Audio
John and Rose Cunha
Transcript
SIDE A
Darcie Luce : [00:00] Today is November 28, 1993 and my name is Darcie Luce and I have Gail Lester here assisting me in interviewing John Cunha and his wife, Rose Cunha. We're just doing this just because --------------- to help also with giving programs for future to help the rangers doing interpreting to the public and to tell the public a little more about some of the legends and the aspects of the dairy ranching and that kind of thing.
Interviewer 2: [00:40] You don’t want to be telling the wrong stories. I don’t want to give them the wrong impressions too. I think part of the thing is that people come out here and they just see the military. Cause there aren’t any buildings . . . many buildings standing from the diary ranching time. So, they get the impression that the only thing that's been out here is the military.
Cunha: [00:57] Military.
Interviewer: [01:00] And that's not true.
Cunha: [01:02] This ranch over here, everything's gone. Where Sam Silva(?) was. And dairy ranch, everything's gone over there too. Nothing left there. I can remember buildings here. Especially Sam's had a big ranch over here. Where the blunt ---------- where the riding stable is up in that valley there. Many times, I came over those hills in that place.
Interviewer: [01:29] Your ranch is only standing because you --------------
Cunha: [01:34] Yeah. The horses were there, yeah. Had houses there. I want to tell you about that house. Don't want that to go in there. A----------- years ago we come to Tennessee Valley, we didn't have electricity. No electricity in the Valley. So, everything was powered by kerosene or gasoline engines. My mother used to cook on a kerosene stove and one year she was doing some cleaning, not at the house, but we were going to hire somebody. And she turns around and looks up at the house and the house was all gone up in smoke. And I was at school. I come home from school that day just in my school clothes and had to go to work in my school clothes. So, we didn’t have any other place to stay or anything, so we had to build another house. So, we're poor as church mice at the time. We didn't have anything. Over in Alto there was a . . . used to be where the electric trains . . . years ago they had a substation there to run the electric trains – for years and years – all electric trains around there. The fifth rail. So, my dad bought that house. He bought two houses over there. Me and my brother – we tore that house down, the two houses. Took all the nails out. Hauled them over to Tennessee Valley, and the house is there, Darcie. We built it. Me and my brother built it with another man that knew a little bit about carpenter work. We built the whole house – a two-bedroom house for $4,500.
Interviewer: [03:29] How old were you when you built that?
Cunha: [03:31] Oh God, I don't know. Fifteen, sixteen.
Interviewer: [03:34] So young.
Cunha: [03:38] Yeah. Me and my brother.
Interviewer: [03:41] Is that the house that Laura Lopez lives in?
Cunha: [03:43] That's the house that Laura lives. And the house down below - that's my grandmother's. You know down in the lower part of the ranch where the park is.
Interviewer: [03:51] The Spanish-style house?
Cunha: [03:54] Yeah, right down by the cypress trees. Right there. Lived there.
Interviewer: [04:04] Neat. So now we know where the woods and that old house is found. All the way -------------------.
Cunha: [04:15] I don't know. You ask me some questions. I don't know what to actually say.
Interviewer: [04:19] Okay. The first Cunhas that moved out here were your grandparents?
Cunha: [04:25] My grandparents.
Interviewer: [04:27] And they came out here in . . . ?
Cunha: [04:30] I don't know. Eighteen something I guess.
Interviewer: [04:33] Late eighteen hundreds?
Cunha: [04:38] Yeah. Our name is Cunha, but my grandfather was . . . see the name Cunha translated to American is a woods. Just woodlands. My middle name is Ferrereo(?) which translated is a blacksmith. When my grandparents came out, they were in Tennessee Valley here, and he was a little bit of a guy they tell me. I never did see him, but they told me. And they called him "little male" or "male Ferrenia(?)", small. And he went by that name all the time because he was that way, from the old country – we're that way – great for nicknames or changing things around. By that name all the time cause he was that way.
Interviewer: [05:25] So the grandparents came out here together?
Cunha: [05:28] Yeah, from the Island of St. George. A little village, like a little small town around here called St. Anthony. That's weird. The Machado’s were here yesterday. They're from the same island.
Interviewer: [05:51] Yeah.
Cunha: [05:52] Yeah, they're from the same island. But a different . . . we call them in Portuguese, "fragzia(?)" – a village.
Interviewer: [06:02] So your grandparents came out here and they were the first ones to live on that ranch over there?
Cunha: [06:07] ---------- yeah.
Interviewer: [06:09] And then they had your father or . . . ?
Cunha: [06:13] Yeah, three boys and a girl.
Interviewer: [06:15] And they all grew up on the ranch?
Cunha: [06:17] …. My uncle Joe, John ------------------------ yeah.
Interviewer: [06:27] Then your father met your mother here somewhere?
Cunha: [06:30] My mother was from Pescadero.
Interviewer: [06:32] And they inherited the ranch or how did they . . . ?
Cunha: [06:35] Yeah, we took it on as a family deal. And then we took it over when my grandmother was there. And then when my grandmother passed away, it was a family deal, and you know how a family deal is. One wants this and one wants that and so that's when we moved out of there. We moved over to Alto which my grandparents also had that ranch where Enchanted Knolls is today.
Interviewer: [07:08] How did they, they ran two separate ranches?
Cunha: [07:13] Enchanted Knolls years ago . . . this seems awful – out of line, but years ago Enchanted Knolls you could . . . they used to bring hay to the ranchers in barges and you wouldn't believe it by seeing it today, the barges used to come up and there was water all around – around that island. See now where Enchanted Knolls is now towards facing Strawberry, that's been all filled in – where the highway is. You know where that is? That's all been filled in through there.
Interviewer 2: [07:46] Yes, and I'm not sure where Enchanted Knolls is, but I, Dorothy Silva talks about the barges.
Cunha: [07:53] Yeah.
Interviewer: [07:55] Is that near Coyote -------- at all?
Cunha: [08:00] Oh no.
Interviewer 2: [08:01] Kind of where where the heliport is?
Cunha: [08:04] No, no. That's Manzanita.
Interviewer 2: [08:06] Okay.
Cunha: [08:11] We used to call it Manzanita at the time. Enchanted Knolls is right at . . . you know where the Strawberry Shopping Center is?
Interviewer 2: [08:14] Uh huh.
Cunha: [08:15] Well just across the highway.
Interviewer 2: [08:18] Kind of near where Goodman's is.
Cunha: [08:20] Yeah, above Goodman's. That's Enchanted Knolls.
Interviewer 2: [08:22] And that's all filled?
Cunha: [08:24] That's all been filled in there. Like there's apartments there now. Condos or apartments ---------------------------.
Rose: [08:28] Homes.
Cunha: [08:29] Homes in there and it's all been filled.
Rose: [08:34] Across from Longs, you know where Long’s Drug Store is. That's Enchanted Knolls. Right above that.
Interviewer 2: [08:46] Oh. Yeah. Right
Interviewer: [08:49] So they had two separate ranches. They ran both of them?
Cunha: [08:53] Yeah we had both places. We moved . . . we had both for a while. We had another ranch over there, but it didn't belong to us. They called it Tunnel Ranch where Eddie McGuire School is today. My dad run that that for a while. And then the one where Enchanted Knolls is. And then when it got closed in, there were so many houses, and then they wanted to build a road. See there was no overpass there going on Highway 113. You know where the overpass is now? Going to San Francisco on 101 and then you go to Tiburon from Mill Valley? Well there was a stop sign there years ago. Many a wreck I've seen there. Great God, stop signs. And we were there and then we kept getting closed in. So we had to move. And we moved to where today is Peacock Gap. Do you know where Peacock Gap is?
Interviewer 2: [09:58] Yes.
Cunha: [09:59] By San Rafael.
Interviewer 2: [10:02] Go out towards McNears.
Cunha: [10:04] McNears. That's 25 hundred acres in there. And that's what Peacock Gap is today. That's where we had the ranch when we sold, quit dairy business. My dad sold out. My brother went to work for the phone company and I went to work for the oil company.
Interviewer 2: [10:15] About what time period was that?
Cunha: [10:18] We sold out up there on October 4, 1955. We had 410 head of cattle.
Interviewer 2: [10:27] So you had all these . . . three different ranches that you ran for a while and your grandparents ran and then eventually consolidated it all into Peacock Gap.
Cunha: [10:36] We moved up there. That was the last. Yeah, that was the last spot we were in.
Interviewer: [10:42] That seems like a . . . that's pretty spread out. To be running three different ranches in three different spots.
Cunha: [10:47] My dad . . . this was long before the roads, the freeway now you'd take to go to San Rafael and to go to San Anselmo, Larkspur, San Rafael and to go to Santa Rosa – my dad had a dairy for a year in Santa Rosa.
Interviewer: [11:02] Really?
Cunha: [11:03] But it was so far away – to get the milk to San Francisco it didn't pay. We had a beautiful place up there. The home… I can still remember it. I was just a kid. Big mirror you know. You'd pull it down and it'd be a bed. Pull it up and it'd be a mirror. Size of the whole , I can remember that, yeah… That was in Santa Rosa in Bennet Valley. I go up there quite a bit. The business I'm in now. I think of that just about every time I go up in that area.
Interviewer: [11:40] Did you . . . did your grandparents have their own dairy business or did they working for other people?
Cunha: [11:47] No, no. It was their own.
Interviewer: [11:49] Did they have . . . what was their name? Cunha Dairy?
Cunha: [11:54] Oh yeah. Just our name. We never had any ---------
Interviewer: [11:58] Nickname?
Cunha: [12:00] No.
Rose: [12:01] Didn't have any regulations.
Cunha: [12:04] No. My dad used to tell me stories of years ago in Sausalito when they delivered milk. My dad and the Rosa family. There were no bottles like this.
Interviewer: [12:15] Right. What did they . . . ?
Cunha: [12:17] Horse and wagon. In a ten-gallon milk can. And you wanted a quart of milk, or two quarts of milk you'd come out with your pitcher and you had a measure on the wagon. You'd pour a quart or two – pour it into your pitcher and you'd go home.
Interviewer: [12:33] Oh really?
Interviewer 2: [12:34] So folks were coming right up to you in the dairy?
Cunha: [12:40] The wagon, horse and wagon.
Interviewer 2: [12:41] The wagon.
Cunha: [12:42] Yeah, horse and wagon.
Interviewer 2: [12:44] Where would you take the wagon? Where would the wagon be when they'd do that?
Cunha: [12:47] They'd go around just like a route. Delivery milk route years ago.
Interviewer 2: [12:50] Oh I see.
Cunha: [12:51] Just like today they drop off quart of milk. But then was no bottles.
Interviewer: [13:01] Was it straight from the ranch right here in the can. Straight to people's doors basically.
Cunha: [13:09] Yeah. There was no pasteurization or none of that jazz like today. God no.
Rose: [13:17] And they lived to be 100.
Cunha: [13:21] They were much healthier then than now. They spoil everything I think, myself, because I'm from the old school.
Interviewer : [13:30] What was life like then? Day to day life growing up on this ranch out here?
Cunha: [13:35] Well I'll tell you. I started grammar school there and I went through high school. And I was able to drive when I was fairly young, but I couldn't because I couldn't get a driver's license. So in those days it wasn't like today. Today the ranchers come right to the ranch with a truck and pick up the milk. Those days we had to take ten-gallon milk cans and fill them. We had a cooling system, refrigeration. A big tank and we'd get the milk.
Interviewer 2: [14:15] Rods with ammonia inside?
Cunha: [14:17] Ammonia inside and we'd fill the cans, load them into the truck, and we'd have to go down to the highway. They'd come by and pick it up. The milk trucks from San Francisco. We shipped to Marin Dell when we got to that point. When we were shipping to San Francisco. And, like I said, I wasn't old enough to get a license, so I'd take the milk down. The road at that time, well I guess it still is, was a private road. Was a dirt road. We'd have to maintain it ourselves. So I'd drive down to the platform, what we called a platform. We'd put the milk on the platform and they had these empty milk cans there from the day before. We'd leave the full ones and take the empty ones. And leave the truck there and the school bus would come by and we'd catch the school bus. Cause I couldn't drive, like I said, I was too young. We'd catch the school bus and go to school. Dorothy and Grace, Georgina, me and my brother. And catch the school bus and go to school. Come back in the afternoon. We'd get in the milk truck and come home. But before that when we were younger, we'd have to walk sometimes. And right down at the end of the – that church down there, right at the end of Tennessee Valley . . .
Interviewer 2: [15:43] The Lutheran Church.
Cunha: [15:45] The Lutheran Church. There was an old fella that lived there. He had dogs and they were meaner than the devil. And we hated to go by there. All five of us. We'd get together and go together past there to get by those dogs. I can't forget that. That's why today I can't stand them. I'm in the gasoline business and I go all over to these ranches you know. That's my business now. And I carry a can of cookies – dog biscuits in the truck all the time. When I see dogs, I throw then a cookie and then they're friends of mine.
Interviewer: [16:24] You caught the bus with the other neighborhood – other rancher's children?
Cunha: [16:29] Oh yeah. You had Dorothy and then there was a ranch down by the beach and there was the Martin Benecourts. There was George Benecourt and Ernie Martin.
Interviewer: [16:47] Mentioned some of the other kids. Georgina?
Cunha: [16:51] Georgina. Yeah, she lives up in Petaluma now. That's Dorothy's sister.
Interviewer: [16:54] Oh, okay.
Cunha: [16:57] And then Grace is Dorothy's sister. Three girls.
Interviewer: [17:01] I only had two sisters.
Cunha: [17:06] She didn't tell you? She didn't mention it to you?
Interviewer: [17:09] No, she mentioned her sisters, but I guess not by name. I just listened to a tape.
Cunha: [17:12] Oh. Grace, Georgina and Dorothy. Three girls.
Interviewer: [17:16] So you pretty much grew up with them.
Cunha: [17:18] Oh yeah. We went all through school. All of us.
Interviewer: [17:22] And you all went in Mill Valley?
Cunha: [17:24] Yeah, Grace was younger. I think Grace . . . she didn't graduate from Tam. I think she graduated from San Rafael cause they had moved up to Novato, I think.
Interviewer: [17:40] Did you play with them much in the neighborhood? Outside school?
Cunha: [17:45] We didn't have much time for that. Just work on the ranch. Get up in the morning and milk cows and go home and eat breakfast and change clothes and go to school.
Interviewer: [17:56] Did you get up with the rest of the men – get up and milk the cows? What time . . . you'd get up at what, two or . . . ?
Cunha: [18:03] Three, four, two. All depends.
Interviewer: [18:06] And then you'd go to school all day.
Cunha: [18:08] To school, and then I'd come home at night, do some studying. I couldn't do, I was like this falling asleep. We went out t a banquet last night a friend of ours . . . we were talking about that. The kids of today don't what . . .
Rose: [18:30] They don't know how lucky they are.
Cunha: [18:34] They don't know what work is. They don't know what work is.
Interviewer: [18:38] No. Definitely a different . . . not even the dairy ranchers today work like that.
Cunha: [18:42] No, Darcie the milk is pipelined right into the cooler. Everything's goes by pipe. There's no . . . we had milking machines. We have buckets, four of ‘em. We'd have to milk two cows at a time, we’d milk eight cows. And we'd have to dump the milk in buckets, carry it to the what we'd call the milk house, where the cooling system was. That's the way we . . .
Interviewer: [19:17] And that was even when you had milking machines.
Cunha: [19:19] Yeah, right.
Interviewer: [19:20] It was even harder before.
Cunha: [19:22] My dad made a – I don't know what you'd call it – a sling, I guess, from the branch of a tree, kind of curved. Put a rope on each side with a hook on each one. Put it over your shoulder and you'd squat down and pick the buckets up, stand up and . . .
Interviewer: [19:43] Just like being an ox or something. Carrying the buckets.
Cunha: [19:46] Oh yeah.
Interviewer: [19:50] So when you grew up and were helping out with milking the cows, did you have milking machines, or did that come . . . ?
Cunha: [19:59] We started pretty early with them. We got them a lot of times . . . when we finally got electricity in Tennessee Valley – it was strung all the way from down Tam Junction. In the winter time sometimes the weather, you know, with the trees – it would knock down the line and we'd have no electricity. So we had an old Model T Ford and just to milk the cows. We had the milking machine pump which was a vacuum thing. So the Model T Ford – I don't know if you know how they are, but I mean the lugs(?) were different than the cars are today. You'd take just a tire off and the wheel was there. So what we'd do – we'd take part of the wall board off the milking machine house where the milking machine pump was, we'd back this old Ford up to it, jack one hind wheel up, and we'd take a belt and run it from the milking machine pump to the wheel on that Ford and that would run the milking machine pump and the darn old-time car never had water pumps, it was just flow through, so my mother would be out there with a bucket of cold water pouring it over while we were milking the cows.
Interviewer: [21:17] That's ingenious. Problem solver.
Cunha: [21:31] It's a lot different today, I'll tell you. My business is – it's a gasoline business, and I deliver mostly to agriculture. I see all the ranches all over. Point Reyes, ---------------, Sonoma and all over the country you see this. And the way they do it today and the way we did it.
Interviewer: [21:55] How big of a ranch did you have over there? Was that . . . ?
Cunha: [22:00] Tennessee Valley was 517 acres. Peacock Gap was 2,500 acres. Let's see, Alto was about 180, 200, somewhere around there. I don't quite remember that one.
Interviewer: [22:14] You had . . . did you have a lot of cows -----------------? Did you have a lot of hired hands?
Cunha: [22:20] No no. We had to do without hired help as much as we could. We couldn't afford it. We did the best we could with what we had.
Interviewer: [22:30] So you did most of the milking? Your father and you and your brother?
Cunha: [22:34] All three of us.
Interviewer: [22:35] Just the three of you?
Cunha: [22:39] Yeah. We had an old fellow who used to come and live with us. He'd help out once in a while. The roads, delivery. The roads in Tennessee Valley were just dirt. And down there where Dorothy lived – well, Dorothy's this way – that was kind of a marsh in there. Where those willow trees are. In the winter time the ruts would get so deep that we'd be going out with a truck – the milk truck – and we'd couldn't get through. So this little old fellow we had living with us, cause he didn't have anybody, he'd go down and lead us down there with the team of horses. When we got there, then he'd hook onto us with the team of horses and pull us through. Coming home he'd pull us through. Coming home would be better because it wasn't as bad because the truck wasn't loaded. But going out taking the milk, it would weigh down and get caught on the ruts. The old Chevrolets we had the fly wheel was not like today. Fly wheels today are covered. In those days they weren't covered. They were open and when the engine hit that dirt it would kill the engine on us. We couldn't go.
Interviewer: [23:58] So you had you and your brother and your father doing all the work and your mother . . .
Cunha: [24:02] She'd help out. She did all the cooking.
Interviewer: [24:04] You had got . . . it must have been pretty small, right? You couldn't have milked that many . . . what'd you – milk 30 cows each or something?
Cunha: [24:15] Oh yeah. We had . . . Tennessee? Let's see, we milked more than that.
Interviewer: [24:21] Really?
Cunha: [24:25] Yeah. More than that. We had quite a bit of ground. I mean, you know, 517 acres would take care of quite a few animals.
Interviewer 2: [24:34] How did you retrieve the cattle? Obviously they wanted to be milked and everything, but that's a big acreage.
Cunha: [24:45] We had the ranch divided. We had what they call the back ranch where the dry cattle were. Or the young cattle were. And then the milk cows would be in separate ranch. But there was always one or two who would lag behind. It seemed like they'd do it purposely. That they wouldn't . . . you'd have to go. In the spring of the year, see, they would pasture out. The grass is green and they pasture out, they didn’t like to come home. But the balance of the year we'd have to feed them at home, at the ranch. And they come in pretty good. At Enchanted Knolls I can remember walking those hills I don't know how many times to drive the cattle in. For some reason or other we always had a little trouble at the other places getting the cattle in.
Interviewer 2: [25:40] Too enchanted maybe.
Cunha: [25:42] Maybe.
Interviewer: [25:43] Did you have cow dogs at all?
Cunha: [25:45] Yeah we had real nice hunting dogs. I had pointers. I had deer hounds. We had one cow dog that used to haul cows from the ranch like here to where Sam Silva was or ------------ the truck to the back ranch. My dad found this dog one time. We used to call him Brownie cause he was just a little dog and God he was good. I don’t know what he really was. We were trying to load the cattle on the truck and you couldn't do it. You know sometimes they won't go, they’d get stubborn. He'd nip them on the hind legs right down at the heel and then nip them and he'd duck. Check over them, you know. And they'd go flying in the truck. Soon as he'd bit them, he'd bite them and sit down, and then we'd have them, like I say, the different ranches. He used to follow my dad all over and God it made us sick. My dad was going from one ranch to the other and wanted him to stay there, you know. But he wanted to go. He was always following my dad to the truck and a car hit him and killed him. God, it made me sick. I'll never forget that. Yeah. He was just a dog that we picked up. I don't know what breed he was or anything. Called him Brownie. God he was good. ---------------- used to do a lot of deer hunting. Used to deer hunt on horseback, me and my brother. Had two deer hounds. I had a cousin. He's dead now, but he lived out in Slide Ranch. You know where Slide Ranch is?
Interviewer: [27:21] Uh huh.
Cunha: [27:22] He was there for years. He used to come over and hunt with us. He had a Blue Australian Shepard. Used to deer hunt with. One time we were over here at Sam Silva’s on this side and we were going up the hill and here's a rattlesnake right across the trail. The dogs see him and they'd shy. Another time we were over on the other side and I was going up . . . me and my brother we had two horses, and I had the gun tied on the saddle, and I had the dogs – two hounds. And my brother was following me. And we'd get up the hill there and I heard . . . the horse turned around so quick I pretty near fell off, but it was a footprint from the wintertime where a cow had stepped and there was a rattlesnake coiled up in there. The horses were scared of those things. Boy, it turned on a dime. I could have fell off the horse. You know I didn't expect it.
Interviewer: [28:27] There must have been rattlesnakes back here a lot.
Cunha: [28:29] Oh yeah. Years ago. I don't know about now cause I haven't been over these hills, but there used to be a lot of them.
Interviewer 2: [28:35] Up high where they have that FM station. That's where the favorite breeding ground . . . but they're actually pretty shy. I've not seen very many of them. When we do see them they seem to want to just go on their own. They don't seem quite as aggressive as some of the other.
Cunha: [28:59] I don't think they're . . . not for me. Whether they're shy or not shy, I don't . . .
Interviewer 2: [29:05] I understand.
Cunha: [29:06] I know a friend of mine worked – when they were building that Sonoma Lake up there and he says, you come to work in the morning and the tractors and the turner(?) poles and what have you, and here they were, all over, hanging on the . . . he says, God it was something terrible to work on that job. Especially up there.
Interviewer: [29:31] Were there a lot of wild animals in there? Did you ever see coyote or anything like that?
Cunha: [29:35] At night time, yeah, they'd make a racket.
Interviewer: [29:40] Really?
Cunha: [29:41] The coyote, yeah. Bobcats. A fella by the name of Hadler, had a chicken ranch just below us. I don't know if you heard about that.
Interviewer: [29:57] No.
Cunha" [29:58] Yeah he had a chicken ranch there. Well the ranch we were in, where Laura is now . . . as you go down towards Dorothy's with that – I don't know if there's still a cattle guard there or not, a bridge – a cattle guard there . . .
Interviewer 2: [30:10] By Oakwood Valley. Wasn't it a little road – a one-way. Just sort of a one-way bridge and there's a cattle guard that goes . . . there's a big open valley?
Cunha: [30:24] Kind of open, yeah.
Interviewer: [30:29] Kind of an open field.
Cunha: [30:31] Yeah. There's a road that goes up in there. Yeah. George Hadler .. That's it. Had a chicken ranch there and he used to trap bobcats to eat.
Interviewer: [30:48] Really?
Cunha: [30:49] It was a delicacy, sure.
Interviewer: [30:52] It was a delicacy . . . ?
Cunha: [30:55] German I guess.
Interviewer: [30:57] He was German?
Cunha: [30:59] Yes. He used to trap those things to eat. I went by one day and there was one in a trap and wow, those things were wild. This goes back further yet. Just down from his place was a place there that --------------------- long before bootlegging – our bootlegging days I should say. A fellow used to bootlegging there. Years ago, and they raided the place one time. He was trying to get away and he jumped in the mash pit. And you know they dug all that mash pit out and they never could find that guy to this day.
Interviewer 2: [31:49] Mash pit. Isn't that where when they are making the alcohol that’s the stuff that’s left over?
Cunha: [31:56] Right.
Rose: [31:57] Maybe he disintegrated.
Cunha: [32:01] They never could find him. Years ago. It's different now. Too far the judges are concerned. We only had one judge and that was Judge Butler in Marin County. He was about as bad as everybody else.
Interviewer: [32:19] Were there a lot of people who lived in that valley in there?
Cunha: [32:23] No. There's one by the water, by the ocean, down in Tennessee, and then there was where Louis or Rainer was and then there was where we were and then there was down, Bagshaw lived there. He just had a house there on the left as you go – you're talking about going to the where the chicken ranch was . . .
Interviewer 2: [32:53] Right.
Cunha: [32:55] Bagshaw lived there. What do you call it?
Interviewer 2: [32:59] The call it Oakwood Valley now?
Cunha: [33:01] That what they call it? I don't know what they . . .
Interviewer: [33:04] Bear Valley?
Cunha: [33:05] Bear Valley. Bear Valley. That's what they called it, Bear Valley.
Interviewer: [33:08] That was what Oakwood Valley used to be called.
Cunha: [33:11] And then from there down, let's see. There were a couple of houses there where Terry – what's Terry's last name?
Interviewer 2: [ 33:18] Warden?
Cunha: [33:19] Terry. The one who was in charge of the Marin County ----------.
Interviewer 2: [33:25] ----------------?
Cunha: [33:26] No, Terry that lives by Dorothy and ------------. Sure, we’d seen the heck all the time. Terry Houlihan? Used to be in charge of the trucks and everything at Marin County . . .
Interviewer 2: [33:43] Yeah, what about him?
Cunha: [33:45] What's his last name, I'm trying to think.
Interviewer: [33:47] ---------------.
Cunha: [33:50] You heard of his last name. I can't think of his last name. Well he lived there and then Dorothy's at the old house – the original house. And then the house now and exactly across, I guess Dorothy has told you where the school is today that's where the ranch was.
Interviewer: [34:09] Right.
Cunha: [34:10] The dairy was.
Interviewer: [34:12] Right. That was her parents . . . ?
Cunha: [34:16] Her parents, yes.
Interviewer: [34:20] Does that name Sequera, Tequera
Cunha: [34:23] Sequera
Interviewer: [34:25] Does that ring a bell at all? Were they ever around anywhere?
Cunha: [34:29] Not that I remember in there,.not in there. Sequeria was up in San Rafael.
Interviewer: [34:31] Oh really?
Cunha: [34:32] Yeah, I looked -------------------
Interviewer 2: [34:34] San Rafael.
Cunha: [34:36] Yeah, Sequeria. He was up there at Marinwood.
Interviewer: [34:39] I'm just curious cause I thought I'd heard someone mention them and I . . .
Cunha: [34:43] Oh! I know why you get Sequeria. Sequeria was on top of the hill going to Muir Beach, the Jim Diaz Ranch.
Interviewer: [34:50] Oh.
Cunha: [34:52] When he came over from the old country he landed there. Joe Sequera, Joe. That's right. Yes, you're right. And he landed there and he worked there. Jim Diaz Ranch.
Interviewer: [35:05] Okay. But he didn't actually live, he didn't have his own . . .
Cunha: [35:11] Nope. No, he did have business afterwards.
Interviewer: [35:14] That was in San Rafael?
Cunha: [35:18] That was in San Rafael. He worked up there – for Jim Diaz for I don't know for how many years. And then he married the Techera girl and let’s see where the devil did he go, I think it was in Lucas Valley. Yeah. You'd never see it now, but it's all filled in with the homes. The house is still there that he built. He married the Techera girl. He was one of the big bootleggers over there too.
Interviewer: [35:55] Very interesting. Would you . . . how would you characterize life, living here in Tennessee Valley. You lived in . . . your family ranched in so many different places. How was it here versus some of the other places?
Cunha: [36:12] It's all the same to me. I mean ranching was ranching. It's getting up early and trying to go to bed early.
Interviewer: [36:19] Different locations must have had benefits.
Cunha: [36:23] No.
Interviewer: [36:24] None at all? Not really?
Cunha: [36:27] Not locally. I mean if you were to go ------ from here down maybe to San Joaquin Valley or up north to Red Bluff or somewhere, it would probably be a change, but . . .
Interviewer 2: [36:44] I think you said earlier that part of this year that the cows would get enough by grazing and then the rest of the year you needed to bring them in and feed, right? Did you also grow feed?
Cunha: [36:59] Oh yeah. Over where Bear Valley is now?
Interviewer: [37:01] Yeah, that was in . . .
Cunha: [37:06] Many a times I'd be plowing and disc’in and seeding. One day my dad was cutting hay in there, with a team of horses. No tractor then. Team of horses. And he was going along and he hit a bees nest – one of those that's underground. The horses took off with him and took off with the ----------- hanging and he took his hat off and he was trying to get . . . God he got all puffed up. Yellow jackets they'd make nests underground too.
Interviewer: [37:44] Did you go berry picking in Bear Valley? Was that a good place for berries?
Cunha: [37:48] We never did much of that. We used to cut wood in Bear Valley. We had to. We had nothing else. We had to sterilize everything, everything was heated with wood or kerosene and when we got through, after we got out of school, and whenever we had time, we'd go to Bear Valley and knock down trees. Before we had bought an old tractor – we bought an old tractor from Dorothy's in-laws. But before we had just horses – we'd cut down a tree and then drag it down the hill to Bear Valley where it was open so we could work. We'd trim all the branches. Take all the branches off, cut up the wood, and take it home and then split it by hand with an axe. Split the wood and let it dry out so you could put it in the stove. Like I said, we didn't have electricity. The stove was a wood stove with coils in it. The wood would heat up and you'd go under this boiler, take a bath in a big tub in the middle of the kitchen.
Interviewer: [39:01] You had to sterilize everything. So that must have taken a lot of wood.
Cunha: [39:04] Oh yeah.
Interviewer: [39:05] And a lot of water too, didn't it?
Cunha: [39:07] Well not so much water. It's funny, the ranch we had in Tennessee, I never figured that out. The highest point on that ranch, up there by the Nike site is where our water supply was. Right on top of the hill. And water all the time. All kinds of water. And it seems to play – you think it would be down – right smack on top of that hill. We had a spring . . .
Interviewer 2: [39:32] The one out here. Hill 88.
Cunha: [39:35] Where the Nike site is?
Interviewer 2: [39:40] The radar station.
Cunha: [39:42] Yeah, the radio tower. Whatever it is up there. Yeah. Rock up there on the hill was kind of a reddish color. All kinds of water from there. We had water all the time.
Interviewer: [39:52] So you never had a problem with water?
Cunha: [39:54] No.
Interviewer: [39:55] Cause it's interesting because Laura Lopez, who lives now, she said they had a big water problem.
Cunha: [40:00] They had a water problem?
Interviewer: [40:02] Yeah.
Cunha: [40:03] We never did.
Interviewer: [40:04] I don't know why.
Cunha: [40:06] Must be a pipeline. Pipelines we had up here years ago weren't the best, but I guess they're still there. I don't know.
Interviewer: [40:15] So did you ever . . . I'm just wondering cause it seems like a lot of dairies kept hogs or pigs or something like that. Did you ever have those?
Cunha: [40:24] No we never. What we were talking about, this morning at breakfast over there where we live now in Tiburon where the Del Mar School is now there was a lady that – she was widowed young and she was a great big woman and she ran a ranch by herself. She had all kinds of hogs over there. Where Strawberry Point is today. You know where Strawberry Point is today? That's where she had out there. She had the dairy where the school is and where the Cove Shopping Center – we're getting away from over here now, but the Cove Shopping Center was a great big diary area. There were seven partners at one time in there. That was one of the biggest dairies around the country at the time. There was a the one there at Alto where we were. There was one there where the Edna Mc Guire School is where we were. There was the Moraze family, the Rock Moraze family that had one over on the hill. Jim Diaz up on top of the hill. Where Laura Lopez was on the other ranch above Mill Valley, Slide Ranch, the Brazil Ranch in Muir Beach, Joe Sadis(?)Joe Ponti, they’re all on Muir Beach. Let's see. Going on further north, I'm think’in Stinson Beach. Noonis, was it Noonis?
Interviewer 2: [42:06] The woman that's in charge of Bolinas now or something? Near Bolinas. She was from this area wasn't she? Family?
Cunha: [42:17] Franciscos?
Interviewer 2: [42:19] No, maybe it was Noonis.
Cunha: [42:22] Noonis?
Interviewer: [42:24] The Reed Ranch . . .
Cunha: [42:26] The Reed Ranch. That's over at Tiburon.
Interviewer 2: [42:31] That's sort of where you live now.
Cunha: [42:34] Yeah.
Interviewer 2 [42:35] I can't remember the name of this person. I think she was up at Stinson, but I can't . . .
Cunha: [42:40] At Stinson Beach, or by Stinson? North of Stinson Beach?
Interviewer 2: [42:44] No south of . . . between Stinson and Muir Beach. Not Slide Ranch.
Rose: [42:51] Julia ---------?
Interviewer 2: [42:53] Yeah.
Cunha: [42:54] That's the one that was up on top of the hill. Where the Audubon Ranch is – that's my cousin's there for quite a few years. Leo(?) Leal(?). He's dead now, but he had that. He had a dairy there and he used to make ice cream and sell ice cream there in Stinson Beach years ago. Are you from Stinson Beach?
Interviewer 2: [43:18] She's from Kentucky.
Interviewer: [43:20] I'm from Kentucky.
Cunha: [43:23] Kentucky!
Interviewer: [43:25] Yeah. I was looking. . . somewhere I had a list of names. Now I can't find it. Never mind. But I thought maybe I'd had it somewhere.
Interviewer 2: [43:42] Could I ask a question? --------------------------------.
Interviewer: [43:46] I found Leal, Slide Ranch, Stupa.
Cunha: [43:52] There's Slide Ranch and there's the Audubon. Jim and Susan Stantis(?).
Interviewer: [44:00] For some reason, Borges.
Cunha: [44:03] Oh yeah. They were there where Bagshaw was too.
Interviewer 2: [44:14] I was curious about holidays. What holidays were like growing up on a dairy ranch.
Cunha: [44:21] There weren't. We used to get a day off. We'd get somebody to . . . we called it the day off. We'd milk the cows in the morning, but we wouldn't milk them in the afternoon. Somebody else would do it, but that was so seldom. And it was a problem to get anybody just for an afternoon. We thought that was great, a day off. Work this morning, but this afternoon we don't have to. But that wasn't very often.
Interviewer 2: [44:48] Was there any Christmas traditions or anything like that?
Cunha: [44:52] Oh yeah. We had . . .
Interviewer 2: [44:57] Cause one of the things that we do with visitors is we do workshops around the holiday ornaments and have ----------------- anything interesting to talk about? Kind of things that you remember about being in the dairy, sounds like...
Cunha: [45:14] Years ago it's not like today I can say. We used to go out to the Brazils or . . . cut our Christmas tree down, carry it home and decorate it. That was about it. And there was no electric decorations, just candles. They're out there pitching on the branches – the candles on each one of the branches. We had a lot of experiences in Tennessee. One time – this is a little different. One time a friend of ours had passed away – close to the family. So we were going for the services that night for this lady. Mother went earlier…
SIDE B
Cunha: [00:00] And like I said, she left a note on the table and I say the three of us, after. So I come home, we come home and went to bed. I park the car down – we used to park right down below we call the horse barn at that time. As I was walking up from the garage to the house I thought I heard somebody kind of (clears throat) like that. I wasn't too sure. I didn't think nothing of it. Went to bed and after we were in bed somebody had been in the house – and after we went to bed, and everybody went to sleep, they come back in the house while we were sleeping. Took the shoes that I had worn that night, took my coat, and let's see – something from my brother's – a pair of pants. While we were asleep! And they hit every ranch that night. When they went to Dorothy's ranch there was one of the fellows home. They used to keep a pistol under their pillow. And the fellow came into the house – years ago what they called a pantry – he came in through the windows of the pantry to rob, takes some stuff, whatever he could. So this fellow happened to be home that night. He was the only one cause everyone went to this service for this lady. And he hollered at him – he knew who it was. He hollered, he said, "hey wait a minute, I'll help ya." And he went to get the pistol and they took off. Somebody knew the whole thing. That was the Valley. We still don't know who it is. This was years and years ago. But that was something else, I'll tell you. I'll never forget that. ------------ yeah. In fact we didn't stay there forever. Oh, I don't know. Three or four nights. We went over there tonight. Tamalpias Motel is there. Right across from Enchanted Knolls. We stayed there for four or five days. We were so scared of that.
Interviewer: [02:18] How do you figure that somebody would come in and steal shoes . . .
Ruth: [02:23] Did you have two pairs of shoes I hope?
Cunha: [02:27] Yeah. After you’re in bed sleepin they came in. What they did while we were away, they seemed to know, knew that we were go’in to be away. And they seemed to know it and they unlocked the front door of the house. Cause we used to go in through the back door and we'd lock the night door, but left the door they opened it – unlocked it. And we come back in. That was sure creepy. I'll never forget that. We were scared stiff there for a while. Do you want to go? It's three o'clock.
Interviewer: [03:07] Do you need to get going?
Cunha: [03:10] No. Why you got a lot more . . .
Interviewer: [03:12] I can ask questions till you're blue.
Cunha: [03:17] Go ahead then.
Interviewer: [03:19] But I don't want to keep you if you if you want to be moving on.
Interviewer 2: [03:24] We've got a few more. Then we can . . .
Interviewer: [03:27] Maybe we can come out some another time. You were going to bring out your saddle, right?
Cunha: [03:32] I've been thinking about that. I have too many memories of that. I'm going to loan it to you, I'm not going to give it to you I told you. Sometimes. I've got an awful lot of memories of that. I've been thinking about that. I've got it and you'll eventually get it over here but that's what I wanted to go.
Interviewer: [03:50] That's fine, you don’t have to give it to us. Do you have any pictures are – anything that you'd want to part with, oh, we’d love to, I’m sure we’d love to have.
Cunha: [03:59] When I was coming out now I've got a picture . . . well, I don't know if that would do any good, when I graduated high school.
Interviewer 2: [04:04] Great. Tam?
Cunha: [04:11] Tam. When I graduated high school . . .
Rose: [04:13] He just went to his 50th reunion was it?
Cunha: [04:16] Yes. If you want to take a picture of it.
Interviewer: [04:19] Yes.
Cunha: [04:21] I don’t want t part with it, but you take a picture of it.
Interviewer 2: [04:26] I was going to say that's something that we can do. If you can loan it to us long enough to get a copy made. That's the sort of thing that we'd love to have.
Cunha: [04:32] And then I've got . . . maybe Dorothy has told you – we used to call it the pie. It's a book of everybody. The senior class and all. She ------------ as one of those too. I don't know if she's ever . . . you call them yearbooks. I wonder how they ever got that name – pie. Yeah, but some day I’ll bring in that picture. I thought about it today and I didn't know if you'd want it or if you were interested or not . . .
Rose: [05:05] I told him to. I said, “I don’t think they'd want that.”
Interviewer: [05:08] It's neat just to have pictures of the berries and the places, but also I kind of want to have pictures of the ------------------.
Cunha: [05:15] Yeah, involvement around here. The time years ago.
Interviewer 2: [05:22] Do you have anything in particular, burning issues?
Interviewer: [05:25] Yeah I think I have one question that I remember that I was talking to you about before. I'm just curious, cause it seems like other areas where there were dairy ranches like up in Point Reyes or Bolinas, that type of area – the ranches were a lot more spread out.
Cunha: [05:41 ] Oh yeah.
Interviewer: [05:42] The area between ranches and – here you were so compact It seems like it was so crowded. Do you know why that is?
Cunha: [05:50] There wasn’t enough ground, not enough area, that’s all. For one thing, you never did have enough ground to farm in Tennessee Valley. The only thing you had – we used to farm Bear Valley and where Laua lives in the back of the house up that hill, we used to farm that. And we had what we they called a side hill plow. A --- with three horses. And you'd be fillin’ the dirt down the hill all the time. Say you’d fer. You'd go by here – say this is the north side. And you'd be throwing the dirt this way. And you go over there as far as you could go and the fence is you couldn't go any farther, so we would turn the horses around and drop one of the plows and pull one up and you'd come right back on the same . .
Interviewer: [06:52] Split the whole thing . . .
Cunha: [06:54] Split the whole thing and we'd come back again on the same fer the only way that you could farm that. There's some fellow that we used to have working for us – he used to live with us. After we'd cut the hay and we shock it. Put it in little piles. Then we'd bring it down to the barn. We had what they call a rig, a buck rake. And you'd go under. Say this is the shock ----. Like this. This one you'd pick it up. And we had another one, it had a rake this way, it was like this. Two rakes. And the only way you could rake the hay with that – you'd get a bunch of hay in front of it and to get rid of the hay, you'd lift it up and the teeth would catch in the ground and you'd flop over and the other teeth would be raking. It was with one horse. And the rope, say the rake was like that and the ropes were tied from here to the horse. To the harness, to the double tree or single tree, and it would go like that through this little hole . . . it seems -------------. One time he was coming down the hill, he was hanging on to the hayler, the handle of the rake. The thing went over and dumped him right out with the hay on top of him. Whole stack of hay on top of him. I'll never forget that. Just happened to catch on the ground here. Flopped over on him.
Interviewer: [08:38] -------------------?
Cunha: [08:40] Yeah. Then we used to pull the hay into the barn with what they call a . . . I forget what they call that . . . hayfork. There's a name for it.
Interviewer 2: [08:55] Pitchfork?
Cunha: [08:57] No. They would go up. The horses would pull it up. They'd go up to a track. And this was a track in the barn, just like in a slaughter house for meat. Like a butcher shop or a slaughter house. And we'd go up, catch on that track, and go in, and we'd have when we want to dump it, we'd pull the rope, the rope would fall and the hay which would come down.
Interviewer: [09:23] Just up there in the loft?
Cunha: [09:25] Yeah. Like we used to have . . . we had a whole bunch of owls. They used to nest up there all the time. They were something else. All the time. Nesting up there. And after we took the hay in for the winter and we have to feed it to the cows in the barn, and after a dump like that with the rake it was all tangled together, you know. And you couldn't pull it apart. So we had a knife. A hay knife. That would be nice if you had one of those things. A real sharp, crude knife. Real, real sharp. Oh God, it was that tall. And it had two handles on it. What you did – say this is the . . . the edge of the stack of hay here and you'd want to get over here, so you’d get here, stand here and you'd go like this with that saw, keep going. Then it would fall over, a whole big slice of it. Just like slicing a . . .
Interviewer: [10:24] Slicing bread.
Cunha: [10:27] Slicing bread.
Interviewer: [10:32] That's really neat.
Interviewer 2: [10:35] Very ingenious.
Cunha: [10:36] Corn. We used to raise some corn. But we didn't have much room for corn anyway. We used to . . . we had a little chopper. It was an old timer, though. Just a hand chopper. So we rigged it up to run it off the truck or off the tractor. We finally got an old tractor afterwards like we bought from Dorothy's. And we put a pulley on it and we'd chop up the corn . . . didn't have no silage or anything in those days. We'd take a big sack and fill the sack with it and take it in and feed it to the cows. Fill another sack, take it in and feed it to the cows.
Interviewer: [11:17] So you raised the corn for the cows?
Cunha: [11:20] Yeah.
Interviewer: [11:21] Did you have a vegetable garden back in those days?
Cunha: [11:24] Oh yeah, my dad always – he was great for vegetables. We had everything.
Interviewer: [11:28] Like kale?
Cunha: [11:30] Oh yeah. People from the old country . . . my dad wasn't from the old country, he was born here. So was my mother. But the people that come over now from the old country are the old timers who were great for gardens. Yeah, they'd raise everything.
Interviewer: [11:45] Did you ----Portuguese-?
Cunha: [11:47] Oh yeah. The old fellow we had working for us . . . they were great on salted fish. Barracuda, codfish. On Belvedere, there used to be a place over there – I forget the name of it. I read about it not too long ago, but I remember it well. We used to go from Tennessee here over there to get that fish. They used to drive there. There was no road down there. Boats would come in and they'd fix it there. Dry it in the sun, salted. To go down there, if you had to go by car or truck, we used to go around Belvedere Island and stop up and then we'd have to walk down and we'd pack the fish up on our backs up the hill for the truck to bring it. I can remember that. Going down there many a times with my dad, picking up that stuff.
Interviewer: [12:49] Were you pretty much in touch with the Portuguese celebrations?
Cunha: [12:54] Celebrations?
Interviewer: [12:55] Celebrations that went on, the Holy Ghost and that kinda thing?
Cunha: [12:59] I'm the secretary of the one in Sausalito for 37 years. No, 34 years in August. Dorothy's husband was the president for 17 years. I worked with him. Dorothy's role as president now. We made a celebration every year.
Interviewer: [13:22] When you were growing up, did your family do that a lot?
Cunha: [13:28] The old timers – this might sound funny to you, but the old timers had so much faith – an awful lot of faith in that – one year, Tennessee, here, this sounds kind of out of line and maybe I told her. My dad was ill with – my uncle, my dad's brother – and they had a cow that got sick. And they said they promised it to this celebration of the Holy Ghost, if she got better. And she got better. And the day for the celebration, my uncle didn't want to give it cause she was a good cow. That cow went from Tennessee Valley to Sausalito where we’d slaughter them by ourselves. It just could be, I'd seen different things happen myself, but the old timers are really strong on that. Yep. I know you're anxious to go.
Rose: [14:43] Well, I think you've told them about everything. First time I'm hearing these too. I haven't heard them before.
Interviewer: [14:50] Thank you so much for being so patient. This has been really, really helpful, and I'm sure we'll have so many more questions. I hope you don't mind, would we be able to call you up, if we were, I know you’re busy.
Cunha: [15:05] Not the month of December, not for a while now. Next time we got a party to go to or different things. There's a lot of things going on now. And I belong to…. we're talking about last night. We went over to Castro Valley, we belong to what they call the Portuguese Golden State Social Club. And every year we install our new officers. So I was installing like that over there last night. And we got everything. I belong to the Native Sons for . . . I'm the charter member. Tell you how old I am. Fifty-four years I've been a Native Son so I played the drum and bugle corp. years ago in Sausalito here. Whenever I get Chad – me and my brother – play for Louie and Mayo(?).
Interviewer: [16:09] I have one quick question. What was the old fellow’s name that worked for you and lived with you guys for so long? Do you remember his name?
Cunha: [16:19] I remember his first name. It's Joaquin but I don’t remember his his last name. I don't remember. I know it was Joaquin, but I can't remember his last.
Interviewer: [16:32] Joaquin?
Cunha: [16:34] Yeah.
Interviewer: [16:35] W?
Cunha: [16:36] No, J.
Interviewer: [16:37] J. I'm sorry. J –o-a?
Cunha: [16:39] How do you spell that Joaquin?
Rose: [16:41] J-u.
Interviewer: [16:43] J-u?
Rose: [16:45] J-u-o-q-u-i-n.
Interviewer: [16:50] I'm just curious.
Rose: [16:51] I think that's the way you spell it.
Cunha: [16:53] Yes, something like that. Yeah, that's how you spell it. Q-u-i-n.
Interviewer: [17:01] Q-u-i-n.
Cunha: [17:03] He was a relative of the Souza's in San Anselmo, but his name wasn't Souza.
Interviewer: [17:08] Alright. Since you mentioned him so much, I wanted to know if you remembered.
Cunha: [17:15] You ever go to those celebrations that they have around here?
Interviewer: [17:18] No, actually I wanted to ask you about that. I'd like to come to the . . . you have a library or something don't you?
Cunha: [17:24] Yeah. We have the Queens for the past years back to . . . we celebrated our Centennial . . .
Rose: [17:34] in 1988.
Cunha: [17:35] 1988.
Rose: [17:36] That was 100 years.
Cunha: [17:38] May 13, 1888. Yeah.
Interviewer 2: [17:44] So it's usually a spring event?
Cunha: [17:50] It's a religious. . . Pentecost.
Rose: [17:52] Pentecost is after Easter.
Cunha: [17:56] Yeah, seven weeks . . . six or seven weeks.
Rose: [18:00] And every Pentecost Sunday they have their parade. And the Sausalito City Council has been very active in it. They encourage . . .
Cunha: [18:09] participate.
Rose: [18:10] things that they do. Wouldn't want to block the streets, but they march and they like it.
Cunha: [18:16] I don't know if you know, but Robin Sweeney that's on the City Council?
Interviewer 2: [18:20] I saw her at the Centennial but I don't . . .
Cunha: [18:26] You were at the Centennial? Did you come down to hall by any chance? We had the buildings at the hall, we had . . .
Interviewer 2: [18:30] I didn't know about that. Just the parade that night.
Cunha: [18:34] Oh you just went to the parade. We had doings at the hall. We let them use the hall for nothing.
Rose: [18:40] Yeah, they use the hall for nothing.
Cunha: [18:42] We gave the hall to them for nothing. Just to put on their ---------- that they had there that . . . Lucy Suckle(?) was there.
Rose: [18:51] Lucy Suckle, the whole Council.
Cunha: [18:55] I can’t remember. Something for . . . oh, people living in Sausalito for 50 years or better.
Rose: [19:04] Oh that's right. The old timers.
Cunha: [19:08] Old timers. Getting back to the ranch in Tennessee. Years ago our mail was through Sausalito. And then eventually they moved it to Mill Valley. And that's why I was in Sausalito 50 years ago.
Rose: [19:27] That's how he got in on the Sausalito.
Cunha: [19:29] That's how I got in on the deal. God, the hall was full of people.
Rose: [19:35] It was packed.
Cunha: [19:36] Yeah, I was surprised that so many people . . .
Rose: [19:39] It's a big hall.
Interviewer: [19:40] I've just only seen it from the outside.
Cunha: [19:42] Come by some time.
Interviewer: [19:45] It always seems closed.
Cunha: [19:47] Well it is. Yeah, we rent it out quite a bit.
Rose: [19:52] It doesn't look as big from the outside as it is inside.
Cunha: [19:54] Yeah, it's a big hall. It's a nice hall.
Rose: [19:57] Big dining room. Big dance floor. Big kitchen.
Cunha: [19:59] We've got a chapel and we've got seven of them. And when we built the hall we built it in on brick. And there's these big pots. It holds about 200 pounds of meat in each one. And there's a . . . I don't know if you've ever seen it, but do you remember how years ago they used to . . .
Rose: [20:19] They wouldn't remember it. I never saw it till I saw it at your place.
Cunha: [20:24] Scald the animals. Scald the pigs or something like that.
Interviewer 2: [20:28] Take the skin off.
Cunha: [20:30] And they'd boil them in these big pots. Well we got seven of them. And they are all built in with the hood and everything with the chimney and gas range fire. You know, ------------. And we'd use those. We got a fellow that comes and cooks for us.
Rose: [20:52] A cow, 1500 pounds of meat.
Interviewer 2: [20:56] Good heavens!
Cunha: [20:58] He is. And it amazes me all the time when I think about it. He's a banker, and he's not just a plain teller. He's one of the higher ups. And he loves to do this. He not only does it for us, he does it for us, he goes across the Bay, Castro Valley and Newark and what-have-you and cooks. And then ----------- does. He'll come . . . sometimes he brings one of his boys or brings both or sometimes a alone, whatever. Say they're going to have a celebration tomorrow and we're getting prepared for it today. He'll come over, start cooking, and he's got his own recipe. He won't give it to you. Nobody. You can't get it from him. We tried. And he'll stay there all night.
Rose: [21:45] In that creepy hall.
Cunha: [21:51] All by himself. He'd lay on the floor . . .
Rose: [21:53] in a sleeping bag.
Cunha: [ 21:57] In a sleeping bag or something.
Rose: [22:01] Stays overnight. He's cooking all night long.
Cunha: [22:03] Stay there cooking all night. He lets it cook slow. God, he uses
Interviewer 2: [22:09] It must be delicious.
Cunha: [22:11] Oh it is. Flavors it real nice.
Interviewer 2: [22:14] Probably the best vacation our family ever had was in Portugal.
Cunha: [22:18] Yeah.
Interviewer 2: [22:20] I love Portugal.
Cunha: [22:23] When I started work for, when we sold the ranch. I started working part time for them and fooling around and his first wife passed away and when he remarried he went to Portugal. And he says, Jack you gotta go. And I said I have to stay here. My dad, like I said, was born and raised here and so was my mother. They never did go. We never will either. But what I was getting at was like just what you're saying. He says it's one of the prettiest places you'll ever see. He said it was really nice. He enjoyed it.
Interviewer 2: [23:03] Friendly people too. Very friendly.
Cunha: [23:07] Yeah, they say that. I don't know. Like I say, I've never been there, but they say that time means nothing there. Two hours for lunch and you start working at 4 ----------------------- I don't know.
Description
John And Rose Cunha discusses ranching and ranches in the 1940's and 1950s
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