. David Dollar: What about the teacher? Where did he or she come from? Ada Rachal: Oh, well maybe out of town, somewhere like that. David Dollar: I know I've heard, talked to several folks around here and other places, too, how the parents would have to get together and get up the money to hire the teachers.

Ada Rachal: That's right. Sometimes. So we have public school. If it's got to be three months and if their parents seeing that they need children back in the crops, they would take them back in the crop. Maybe one of the trustees go in and talk with the school board member and tell them that they the need the children back in school, call it the vines and weed growing up in the corn and need to week it out. David Dollar: So they kind of worked with the teacher and the school board, too. Ada Rachal: Oh, they did. They did. We worked together.

David Dollar: Well that's good. Ada Rachal: We went to school and I did love to go to school. I learned many songs in school. David Dollar: Oh yeah, like to sing? Ada Rachal: Just like to sing. We've had many different recreations of concerts, you know, have concerts, some called drill. David Dollar: Now wait. Tell me about these concerts. Do you remember any, you know, really well that you could kind of tell me about or tell all of them?

Ada Rachal: So yeah. See we'd have a different...we'd have bloom drills in the concert or you the band drill. Or sometimes we have a flag drill and representing the United States. We'd have a flag drill. David Dollar: What did you do in these concerts and drills? Ada Rachal: Well, we'd go around in circles and go round when [inaudible 00:05:27] come in, he'd make it very beautiful. Look like it was very following. You know, you're going around. David Dollar: Kind of marching around. Ada Rachal: Kind of marching around. David Dollar: Yeah. Ada Rachal: Some go one way, some go, then they meet and get together and go around again. It was beautiful. David Dollar: Who drew all these together? Who put them together? Ada Rachal: The teacher. David Dollar: The teacher did. Well, my goodness. Kind of like the marching bands today, like at football games. Ada Rachal: That's right, that's right. Something like that. David Dollar: So y'all were doing that, huh? Ada Rachal: That's right, we were doing that, in fact sometimes I look at it now I say, "Oh, we used to do something like that." But wasn't using decent instruments at that time, we'd be singing. We didn't have no band and nothing to play. But we would sing and keep music with that way. You know, it makes me very instrumental, and I love that. And I still have some poems that I still remember, that I said when I was going to school. David Dollar: Can you remember one you can tell us right now? You remember? Why don't you do that? Ada Rachal: After school and I got married when I was 17 years old. And I had done said this speech before. And so, "I know a wee couple that live in a tree, and in they high branches, their home you could see. The bright summer came, and the bright summer went. Their [inaudible 00:06:36] gone, but they never paid rent. The parlor, whose lined, it was the softest of wool. That kitchen was warm, and their pantry was full. Three little babes peeped out at the skies, you never saw darlings so pretty and shy. When winter came on with his frost and his snow, they cared not a bit if they heard the wind blow. All wrapped in fur they all lie down to sleep, but always spring how the bright eyes will peep." David Dollar: Oh yeah. Well that is might good. When did you learn that? Ada Rachal: Oh, I learned that when I was about 15 years old. David Dollar: Goodness. You've got quite a memory there. Ada Rachal: Oh, about 15 years old or whatever would go on in school, I would kind of keep it in mind and then songs I kept them wrote down, On the Blue Ridge Mountain of Virginia, Come on Nancy and Put Your Best Dress On. And another one, let's see, it's I Have a Friend Far Away, Far Away. David Dollar: Just all of them. You really enjoyed all of that. Ada Rachal: Mandalay, Mandalay. Yes, I enjoyed all that. I rehearsed it very much after I was married. David Dollar: I'll tell you what we need to take a short commercial break right here. We'll be right back visiting with Ms. Ada, Rachal this morning, right after our message from People's Bank and Trust Company, our sponsor. ----------------------- Hello, once again, in case you've just joined us David Dollar, today down in Shady Grove, visiting with Ms. Ada Rachal. Ms. Rachal, we've been talking about school and work and family, and all that. I'd like to ask you a little bit more about the family. Now, when was it that you were born and how did, how are you age-wise in relations to your brother and sisters, all 18 of them or 17 others, I guess?

Ada Rachal: Well I was born in March 17, 1898. David Dollar: 1898, okay. Ada Rachal: 1898. And it was about five older than me. And I was a twin, my twin is still living. He's living in San Francisco. David Dollar: Well I'll be. Ada Rachal: His name is Lee [inaudible 00:08:49]. David Dollar: I see. Ada Rachal: And we was a set of twins. Five sets. And I was one of them. David Dollar: So you had all these twins. Was it very much trouble for your mother or for you keeping up with twins, aren't two new babies a lot harder to keep up with than one new baby? Ada Rachal: It didn't seem like it was hard because always some older. It's about three or four was older than the first set of twins. Then we would take care of the baby- David Dollar: So your mom always had help. Ada Rachal: Had help. We would take care of them. And after I grew , around nine or 11 years old, well, that was my job taking care of the babies, too. And then cook and feed the babies and cook for my father and mother while he was at work. David Dollar: So you're an old hand- Ada Rachal: I'm an old hand. David Dollar: At keeping up with children and keeping house, and- Ada Rachal: Then I did midwife work for about 41 years. David Dollar: Oh really? Ada Rachal: I did. David Dollar: Right around here? Ada Rachal: I delivered many babies around here, [inaudible 00:09:42]. David Dollar: Well, I'll be. Ada Rachal: I started working when I was 29 years old and I quit when I was 70. David Dollar: You had practice doing that, too, huh? Ada Rachal: It was just a gift God gave me. And then I had a book that I'd read and my mother a doctor book called A Family Book, and I read that book and learned how to do what it says how to treat them all, and they want to do. And I went about that. After going into the work, I got quite a bit of experience, and working with doctors, too, when they had to call the doctor in the home. And I worked right along with him. Man didn't need to tell me- David Dollar: Learned with him and help him. Ada Rachal: I worked so diligently with that, and loved the job so well to Dr. Reed, or from [inaudible 00:10:23] she says now, but he's wanted me to leave my work from home and follow him. Turned around said, "I'd make a registered nurse out of you." David Dollar: My goodness. Ada Rachal: And I was anxious to, but [inaudible 00:10:32] said, "No, I married you to take care of me and my business." So that's why I didn't go into that. [crosstalk 00:10:41]. David Dollar: Well that sure is interesting. Ada Rachal: I worked until I was 70. David Dollar: And without the up-to-date hospitals and transportation service we've got today, folks like you are very much needed in communities not real close to big hospitals like in [inaudible 00:10:55]. Lady had to have a baby, she couldn't get in the wagon and head for [inaudible 00:11:00]. Ada Rachal: Well at my age I would be very interested in helping out anywhere now. I loved it. I felt like that was my calling. David Dollar: I bet you help. A lot of people felt that was your calling to help them out and their babies. Ada Rachal: I'm sure I delivered around 500 babies. David Dollar: Oh goodness. That is something. Ms. Rachal, we're just about out of time Ada Rachal: And then in two or three families, I delivered all of their babies. David Dollar: The whole family, huh? Ada Rachal: They have 10 or 11 kids, and I delivered all of them. David Dollar: And you were there for all of them. Ada Rachal: That's right. David Dollar: Oh, goodness. Again, we're just about out of time. Let me ask you for your closing memory that you wanted me to remind you about your grandma. Why don't you tell us about that? Ada Rachal: Oh yes, I'll be glad to tell that. My grandmother, she was very good Christian woman. And she said God revealed to her that she had only five more years to live. Well she told that after the death of one of her grandchildren and she say, "Well, I got five more years to live." Said, "It has been revealed to me that I live five more years." And sure enough, at five years she passed. She had cancer. She had about five cancers, and she lived two years off and on, on the bed. And right up to the time she say she would leave us when she did. David Dollar: She knew what was going on. Ada Rachal: Yeah, she knew what was going on. I said, a person with a Christian experience, God do reveal things to them. And when we live close to Him, He's always with us and He will give us what to know, what He want us to do, and what's going to happen. David Dollar: Well, amen. That's a very fine closing memory and the whole visit this morning has been quite nice. And we thank you for sharing all this with us today. Ada Rachal: Yeah. Thank you. David Dollar: Okay.

Ada Rachal talks about growing up in Natchitoches including her experiences with family, work, and school.

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