Loretta Reilly Hoffman

Loretta Reilly Hoffman

personal photo of Loretta Hoffman at the pentagon. Used with permission

Sandy Hook, Gateway National Recreation Area, NPS
An Oral History Interview with Loretta Reilly Hoffman
Women’s Army Corps, 1225th Army Service Unit
April to October 1944
Interviewed by Mary Rasa, NPS June 10, 2003
Transcribed by Mary Rasa, 2011
Editor’s notes in parenthesis ( )

Mary Rasa: Today is June 10, 2003. My name is Mary Rasa. I am a Museum Curator for the National Park Service and I am here today with Loretta Reilly Hoffman who was a WAC stationed here in 1944.

Loretta Hoffman: Correct.

Mary Rasa: And we are going to do an oral history interview today because she is the only WAC I have ever met, especially stationed here. I have a particular interest in the Women’s Army Corps because I do some re-enacting in that and I am very excited to have you here today.

Loretta Hoffman: I am excited to be here.

Mary Rasa: We are sitting on the front porch of Barracks 25 which was the home of the Women’s Army Corps during your time here in World War II. My first question is where and when were you born?

Loretta Hoffman: I was born in Brooklyn, New York on February 14, 1923.

Mary Rasa: And were you schooled there as well?

Loretta Hoffman: Yes, I went to Catholic elementary school and public high school, Madison High School.

Mary Rasa: Okay, did you go to college before your military service?

Loretta Hoffman: No. I went to college afterwards on the G.I. Bill.

Mary Rasa: Oh, okay. Do you have any relatives or friends before you joined up that were in the military?

Loretta Hoffman: Just cousins who had been drafted and that sort of thing.

Mary Rasa: Did you know much about the Army before you joined it?

Loretta Hoffman: No. Absolutely nothing about the Women’s Army but I really knew nothing about it. I knew my Dad was in the Army in World War I and this is the reason I chose the Army, but other than that, no.

Mary Rasa: Why did you join?

Loretta Hoffman: There was a war on. If I had been a man I would have been in so…

Mary Rasa: What was the reaction of your parents?

Loretta Hoffman: My, I was afraid to ask my father because the way I was brought up if I had asked him before I was old enough to go in and he would have said no that would mean I couldn’t go in when I was older. So, I waited until my 21st birthday and I went to work and at lunch time I went down and enlisted and went home and told them. (laughter)

Mary Rasa: Was he quite shocked?

Loretta Hoffman: He was thrilled.

Mary Rasa: Oh. That’s good.

Loretta Hoffman: I was amazed because my dad was the old school, you know. Girls stay home and do this. He was thrilled.

Mary Rasa: That is good. Where did you go for basic training?

Loretta Hoffman: Fort Oglethorpe in Georgia.Mary Rasa: It must have been hot down there.

Loretta Hoffman: Well, it was in February.

Mary Rasa: What year?

Loretta Hoffman: 1944.

Mary Rasa: Okay.

Loretta Hoffman: And it was lovely. I remember the first Sunday I was there and sitting outside and it was just a day like today. I washed my hair and was drying it in the sun, writing a letter to my family up in snowy New York City, telling them how lucky I was to be down there. It was beautiful, yeah.

Mary Rasa: And was Fort Hancock your first assignment?

Loretta Hoffman: Yes. It was. I finished basic and came up here with one other girl.

Mary Rasa: Oh okay. What type of job did you have before you joined?

Loretta Hoffman: Clerical. I forget what they call it now. The Army number, whatever they gave you for your classification number. 005 I think it was, general clerk.

Mary Rasa: Well, before you joined, what type of job did you have?Loretta Hoffman: General clerk.Mary Rasa: Oh, okay.Loretta Hoffman: I worked for Western Electric and just…

Mary Rasa: Oh, okay. Did your civilian job pay more than the military?

Loretta Hoffman: Well, my civilian job paid me I think I was getting $18 a week and I had to pay $10 a week home for board and it cost me $2 a week to go back and forth to work, so I ended up with more money here.

Mary Rasa: Oh, that was good. What did you think of the uniform?

Loretta Hoffman: I was thrilled to death. I had no complaints with it, really.

Mary Rasa: Did it fit properly?

Loretta Hoffman: Mine fit alright. My father complained the first time I went home. “Tell them to give you smaller shoes. They’re too big.” (laughter)

Mary Rasa: And, they issued you two of each item, two shirts…

Loretta Hoffman: As I recall, there may have been more than two shirts. But like the dress uniform you had two. And I think we had two fatigue dresses and all the underwear. I don’t remember how much we were issued.

Mary Rasa: Which was all olive drab?Loretta Hoffan: All olive drab, rayon. Treco knit rayon and it got wet and it just dragged.Mary Rasa: And you got nylons.

Loretta Hoffman: You get nylons for going out.

Mary Rasa: Oh, okay. But regularly would you get cotton stockings on base?

Loretta Hoffman: Well, I worked in Post Headquarters so I wore nylons.

Mary Rasa: Oh, okay.

Loretta Hoffman: You had to look nice.

Mary Rasa: Sure. So you worked in that building next door?

Loretta Hoffman: Right next door, yes.

Mary Rasa: Barracks 24.

Loretta Hoffman: In the rain it was lovely.

Mary Rasa: It was nice and close.

Loretta Hoffman: You could run between the raindrops.

Mary Rasa: How was the food?

Loretta Hoffman: Well, unfortunately I have had the reputation all my life for saying, “Where is the food and when do we eat?” I had no complaints.

Mary Rasa: Okay, that is good. How did the male soldiers treat you?

Loretta Hoffman: For the most part they were great. They, I think it was very different because everyone had the same idea. We have to go in. There is a war on and do the best we can. The only thing I did run into was the one soldier that I was relieving for active duty. He gave me a couple of bad steers on how to handle people but I learned the hard way. But other than that I had no problems.

Mary Rasa: And you were allowed to socialize with enlisted men but not officers?

Loretta Hoffman: Oh, yes. Yes. Yeah. That is how I met my husband.

Mary Rasa: Which I will ask you about in a little bit. Did you ever notice any discipline problems with the women?

Loretta Hoffman: I was never, if there were any I think they had a tendency to keep them quiet. And I think if you worked in the office like this the sergeant in charge of the WAC detachment you were aware of them but other than that we didn’t hear of it.

Mary Rasa: And you just heard about you knew one WAC that got pregnant.

Loretta Hoffman: One WAC, I don’t know if she was even pregnant but she was caught necking.

Mary Rasa: Oh.

Loretta Hoffman: With a soldier down behind the car pool and she was immediately sent to another base.

Mary Rasa: Really?

Loretta Hoffman: I didn’t even see her again.

Mary Rasa: Were promotions fair among the WACs?

Loretta Hoffman: I don’t know because when I was here I came as a buck private and I left as a buck private and there so to tell the truth I never expected to be anything but because I figured, well, what can I do. I am not helping to win that war, I am just here. If they need me I am here to do it.

Mary Rasa: Did you get any medical care while you were here?

Loretta Hoffman: Yes, I did.

Mary Rasa: Where they good doctors?

Loretta Hoffman: Oh, they were fine, yeah.

Mary Rasa: Did you want to go overseas?

Loretta Hoffman: I did but unfortunately I didn’t know when you were sent to the Pentagon you stayed there.

Mary Rasa: Oh, okay. Did the other women you served with have similar educational backgrounds? Were a lot of them college graduates?

Loretta Hoffman: For the most part we were all high school graduates and I don’t recall I think a woman had to be a high school graduate…Mary Rasa: Yes.

Loretta Hoffman: …in order to join but a man didn’t.

Mary Rasa: Right.

Loretta Hoffman: I met a few who went on to OCS (Officers Candidate School) who had gone to college but that was very few.

Mary Rasa: And what did you like most about the Women’s Army Corps?

Loretta Hoffman: It was exciting. I got away from home. You know, my father was very strict. I lived in Brooklyn, New York. I wasn’t allowed to go into Manhattan except to go to work. A friend of mine I worked with was being married. She lived in Greenwich Village. My father said I couldn’t go to the wedding because it was in Greenwich Village. I was, you don’t expect that in New York. But it was like that for most of my friends.

Mary Rasa: You got independence.

Loretta Hoffman: And I got some independence, yeah.

Mary Rasa: Did the skills you learned in the military help you later on?

Loretta Hoffman: Well, I think the most I learned as far as skills were people skills and they did help, yes.

Mary Rasa: Okay. Now, I have some other questions. When did you start being involved at Fort Hancock? What were your dates here?

Loretta Hoffman: I came here I don’t know the exact date but it was April of 1944 and I left here in October of 1944.

Mary Rasa: Did you know anything about Fort Hancock before you were assigned here?

Loretta Hoffman: Never heard of it.

Mary Rasa: Let’s see. Did you know the type of job you were going to be assigned to?

Loretta Hoffman: I had no idea.

Mary Rasa: Okay. You just showed up.

Loretta Hoffman: I just showed up and they said, “You go over there and do that work.

Mary Rasa: Now, did you come on the train, the bus?

Loretta Hoffman: We came on the train to New Jersey. I guess it was to Newark. And then I think we got the Jersey Central Railroad.

Mary Rasa: Yes.

Loretta Hoffman: And an Army vehicle met us. I don’t remember. It was just two of us. It may have been a car. I don’t remember.

Mary Rasa: And it brought you out to the Hook.

Loretta Hoffman: Mmm. Hmm. Yeah.

Mary Rasa: What was the first thing that you did when you came here? Did they send you right to your barracks?

Loretta Hoffman: I think so. Yes. Because I recall it was at night. It was dark and I didn’t even know what it looked like until the next day and the next day I was given my assignment.

Mary Rasa: What was your…so your rank while you were here was private first class?

Loretta Hoffman: No. Private.

Mary Rasa: Oh, private. Okay and the unit that you worked for was the Headquarters?

Loretta Hoffman: I worked for Special Services and that was housed in the Headquarters Building.
(pause while big truck drives by)

Mary Rasa: Were there ever alerts of potential enemy attacks while you were here?

Loretta Hoffman: Not that we knew of. There may well have been. I don’t know. I do remember if I could just through something in, I wasn’t here but while my husband was here he said that there was a soldier on guard duty on the beach and he lost a foot. His foot froze and they didn’t have the equipment to keep in contact like they do now. And he stayed there until his time was up and he lost his foot.

Mary Rasa: Oh. When you were working did you work with both civilians and military?

Loretta Hoffman: Yes. The civilians were mostly from the Red Cross. And in fact, my husband was also affiliated with Special Services. He was the motion picture projectionist and we worked with the setting up of shows to come to the base and it was very, it was really interesting. Things that I had no idea existed.

Mary Rasa: Were you here when Judy Garland performed?

Loretta Hoffman: No. I wasn’t.

Mary Rasa: Missed that. (laughter) So, your typical day was you got up and eat and went to work.

Loretta Hoffman: It was really just like any other day. You get up and you have your breakfast and we had exercises in the morning. And you got to work and you have lunch and you go back to work and you are finished at the end of the day, at five o’clock.

Mary Rasa: And then after you came home you ate and then you would be able to relax in the dayroom?

Loretta Hoffman: Yeah. We had a nice sized dayroom and we just sit and relax and some of them played cards. I didn’t because I didn’t know how. I never learned. And we sat and talked and wrote letters.

Mary Rasa: Did you go to the Service Club, the Theater, the dances?

Loretta Hoffman: Well, I went to the Theater because I got a job working in the Theater.

Mary Rasa: What did you do?

Loretta Hoffman: Well, I started as an usher. And I liked it because I got paid at night. It was separate and apart from your military job. And then I became the cashier and then I became the manager. And as manager I got like five dollars a night. So, it was good.

Mary Rasa: Oh, okay. Did you go to dances out here?

Loretta Hoffman: No.

Mary Rasa: Any sporting events?

Loretta Hoffman: I don’t know if they…no.

Mary Rasa: No.

Loretta Hoffman: Well, see for one thing they had the boat they called the Q boat and every weekend I could go home unless for some reason I was on duty. But we get the boat right down here wherever it would be I don’t know.

Mary Rasa: Right over that way.

Loretta Hoffman: Over that way. I will take your word for it. And take us into the Battery in Manhattan. Get on the subway and go visit my family and come back Sunday night.

Mary Rasa: Okay.

Loretta Hoffman: I was very lucky.

Mary Rasa: So you didn’t spend much time here on weekends at all?

Loretta Hoffman: No. I didn’t.

Mary Rasa: Did you ever go to church services out here or was that because you were home?

Loretta Hoffman: I was home. Yeah. I did go into the Chapel and it was very, very small as I recall. It seemed to me they had two and one was smaller. (St. Mary’s Catholic Chapel, Building 123, was a small building and the main Chapel, Building 35 was much smaller. Both are still standing.)

Mary Rasa: Right. That’s right. Did you ever go to the beach while you were here?

Loretta Hoffman: No. I didn’t even own a bathing suit while I was here.

Mary Rasa: Did you ever see any servants or minorities while you were here?

Loretta Hoffman: Nope. And you know I felt terrible later when I realized I didn’t even notice the fact that there were no black women at this. We just grew up in an atmosphere where that was just the way it was. And later when I began to realize what was going on in the world I felt so guilty.

Mary Rasa: Was this a fun or boring place to be working?

Loretta Hoffman: Well, when you are 21 everything is fun. I really enjoyed it.

Mary Rasa: Did anything especially humorous occur while you were here?

Loretta Hoffman: Well, I can’t think of anything off-hand. One thing I wasn’t here but my husband was telling me that Edgar Bergen came. And Edgar Bergen came to entertain the troops and he acted as if the world had waited on him. He said to my husband who was a very independent thinker, “Sergeant, get my bags.” And my husband said, “I am not your maid or your butler. Go get them yourself.”

Mary Rasa: The other thing I wanted to ask was how did you meet your husband?

Loretta Hoffman: In Special Services Office. I, the first day I was here I met him and he scared the death out of me. (laughter) He was a big man and he was very deep and he talked and you heard him coming and he was really very nice and I guess that is why I enjoyed Fort Hancock. Because after the show because he was running the movies we would get on an Army bus and go into Highlands to a diner that was there and have something to eat and come back on the bus when it came back.

Mary Rasa: So, you were here for six months and then you were reassigned to the Pentagon?

Loretta Hoffman: Yes.

Mary Rasa: And you were able to keep in touch with him?

Loretta Hoffman: Oh yes, we kept in touch.

Mary Rasa: And then you were married after the War?

Loretta Hoffman: Yes. We were married in 1946.

Mary Rasa: Then I have some specific question I would like to ask while we take a walk into the barracks and if you want to hold on to me. (getting off step and moving)

Loretta Hoffman: I am a little apprehensive on the steps. (inaudible talking while moving). I was looking in here before and nothing seemed familiar. (walking)

Mary Rasa: We are inside the south end of Barracks 25 which according to the Post Newspaper, the Sandy Hook Foghorn was where the dayroom was. It’s been chopped up into offices since then. Do you remember coming in the dayroom?

Loretta Hoffman: I have been trying to orient myself. And of course, with all the partitions nothing looks familiar. But I do remember the dayroom was a large room.

Mary Rasa: And would they typically have a radio and chairs?

Loretta Hoffman: They had radios and chairs and tables and we would sit and talk and relax. And then the dayroom was where we had our exercises.

Mary Rasa: Oh, so everybody got together. And you think how many people do you think were stationed when you were here?

Loretta Hoffman: Well, when I was here I would think maybe thirty. I could be wrong.

Mary Rasa: Okay.

Loretta Hoffman: That is what I remember.

Mary Rasa: What we are going to do… do you remember the bathrooms? Did they still have urinals in them when you were here?

Loretta Hoffman: No. No. They didn’t. Not when I was here.

Mary Rasa: Okay.

Loretta Hoffman: We did have one small room that was really a bathroom with a tub in it and we took turns getting to use it. We had showers but we had to take turns getting to use the tub.

Mary Rasa: Right.

Loretta Hoffman: And that was nice.

Mary Rasa: Do you remember going into the basement.

Loretta Hoffman: Never was in the basement.

Mary Rasa: In the basement they had washtubs.

Loretta Hoffman: Oh really. I must have been down there if they had washtubs.

Mary Rasa: They said that washtubs and ironing boards were installed.

Loretta Hoffman: I must have been down there but then I was going home every week. I may have taken it home.

Mary Rasa: Sure. That was lucky.

Loretta Hoffman: I had to do it myself there.

Mary Rasa: Oh, okay. (laugther) What we are going to do is walk upstairs to the bunk room and discuss a little bit about where you slept.

Loretta Hoffman: If I can recall. (Walk upstairs)

Mary Rasa: We are in one of the large barracks rooms where Loretta most likely slept. And when you were in here did you have a wooden bunk?

Loretta Hoffman: I don’t think so but I don’t know. I am inclined to think they were metal.

Mary Rasa: Okay.

Loretta Hoffman: They were set up like this.

Mary Rasa: What did they give you? Did you get a footlocker and a wall locker?

Loretta Hoffman: We had a footlocker and a wall locker. Yes. We had to have the wall locker for the clothes that you had to hang. They weren’t permanent press then, you know. You had to iron them. You took care of them.

Mary Rasa: So, you think that most of the members that you were stationed with would have been in one side.

Loretta Hoffman: One side or the other yeah.

Mary Rasa: Did the officer, probably had a private room.

Loretta Hoffman: Oh yeah.

Mary Rasa: Do you think the sergeants also had private rooms?

Loretta Hoffman: Oh yeah. I think they did downstairs.

Mary Rasa: So, the room was not crowded then?

Loretta Hoffman: Oh no. It was very nice as I recall. I was like the third or forth one from the wall.

Mary Rasa: So you think you were in the middle or against…

Loretta Hoffman: In the middle.

Mary Rasa: Oh, okay. Did they sleep head to toe or was it heads on one side?

Loretta Hoffman: I think it was pretty much just every body facing east or whatever. Not for any specific reason but we slept in the same direction because when the beds were made they had to be uniform. So, all the heads were…

Mary Rasa: And when you left for the weekend did you have to do anything special with your bunk?

Loretta Hoffman: Well, make it up and make sure it was clean and …

Mary Rasa: Do you have anything else that you would like to say while we are in here?

Loretta Hoffman: No. I am just I feel so terrible that I can remember so little but its how many years ago. 59 years ago.

Mary Rasa: Something like that.

Loretta Hoffman: Yeah that’s like a couple of weeks. (laughs) and its so good to see and it and I just wish my husband were here to see it.

Mary Rasa: Well, thank you.

Loretta Hoffman: Well, we did come back one time when the children were small. And we got up to Main Gate and they said, “You can’t go in unless you have a pass,” or whatever.

Mary Rasa: It was still military.

Loretta Hoffman: And my husband said, “They wouldn’t let me out of here for four years and now they won’t let me in.” The guard said, “You were stationed here?” And he said, “Yes. We both were.” So, he let us come in. He said, “Just don’t take pictures.” That was it. Great security.

Mary Rasa: Okay, well thank you very much.

Loretta Hoffman: Well, thank you.

Mary Rasa: I appreciate this. This has been a lot of fun and there you go. This is the end of the interview.

END OF INTERVIEW