Grand Canyon Speaks (U.S. National Park Service)

Season 3

Episode 8

Lynette Lewis Speaks

Transcript

[Lynette Lewis]

It's been definitely just amazing to see the growth, you know, to keep in contact after they're done when they become NABI alumni and to see their journey. Some of these kids get picked up by a college to play basketball and it's just awesome to see them representing not just NABI but, you know, their community, where they come from and just making a name for themselves.

[Lakin]

Hello and welcome back to Grand Canyon Speaks. This is Lakin.

[Meranden]

And this is Meranden.

[Lakin]

Today's episode is about Lynette Lewis. She is Diné and speaks about her involvement with NABI, the Native American Basketball Invitational, from starting as a volunteer and making her way to becoming the tournament director.

[Meranden]

She also describes her experience as a business owner where she provides professional services for Native athletes.

[Lakin]

And reveals that she is working on a film highlighting a very successful girls basketball team on the Navajo Reservation.

[Meranden]

Thank you for tuning into today's episode and here is Lynette Lewis.

[Lynette Lewis]

First, thank you for having me. I'm happy to be here and I like to first introduce myself in my Navajo Diné language. Hello everyone. (Introduces self in Navajo)

My name is Lynette Lewis. I am from the Bitterwater clan, born for the Mud clan, my maternal grandfathers of the Towering House clan and my paternal grandfathers of the Bear clan. And this is how I define myself as a Navajo woman.

[Ranger Eliana]

Awesome. Thank you for sharing that with us. I want to ask you, I heard it's your first time coming here to Grand Canyon.

What does it feel like to be here for the first time?

[Lynette Lewis]

It's overwhelming. It is my first time and I think stepping up to the rim, I am actually afraid of heights but this is actually not that bad. I think the first thing I said was it looks like a fake background but it's very beautiful.

Just to see nature and see this for the first time, it's amazing.

[Ranger Eliana]

That's so awesome and just so everyone listening knows, we are looking directly at the canyon right now and you did definitely say that the first time you stepped up to the rim. The canyon is really just so amazing and it's also such a significant place. So Grand Canyon is home to the 11 associated tribes but it also seems like one version of home for you might be on the basketball court or in your work with NABI.

Can you tell us about NABI, what it is and how you got started with it?

[Lynette Lewis]

Yeah, so NABI is the Native American Basketball Invitational. It's been around for 22 years and it started off very, a very small tournament and has grown significantly over the past 20 years plus years. This past year, it is an event that happens every year in July in Phoenix, Arizona.

NABI does host Native American tribes from all over the country. It is a high school tournament and does take place over the course of four days and this year, there was 204 teams, boys and girls. There was 508 games total, played over four days and there were 160 plus tribal nations represented.

[Ranger Eliana]

Wow, that's a huge deal, especially like hearing about how NABI has grown over time. I remember listening to an interview you did a few years ago and I think you said maybe it was like 128 teams or something. It's so cool to hear how much and how quickly NABI has grown.

Another big achievement I heard of yours is that you were a commentator for NABI games on ESPN and I was curious what it means for you being an Indigenous woman on one of the largest sporting platforms in the world.

[Lynette Lewis]

Yeah, so this was back I believe in 2021. We did have the opportunity to go live on ESPN plus which is a big accomplishment for NABI and I was one of several commentators. We were all an Indigenous broadcast and so that in itself was an accomplishment just representing our own tribes on this big platform just being female and in a sports world.

You really see that and now with women in sports, it's definitely growing and you know I just wanted to be that person for younger females to see and to know that you know they can also be in this position too.

[Ranger Eliana]

I remember in the office when I was thinking about what I wanted to ask you, one of my co-workers when I mentioned, oh she did say that you know she was a commentator on ESPN but I'm not sure if we have time for that question. He said definitely ask that you know make sure you ask that and also you know in regards to being a female in a male-dominated field, it's just so impressive and you're definitely a role model.

[Lynette Lewis]

Thank you.

[Ranger Eliana]

It's so awesome and I'm sure you're a role model for a lot of the youth as well. I do want to ask you because you mentioned you worked for NABI for 14 years and there's so many young people coming through NABI. Do you keep in touch with any of the players and how do you keep in touch with them?

[Lynette Lewis]

Yes, as you said 14 years. I have met a lot of players, kept in contact with a lot of coaches that have been coming every year with a new group of players. I think every player will at least play four years in NABI and then a new group of kids will come in but it's been definitely just amazing to see the growth you know to keep in contact after they're done when they become NABI alumni and to see their journey.

Some of these kids get picked up by a college to play basketball and it's just awesome to see them representing not just NABI but you know their community where they come from and just making a name for themselves. You rarely see Native American athletes playing at a college level so it's just great to see that you know that's also changing and we're seeing more representation in that too.

[Ranger Eliana]

Yeah and that's so cool that NABI has such a big role in highlighting young Native American athletes and helping to get them to the college level and that you're also still invested in the players after they come through NABI and seeing their growth over time and celebrating them. That's really awesome and I know that you also have grown a lot with NABI like you said 14 years. Could you tell me a little bit about like your time with NABI because I heard that you started as a volunteer and grew into your current position now you do a lot with the organization.

[Lynette Lewis]

Yeah so it all started when I was still a student at Arizona State University and it was the summer time so I was on break and I needed something to do so knowing that NABI was coming up my sister and I we decided that we should volunteer and be part of it so that happened the first year and then I was actually asked to come back the following year to do an internship so it kind of started from there and then you know eventually went into a part-time position and then eventually full-time and then came to a point where I was I became the tournament director so this was I think this was my sixth year that just passed in 2025.

[Ranger Eliana]

Yeah you know that you started out as a volunteer and an intern and you've grown into such an important role with NABI you know I think it's really it's really good for young people to hear as well like I myself was an intern one year ago so it's inspiring to see how far you could go in your life and in your career.

[Lynette Lewis]

Yeah and if I could add to that you know I always like to share my share this message to a lot of the youth is that it's important to volunteer it's important to take internships because it never know you never know where it's going to take you where you're going to end up and you know look at me and so I'm at a point where I was able to establish my own business and now I'm have the ability to work with other native communities and other organizations which has been great.

[Ranger Eliana]

Yeah that's so cool and such an important message for young people especially to hear it's like life could take you anywhere but you have to take those opportunities.

[Lynette Lewis]

Correct.

[Ranger Eliana]

Yeah that's awesome and I also think like NABI is such a great opportunity for young people because I know you told me that you have teams from all over the country and even some teams from abroad and all over the world and I'm curious what the experience is like for young players who come out to compete in NABI tournament.

[Lynette Lewis]

Aside from the competition I think it's all about bringing the kids together you know unify them and it's also an opportunity for them to meet other athletes from different parts of the world the other part you know from different tribes and also just to get to learn a different tribe's culture their you know traditions so it's you know educational too and I know a lot of athletes don't have the opportunity to travel even just out of state or to a big city so this is a great opportunity for them and just to meet other kids from different parts of the country from different communities.

[Ranger Eliana]

Yeah that's so cool and such a good learning experience and like cross-cultural connections for the kids. I want to ask you like maybe a personal question but did you travel much when you were growing up? I know you've traveled a lot now but when you were like maybe their age did did you have that experience traveling?

[Lynette Lewis]

Unfortunately I didn't. I'm from New Mexico so you know the nearest city was Albuquerque and you know that was big to me and then I think my first time going to traveling to California like that was major and because you know I never really had the opportunity and I just I knew when I had that first time traveling to another place I knew like I wanted to travel to more places outside of you know where I'm from. Now it's like with my work I have the opportunity to do so now and it's been amazing to travel to all these different places and you know see other communities.

[Ranger Eliana]

Yeah and there's like so much that you learn when you go somewhere that's different from the place that you grew up. It's really wonderful that you're kind of like facilitating and providing that opportunity for young people and you're also getting to learn yourself through your travels. I want to ask you kind of an unrelated random question because we always try to ask this fun question and that is what is your favorite native food?

[Lynette Lewis]

My favorite native food? Let's see so I am Navajo. Every time I go home I have to have mutton so roast mutton with green chili.

That's my go-to every time I go home. I mean there's a lot of other foods but I say you know that for sure.

[Ranger Eliana]

That sounds so good. I have to I've never actually had mutton and I also don't think I've ever had green chili. Can you describe for the listeners like what does it taste like or like what's green chili like?

[Lynette Lewis]

I don't know how to describe mutton. I've asked people before I know some people's it's not for everyone but green chili it's a well New Mexico they're known as the green chili capital of the world because you know of hatch green chili it's you know you can find it there in New Mexico. So I've grown up I feel like when we have dinner lunch doesn't matter when you're always have some sort of chili there that you eat with so I love spice I love chili so I know there's different temperature levels you know you can go mild you can go extra hot so it varies.

[Ranger Eliana]

Okay so Lakin is one of the interns here and he is from Zuni and when he comes home sometimes he brings fried chicken with chili and he let me try the chili sauce but it was red but whatever it was was really good.

[Lynette Lewis]

Yeah red and green I say it's very similar we call it if you combine the two we call it Christmas.

[Ranger Eliana]

This is a good learning opportunity. I like that those are definitely the Christmas colors. That's awesome.

Now I'm just thinking about food and I'm trying to transition my brain back because I want to ask you now like kind of another question related to where you grew up because you told me that you you're in the process of making a film called Kirtland Dynasty and it's from the area where you grew up so I was wondering if you could tell us about the film what it's been like making the film and also why that story was important to you.

[Lynette Lewis]

So Kirtland Dynasty we're actually in post-production right now and we're in the process of finding investors to finish the film. It was a two-year project where we followed the girls basketball team over their season and I wanted to tell the story because they are currently 22 time state champions and I want to put it out there because it's unknown to hear well for me I felt it was normal because you know coming from a place where basketball is everything like having that many state championships was normal to hear you know from where I'm from but when I have met people told them about about it people are fairly shocked when I tell them how many state championships they've won and so basketball being huge in the Native community I definitely wanted to showcase this team because of the dynasty they created in Kirtland with their girls basketball program and you know there's talent there in the community and I say in all Native communities but you know in the specific community we've had several girls go on to play college basketball some who have who have made it to the D1 level so you know I want to tell their story and it's not a lot of people know about Kirtland or the program so this is my way of you know showing that and highlighting them and the place where I grew up.

[Ranger Eliana]

Yeah and it's really important to highlight that because like I definitely didn't know about that and you know it seems like there's so many young girls that give so much of themselves to this sport and and they're so successful and they really deserve recognition. So you mentioned how important basketball is to a lot of Native communities so I've heard that before and I've also heard like about "rez ball" and I'm not really familiar with like what basketball means to Native communities and also like how the style of basketball might be different. Could you tell me like a little bit about that?

[Lynette Lewis]

Yeah so rez ball it is a style of play it's fast-paced a lot of people call it run and gun so you know make a basket you know you're just constantly running back and forth and and as far as basketball in the Native community I feel like it's like an outlet for a lot of young athletes because when you go to a lot of these tribal communities there's not much around as far as entertainment. So you know basketball being what it is when it comes to basketball season you know you see a lot of the community come together to watch a game to support their local team because I know for me living in New Mexico we never had any major sports teams in the area so basketball high school local high school teams were you know the teams we supported and I remember growing up I was fans of some of these players I looked up to some of these players and I wanted to play like these players and I wanted to be like them so with that I'm sure it's very similar everywhere else in different communities so I think it's extra special because you know we have our own way of life with our own type of basketball.

[Ranger Eliana]

Yeah and it's so cool how like even the style of the sport is unique to the community and it's also really cool how you say like the community comes out to support the team and how you looked up to them as a young person and I'm sure you have a lot of young people today who look up to you as well. I'm curious because you said res ball is more like fast-paced when you have the NABI tournaments is it like in rez ball style or the teams playing like fast-paced like that what's like what's the sport feel like when you have all these teams coming out for the NABI tournament?

[Lynette Lewis]

Yeah I definitely see a lot of that res ball run and gun but I think now with this new generation of youth coming up you're starting to see a little transition of how basketball is being played you know you're seeing more organized basketball and you know with that too is one of the things that we lack in the native community is exposure. We don't have scouts college scouts coming out to the reservations to watch our kids play so that's why you know tournaments like NABI were created this was for the exposure so these kids can come to a place where they can be seen and so now that's becoming so big and you're seeing social media grow now we have we're at a point where NABI's having the games televised live like that's something new today and it's nice because you know back in back in my day when I was playing high school we had none of that we really didn't have social media social media was like just beginning and you know we weren't highlighted in that same way kids are now so I feel like now is the time to have our have our kids being seen and the opportunities for them to play at a higher level.

[Ranger Eliana]

It's definitely so important to have that exposure just to give people those opportunities and you mentioned how NABI games are now being streamed and that is so amazing. Could you tell me like a little bit about that process and also where listeners could watch NABI games?

[Lynette Lewis]

Yeah so NABI does have their own network it's called NABI Network and I know this past year they work with Arizona Family where it was streamed live on their station I believe and I think it was also streamed live on YouTube but even after the games that are done they'll still be put on to NABI Network for people to still you know see those games even if they didn't see them back in July so I know NABI is definitely trying to expand and grow that live stream to a point where they can stream all games live so if you're looking at 508 games you know I think their goal is to stream all 508 games.

[Ranger Eliana]

Wow that's that would be like so awesome to be able to see them all and every player then I'm thinking about like every player and their families being able to look and say like that's me yeah that's super exciting and really important as well and you know we've talked a lot about NABI's growth and the important work that you're doing with NABI but I know that you also have your own business and I think that's really inspiring as well.

Could you tell us a little bit about your experience as a business owner?

[Lynette Lewis]

Yeah so I never went to school to become a business owner um surprisingly I have a chemistry degree a bachelor in chemistry my career goal was to become a doctor and that totally changed once I got involved with NABI but my company started back November 2022 so I've had it for three years now but it's given me the opportunity to work with other organizations get into the community more and you know work within those communities because I feel now with my experience over the years I think I've come to a point where I can provide resources to the communities like come to them and provide my knowledge and any resources that I have come across and that's my my goal now with my work is to bring exposure and just support Native youth athletes especially in basketball which is my you know forte.

[Ranger Eliana]

Yeah it's so cool that like now you get to be the person that's coming to communities or providing resources or exposure it's really inspiring like even for me to see because I personally would love to support youth and so it's it's cool to see your journey how you've gotten to a point where you are the person providing that support. You mentioned going into different communities and I know that you've traveled to a lot of different tribal nations through your work so I wanted to ask you just about your experience traveling around the country traveling to different tribal nations and and what you've learned from that.

[Lynette Lewis]

Yeah as I said you know I've my goal was to travel and you know see the world I've only been outside of the country to Canada and I've actually been to Australia and Mexico those were the only three places I've been outside of the the U.S. but you know everyone wants to travel abroad but my goal is to visit as many tribal nations as possible because I want to learn about their culture and about you know where they come from because with my experience through NABI I have met so many people that have come from different nations and when I was in high school you know I didn't know there are that many tribal nations out there and like you said you know with my travel I've got an opportunity to travel to some of these communities and you know every place is very welcoming and it's just an honor to be there you know I've been to some places that I feel like were very similar to you know where I grew up and there's places that are totally different you go to a place like Florida or Washington because we're desert people and totally different but it's been awesome just to just even experience that a whole climate change.

[Ranger Eliana]

Yes it is crazy how different it is where you go because I'm from Washington so I know it's all rain there and here it's like well it's raining right now a little bit but it's mostly just dry and it's um there's so much you can learn from from going places and seeing how different the land is how different cultures are all the people you can meet where you go and I want to let you know you really inspire me especially hearing how you didn't travel much when you were younger but you wanted to and you've been able to like accomplish that and learn from that while also supporting young people it's it's just really inspiring and I'm sure there's a lot of young people out there who have been really touched by your work okay with that said I just want to ask if there's if there's anything you would like to leave the audience with?

[Lynette Lewis]

I think just going off of what I just said you know visiting some of these tribal nations if you're not from the community or if you're you know non-native I know there could be some hesitation and I know people want to learn but I would like the audience to know that a lot of these tribal communities are very welcoming a lot of places have museums and they have culture centers and those places were built for a reason was for people to come and visit their community to learn about their community to learn of their culture their traditions so you know best thing is to do a little research a lot of these tribes have their own website so definitely you know check out wherever you're going where you want to go see if they have a website that lists a museum a culture center and you know we as native people we're very open and very welcoming so you know take the initiative to learn about our culture.

[Ranger Jonah]

Grand Canyon Speaks is a program hosted by Grand Canyon National Park and the Grand Canyon Conservancy. A special thanks to Aaron White for the theme music.

This recording reflects the personal lived experiences of tribal members and do not encompass the views of their tribal nation or that of the national park. To learn more about Grand Canyon First Voices visit www.nps.gov slash grca. Here at Grand Canyon National Park we are on the ancestral homelands of the 11 associated tribes of the Grand Canyon.

These being the Havasupai Tribe, the Hualapai Tribe, the Navajo Nation, the Hopi Tribe, the Pueblo of Zuni, the Yavapai Apache Nation, the Kaibab Band of Paiute Indians, the Las Vegas Paiute Tribe, the Moapa Band of Paiutes, the Paiute Indian Tribe and the San Juan Southern Paiute Tribe.

This episode features Lynette Lewis, a Diné woman who explains her involvement with NABI, the Native American Basketball Invitational. As a businesswoman of LRLewis LLC, she talks about how she is able to provide services to native athletes such as basketball tournaments and skills training. Rez ball is a huge component to her native community and she talks about the efforts she is doing to provide exposure to some very talented athletes.

Episode 9

Sierra Klemme Speaks

Transcript

[Sierra Klemme]

If something feels bigger than you, don't be afraid to really lean into it, to allow the intensity of those feelings to fully engulf you. You know, those feelings may be things you feel here at the Grand Canyon. I certainly do.

It is just something I wanted to say that being a part of something bigger than you is quite wonderful.

[Lakin]

Hello and welcome back to Grand Canyon Speaks. This is Lakin.

[Meranden]

And this is Meranden.

[Lakin]

In this episode, Meranden had a chance to interview Sierra Klemme who was an intern at Grand Canyon National Park and continues to pursue her career as a river guide.

As a member of the Navajo Nation, she grew up in Page, Arizona just up the road from the canyon.

[Meranden]

During her time at Page high school, she played with the girls’ soccer team, however she suffered an injury that caused her to miss out on her junior year of soccer.

[Lakin]

Despite this injury, Sierra wasn't ready to give up yet, so she continued to play soccer at the University of Colorado and Colorado Springs.

[Meranden]

Take a listen as Sierra tells us about going from a soccer athlete to a river guide. We hope you enjoy.

[Sierra Klemme]

My name is Sierra Klemme. I'm a Diné woman from the Navajo Nation, and currently I am an intern with Grand Canyon National Park Fisheries Department, as well as a part-time river guide through the canyon. So this summer, I've been splitting my time between Page, Flagstaff, and the Colorado River.

[Meranden]

Nice.

Dang, that's a lot. Well, first of all, have you been to the canyon before this internship?

[Sierra Klemme]

I have, yes. I grew up nearby, and so I spent a lot of my childhood visiting the south rim of the Grand Canyon.

[Meranden]

Nice. But yeah, it's cool that you've been here before. So you mentioned Flagstaff and Page. You did actually grow up in Page, right?

[Sierra Klemme]

Yes, I did. Yeah, I grew up in Page, which is about an hour north of here. It borders Utah and the Navajo Reservation.

Page was established originally because of the construction of the Glen Canyon Dam, which creates the reservoir behind it, known as Lake Powell, and has the Colorado River running below.

[Meranden]

Nice, yeah. I didn't know the meaning behind it.

Yeah, that's cool, because I'm from Tuba City, and we've been there. We go there sometimes, and then we also went there for sports too.

And then speaking of sports, which is what we're here for today, is to talk about the meaning of sports towards Native communities. So through this podcast, we've been able to talk to a lot of different athletes that are from the 11 tribes who call the canyon home, and we've been able to talk to people who did basketball running, some things with equestrian [sports] or horses and things like that, and now we have you doing soccer.

So, would you like to talk a little bit about how you got into soccer or the inspiration behind it?

[Sierra Klemme]

Yeah, there's not a specific moment that I can pinpoint as being inspired when I first started playing soccer.

I think I was like five or six years old, and my parents honestly just signed me up for city league soccer, but it turns out I was naturally pretty good at it and really enjoyed it. So, as the years went on, my love for the sport grew as well as my skill set, and I later found myself playing for the Page High School soccer team, and that is where I found some inspiration for my later soccer career years. There was this girl named Brittany Tso, she was also a Navajo girl, and nobody was playing soccer like her.

It was, yeah, super cool to see her scoring goals left and right, always bringing up team mentality, and yeah, she really set a new standard of sort of what it meant for me to be a soccer player, and I thought it was really cool that this other Native girl was playing soccer, where most people on the reservation in this area play basketball during that season, and so yeah, it was sweet to see her and share that experience.

[Meranden]

Nice, yeah, and in Page, is there a pretty big Diné population there?

[Sierra Klemme]

Yeah, so Page is a little border town, and so a lot of students of Page High School come in from the reservation and surrounding areas, and so yeah, the primary student body is Indigenous youth.

[Meranden]

Nice, that's cool.

I can kind of relate with the soccer, like growing up, they used to have like a little, I forgot what it's called, but when we were smaller, we used to play soccer too, and I remember when we were really small, like when you play, like not a lot of kids know how to play super well, and they just like kick your shin guards like really hard.

I remember that, like getting kicked like really hard, and then I also got like, one time a ball hit me in the stomach really hard, and it's like, that really knocks the wind out of you.

[Sierra Klemme]

Right, yeah, I've had it all, kicked shins, black eyes.

[Meranden]

Really?

[Sierra Klemme]

Worth it, but yeah.

[Meranden]

Yeah, so like when you did play in high school, what were some of the teams that you played? Was it like usually on the reservation, or was it like out of, in the Valley or anything like that? Like who did you play against?

[Sierra Klemme]

It was mainly schools down in Flagstaff and the Phoenix area that were sort of on our same size level. There was not really any schools on the reservation that had girls’ soccer teams, specifically girls’ soccer teams, and so yeah, there was a lot of traveling to play this sport.

[Meranden]

Nice, yeah, and then like when you played soccer in high school, did you have any plans to play after high school?

[Sierra Klemme]

When I first started, I didn't know that I would want to play later on, but unfortunately in high school, I suffered a pretty serious knee injury, and so I only got to play three out of the four years of high school, and I kind of felt like I wasn't ready to be done yet, and so yeah, I did decide to pursue soccer after high school at a collegiate level.

However, school was more important to me, and so I chose school first and then decided to figure out how I could still play soccer, and I tried out for a team, didn't make it, and then I wound up playing for a club team at the University of Colorado in Colorado Springs, and so I played for about two years for them, and we would travel within Colorado playing other schools.

[Meranden]

Nice.

Is there anybody in your family who also played soccer?

[Sierra Klemme]

Not in my like immediate family, but I did have a cousin who played in high school as a defender, and you know, got a lot of accolades and everything, and also kind of inspired me and made me want to do that as well, and luckily I was a forward, a striker, and so we got to shine in our different areas.

[Meranden]

Nice.

[Sierra Klemme]

But yeah, it was pretty good.

[Meranden]

As someone that doesn't really understand soccer like positions, what does a forward do? Is it much like like basketball who like shoots, or like what's the, what does a forward do?

[Sierra Klemme]

Exactly, yeah, pretty much that. The forward is up at the top of the field trying to be available to score goals and everything.

[Meranden]

Nice, cool.

Much like how a forward is important to the soccer, the game of soccer, athletics plays a really important role to a lot of our Native communities. They've been able to help us shine and show that we are here and we can do just as much as anyone else could. What do athletics or sports mean to your Native community, like your own Page community, also your Diné community as well?

[Sierra Klemme]

So growing up in Page, there wasn't always a lot going on, and honestly sometimes sporting events were the highlights of the week, and so it was a unique opportunity to bring the community together, whether that was a basketball game, a football game, sometimes soccer games, not always, but yeah, it was a great way to be able to celebrate the athlete's individuality, but also support each other in coming together as a team and a community to sort of celebrate the joy, the happiness of motion, and so yeah, I think it really created a lot of deep relationships amongst people living their day-to-day lives together in a really bonded community way.

[Meranden]

Nice, yeah, I think it does bring a sense of community, allows you to meet a lot of different people, and also gives you the opportunity to try something new and pass it on to your next destination, like you brought it on to college, allowed you to meet more people I bet through playing club, so that's really cool to see how it is a highlight in your Page community.

Speaking of the importance of the sports and how it brings community, we've been able to highlight Indigenous athletes in sports, but also in a different way that you've been able to shine. You know, you said Page is near Lake Powell, which then is also connected to the Colorado River itself.

You have experience as a river guide, so you mentioned that you were or have been a river guide with the Wilderness River Adventures. Would you kind of like to speak more on what this experience has been like?

[Sierra Klemme]

Absolutely, yes, I have been a Grand Canyon river guide for about the past six years now. Yeah, but seven years ago, I actually got to go down the river for the very first time with two of my best friends from my childhood from Page, and from the minute that we set off on the trip, I knew it was somewhere that I really wanted to be, and so yeah, through guiding down in the Grand [Canyon], I've gotten to learn a better sense of myself through this wonderful experience getting to know the Grand Canyon.

[Meranden]

Nice, yeah. Are there many Indigenous river guides that you've met through this past seven, six years you've been doing this?

[Sierra Klemme]

What a great question. I'm so glad that you brought this up.

Well, yes, I'm a part of this really big guiding community down within the Grand Canyon. I'm a part of only a handful of other Native [American] river guides down within the canyon. There's not a super large representation of Indigenous perspectives down there.

[Meranden]

Yeah, I think there is a lot of Indigenous people who do go down on the river, like I know the other intern I work with, Lakin, he had the opportunity to go on the river.

There's also Grand Canyon Trust who has like youth river trips with Indigenous people, but they don't really have the [Native American] river guides there, so it's really cool that you're one of the few who are doing that, but I hope this number continues to grow.

However, by being one of the few, what does it mean to represent your tribe by being one of the few Native river guides?

[Sierra Klemme]

Yeah, first I want to acknowledge that you're totally right.

There is an ever-growing population of Indigenous people coming down the river, but those getting to work down there is still quite small, and I think what it means to me to be an Indigenous representative down there is that I get to create these narratives.

When I first started, I didn't realize how big of an impact it was of me just being down there was, and so now that years have gone on and I've learned more about it, I understand the importance of being down there, and oftentimes when we go to these ancestral sites or talk about ancient people, it's always referred to in the past, and so being able to be down there, I get to bring it back to the point that there are still 11 tribes that call this place home and hold this place so sacred and high up in their spirits, and that we are still here today and still experiencing the canyon in our own way.

Yeah, we've been able to, personally, I've been able to learn a lot about things that are sacred and also like things you can share, and then also just being able to emphasize to visitors how important it is, not just the river itself but the canyon as well, just like to take care of it like your own home.

[Meranden]

So you being able to do your work as an Indigenous river guide means a lot, and we're really grateful that we have you down there because you're able to share that knowledge to those people who might not know it, and like they'll be able to share it with whoever they encounter who may be going down to the river as well.

I know there's also seminars that these different river companies do to make sure that whoever's on the river also acknowledge that this is really sacred to us and there's places they shouldn't go to, so that's really important for them to share, and I'm sure you do that as well, which once again is really, really good that you do that for us.

Is there any like really good highlights from being on the river that you would like to share, like any silly moments or any sites you've been to or yeah, just anything down in the river that you like to highlight that you want to share about the river?

[Sierra Klemme]

Gosh, where do I begin? There's so many things down there that have brought so many good memories, tough memories too, but all in all creating such great experiences.

Earlier this year through my internship, it's a different sort of trip than I've become accustomed to with the day-to-day guiding and everything.

We got to spend some time, we get to stop and spend time in areas for a few days, and so I got to spend a couple hours at Shinumo Creek and enjoy the pool at the bottom of this beautiful little waterfall created by a chalk stone in the wall, and yeah, it was so wonderful just to watch the different shades of the sun as it went over and where the light was and how the temperature of the pool changed. It was quite special to be able to watch the canyon change in those small ways.

[Meranden]

Yeah, that's cool. This isn't podcast related, but I have an evening program similar to this, and I do a segment about the river, and it talks about the Humpback Chub, and it's just talking about like their different tributaries, and I remember hearing Shinumo Creek, but yeah, that's really cool.

I unfortunately can't go in the river because as a Hopi lady you're not allowed to go down there, so it's really cool that you are fortunate to be able to go down there.

Same with Kelli. She is going tomorrow, and then she'll be on the river for a couple days, so it's really nice that you guys are able to do that and then share your knowledge, but anyways, back to this. Yeah, it's really cool, and you mentioned your internship.

That's something that you're doing right now, and you work as an intern at the Grand Canyon. What does your work entail?

[Sierra Klemme]

So this summer I am interning for the fisheries department at the Grand Canyon National Park, and the internship came up so seamlessly. It was an opportunity I couldn't pass up, and so I, yeah, like I said, I'm working with the fisheries department with several different project leads who each have slightly different objectives, but their overarching goal is to restore native fish back into the ecosystem, into the river ecosystem.

You mentioned before, yeah, the native fish, the Humpback Chub, and that is one specific species that is really at the top of the priority list for these restoration efforts, and over the past couple years with these efforts, the Humpback Chub has actually been declassified from endangered to just threatened, and so yeah, as my degree was in hydrology and ecological restoration, and so I was really excited to come be a part of restoration efforts that were truly making a positive difference down within the Grand Canyon.

[Meranden]

Nice. What have been some of your favorite projects so far with this internship?

[Sierra Klemme]

So far I've been really excited to be a part of the Rapid Response Initiative, which was a project created after they found smallmouth bass within the river corridor.

Yeah, smallmouth bass is an extremely aggressive, invasive fish, and the reservoir levels were so low a few years ago that the water, the temperature of the river really warmed up quite significantly that these fish were able to come through the dam and live and just create all sorts of havoc on these native fish populations, and so there was a response to monitor and, you know, kind of eliminate these smallmouth bass, and so the project's working primarily in the first 10 miles.

The Grand Canyon [National] Park is working the first 10 miles, and then Glen Canyon National, or Glen Canyon is working from Lees Ferry up to the dam, and so yeah, we use different fishing methods to capture these fish. So that has been something I've been pretty stoked about, and I have a few other things, but yeah. It looks like you have something to say.

[Meranden]

Yeah, well this is, you can continue with the favorite projects, another one, but it's really cool because my program, we do talk about the smallmouth bass and like how bad it is. I just wanted to interrupt because of that, because I know like a lot of what you're saying, it's cool because you're like the, you're like the expert on it, and it's cool to hear like the research I'm doing on it and like telling the public is true, like you're saying everything that I'm saying, so that's really cool.

But yeah, the humpback chub, I like to highlight it and talk about it, and I also talked about like the water levels and then the smallmouth bass coming in, but yeah, it's just cool because I'm like, I'm saying all the right stuff.

[Sierra Klemme]

Spread the word. Reservoir levels are low. The water's getting warmer.

[Meranden]

Yeah, but besides that, is there any other favorite projects that you would like to highlight about your internship?

[Sierra Klemme]

This fall, there was supposed to be a project, the Bright Angel Creek invasive trout removal efforts, and so that's where a team goes into Bright Angel Creek from the North Rim and, you know, finds all these invasive trouts to remove, but unfortunately due to the fire on the North Rim and the unforeseen effects of it, that program has to go on pause for safety effects.

So yeah, I was looking forward to that, getting to spend time within the corridor, but overall, it's been really fun getting to go on these larger native fish monitoring trips down the whole river because, like I mentioned before, getting to spend time, spend more time in these different areas that I don't usually get to has been a personal favorite of mine.

[Meranden]

Yeah, it's really cool because you're one of the very tiny, tiny population who has been inside the river, so it's cool that you've been doing that, and how long is your internship for?

[Sierra Klemme]

This internship, I started in May [2025] and I will be going into December [2025].

Yeah, I've gotten to work in a few of my commercial river trips as well over the summer, which has allowed me to still progress in that career path as well, so it's been a, it's been a nice balance being able to advance in my scientific career as well as my boating career. [Meranden]

Yeah, as you mentioned, like, it's been able to help you dive into those kind of different places. This kind of takes me into the next question of how has this internship, you know, provided pathways to learn more about your culture or the 11 tribes that call the canyon home?

[Sierra Klemme]

Surprisingly, it has taught me a bit more about how the different tribes connect to specifically the fish within the ecosystem, and so they, the fisheries department communicates with the different tribes about beneficial uses of all of the invasive species that they're able to harvest.

And so once, like, specifically for the rainbow and brown trout are harvested, they send them to surrounding tribal communities, and they can be used for feasting or for ceremonial practices, and so, yeah, that was really interesting, or I should say a good experience to know that they are working with these tribes to further understand that the fish and the canyon and the people are all connected, that they're not, that they're not independent systems.

[Meranden]

Yeah, that's good to hear the way that things are being used, helping the canyon, the tribes, and the Park Service, like, they're all working together, which is really good.

[Sierra Klemme]

It is, it is really good, and also being a part of this internship, I've gotten to learn about the Tribal Affairs office, who have hosted several really cool events, like one earlier this week was a little ceremony to honor the loss of the North Rim, but also give some positive hope into moving forward, and then it's also connected me with you, Meranden, and what you're doing out here at Desert View and the different events and things that you are all hosting here, so it's been a great way to connect to the tribes and my culture in these ways.

[Meranden]

Yeah, I think the same too, like, being able to meet the Indigenous interns, because I felt like it's just been me and Lakin for quite a while, and having you on, and Derrick?

[Sierra Klemme]

Yes, my counterpart, Derrick.

[Meranden]

Yes, having both of you there, getting to talk with you guys and know where you're from, you're like, oh, that's over there, like, ask your clans and stuff like that, it's really cool to connect in that way, and, like, there's always older people who say, like, “We're so glad we have you, your youth there to be able to talk, and the work you're doing is really good, I just wish that more, there was more who came here,” so, like, I'm really happy to have met you and Derrick and seeing, like, the work you guys are doing, and we're not the only young ones here, so.

Yeah. It's nice that, yeah, we can, we can bond and stuff like that, and we have a few more things coming up, especially, like, this week later on, getting to visit the other national monuments in the area, so that'd be really cool.

But yeah, so that's awesome to hear about your internship, usually with this interview, we like to ask a fun question, so, as we're close to dinner time, well, I guess it is, like, dinner time, if you could have any indigenous food right now, what would it be?

[Sierra Klemme]

Girl. How long do we have? I'm just kidding. Being away from Page, I always miss a mutton sandwich. And yeah, on Saturdays, there's a little flea market, and the one stand we always go to makes these, like, blue corn tortillas, and oh my gosh, it is so good, so yeah, that is the main one I go for.

[Meranden]

Nice. Oh yeah, that's a really good one.

[Sierra Klemme]

Yeah, usually I'm traveling back into Page on Saturdays, and so I always have my dad get it.

[Meranden]

Yeah, nice. Yeah, I love that question, because we always get a lot of different ones, and it's really cool. So yeah, that's our fun question, and as we begin to sort of wrap up this interview now, and for our audience in person, and then those online listening in, what would you like to leave the audience with today?

[Sierra Klemme]

Gosh, you really kept the big questions till the end.

Well, I just want to say thank you, this has been a really great experience, and I guess I would like to share that if something feels bigger than you, don't be afraid to really lean into it, to allow the intensity of those feelings to fully engulf you, and you know, those feelings may be things you feel here at the Grand Canyon, I certainly do, but it is just something I wanted to say, that being a part of something bigger than you is quite wonderful.

[Meranden]

Nice, those are some great words. So we would like to see if there's any questions from the audience right now.

[audience member]

So you mentioned that you went down the river for the first time seven years ago, and it seems like the next year after you became a guide, so I'm curious what that experience was for you the first time you went down the river, and how your relationship with the canyon and the river have changed over time as you continue spending time with it?

[Sierra Klemme]

That's a really great question, because actually the experience has changed quite a bit. My first working trip was actually the summer of 2020, and yeah, exactly, and so the Grand Canyon National Park was actually closed for the majority of that summer, and so when it reopened I was lucky enough to secure two trips with my company, and you know, squeeze them in right before I went back to college, and so yeah, those first few trips were quite special, and you know, quite different than what it is now.

There was a lot of rules in play that aren't quite there anymore, but it was it was still so magical.

My first trip as a passenger, we at my company, we have a fiesta, like Mexican food night, and the lead guide on that trip, she had a whole costume bag, and so yeah, everybody dressed up, it was so fun, and so you know, I come back the next year on my first working trip, and I dress up for Mexican night, and I look at the trip lead, who's a person then, and I was like, oh, where, like, where's the costumes, like, you know, and he was like, I have no idea what you're talking about, and so since then I've always kind of, you know, tried to incorporate, reminding people, especially adults that come down, that it's a space to have fun, that it is, you know, and an experience to remember that we're still children at heart, and to laugh, and to be silly, and to not think so hard about what others are thinking of you, or what you're thinking of yourself, and I think that's just the magic of it all down there.

[Meranden]

That's a good one. I have one, but it's a little more vague, a little vague, but important.

As we have family here in the audience, I'm just curious of, like, do you have any role models or supporters who have helped you get to, get through, you know, your soccer, your river guiding, your internship now, who have been there for some of it or all of it?

Is there anyone that you, like, really would like to acknowledge that have helped you get to where you are today?

[Sierra Klemme]

So many people, and, you know, for each area that you mentioned, I have different people. I think, I think with my river guiding, my parents were somewhat of an inspiration in that they were entrepreneurs, and so, you know, it was a little bit out of the norm of other career paths, and so they were really encouraging to try this, something different, and to enjoy, because, yeah, it's not something I was super exposed to coming from such a small town, you know, you're really taught about, like, the main, or the main career paths of, like, doctor, teacher, that sort of thing, and nobody really talked about natural resources or working in the outdoor industry.

And so, yeah, they've supported me through a lot of these, you know, wild ambitions that I have, and with this internship of all of the Indigenous voices that I've met along the way, I would say I've been an inspiration. I go to this fall event, this fall conference called Women in Water, held by Planet Women, and, yeah, meeting women in the western water industry, hydrology specifically.

They have been really inspiring to just get involved, and to, you know, take up these spaces, and to bring perspective of Indigenous ways, but also to, you know, understand that I belong there as well.

[audience member]

With your experience as an Indigenous woman and a river guide, do you think it's possible to recreate in the canyon, and show it to people from around the world, and still honor the Indigenous tribes that have been here, and do you think there's anything that the park, and the people, and the river companies should be doing differently to make sure that people know and acknowledge all of the people who have been here, and come here before?

[Sierra Klemme]

As an Indigenous woman down in the canyon, and learning more and more about each of the different tribes, and how they are connected to the Grand Canyon, I have sort of navigated ways of sharing respectfully what I can, and what I feel is right about these different tribes, because there's some stories down there that are not mine to tell.

They are, you know, sacred to the tribes, such as Zuni and Hopi, with the Little Colorado, and Havasu [Creek & Falls], with the Havasupai people, but I still try to highlight their resilience living, and being around the Grand Canyon.

I think it's really important to, like I said, circle the conversation back to the modern-day Indigenous people down within the canyon, and in surrounding areas, that they're not just something of the past, and for more people to, you know, understand that their word choices matter, and so using respectful language when they are talking about these people that have called the canyon home for so long is an important way to shift personally.

As far as river companies as a whole in the Grand Canyon National Park System, I think always just creating spaces for them to be present in bigger opportunities is where things really have to start, and allowing them to bring these perspectives for all to understand, and really being open-minded and open-hearted about how we are connected to this place, and we need to treat it as so, and not act as it working, as it, as the Grand Canyon being something that works for us, that we need to live in better harmony with the canyon.

[Meranden]

Alright yeah, I'd like to thank Sierra for being here, for being our guest today.

We appreciate you for sharing your athletic journey, your river guiding, and also your internship. They're all very important and play really important roles to your life and all the people around you, so thank you so much for being here.

[Sierra Klemme]

Yeah, thank you so much, Meranden, and I think the rain has cleared up.

Let's go find some rainbows.

[Ranger Jonah]

Grand Canyon Speaks is a program hosted by Grand Canyon National Park and the Grand Canyon Conservancy. A special thanks to Aaron White for the theme music.

This recording reflects the personal lived experiences of tribal members and do not encompass the views of their tribal nation or that of the National Park. To learn more about Grand Canyon First Voices, visit www.nps.gov/grca.

Here at Grand Canyon National Park, we are on the ancestral homelands of the 11 associated tribes of the Grand Canyon, these being the Havasupai Tribe, the Hualapai Tribe, the Navajo Nation, the Hopi Tribe, the Pueblo of Zuni, the Yavapai Apache Nation, the Kaibab Band of Paiute Indians, the Las Vegas Paiute Tribe, the Moapa Band of Paiutes, the Paiute Indian Tribe of Utah, and the San Juan Southern Paiute Tribe.

Sierra Klemme grew up in Page, AZ and took her soccer endeavors to the University of Colorado which led her to working as an intern at Grand Canyon National Park. Outside of her internship, Sierra has been carving out her career as a river guide. Take a listen as she shares her journey from soccer athlete to river guide and we hope you enjoy!

Episode 10

Kelkiyana Yazzie Speaks (BONUS)

Transcript

[Kelkiyana Yazzie]

I worked at Navajo National Monument, and that place honestly has my heart and soul, and it's actually my career goal to go back as superintendent of that park. But for the time being, this opportunity at Grand Canyon happened. It was actually the manager of the Interpretation Rangers.

He was just like, “we need to make this change here at Grand Canyon, and we think you would be a great fit to help us make that happen.”

[Lakin]

Hello everyone, welcome back to another episode of Grand Canyon Speaks. This is Lakin.

[Meranden]

And this is Meranden

[Lakin]

Thank you for listening to Season 3, it’s been great interviewing our Indigenous athletes, however we’d like to feature some bonus episodes that highlight Women’s History Month.

[Meranden]

In many Indigenous cultures of this region, matriarchy has been the foundation of our traditions and values that we continue to practice as we did long ago.

[Lakin]

With that being said, we interviewed Kelkiyana Yazzie who works at Grand Canyon National Park under the Tribal Affairs program.

[Meranden]

Kelki started her career as an interpretive ranger at Navajo National Monument near Shonto, Arizona and now continues her efforts to provide Indigenous communities with resources through the National Park Service.

[Lakin]

We’re excited to celebrate Women’s History Month and Kelki’s success in this episode. We hope you enjoy!

[Kelkiyana Yazzie]

[Introduces self in Diné]

Hello everyone, my name is Kelkiyana. I go by Kelki for short.

I am the Tribal Program coordinator here at Grand Canyon National Park. So what that is, is it's the tribal liaison, one of the tribal liaisons who work with the [Grand Canyon National] Park’s 11 tribes, which Lakin introduced earlier. But yeah, I'm a member of the Navajo Nation.

My traditional greeting includes my clan. So, (Navajo clan), that means I am of the (speaks Navajo) clan. (Navajo word) translates to Folded Arm People.

I always hope that means a good thing. And then I'm born for (Navajo word), which is my dad's clan. That's to Reed people.

And that actually has Hopi origin down the line. So somewhere in my ancestors, I have Hopi ancestors, Hopi relatives, because that's where that clan originated. But yeah, that's a little bit about me, and we can continue on.

[Lakin]

Yeah, thank you for that introduction, Kelki. So what sparked your interest in the Park Service, and how long have you been an employee for?

[Kelkiyana Yazzie]

Yeah, so this coming year is actually going to be my ninth year with the National Park Service. I started out as an interpretive park ranger, meaning that I give programs for visitors.

And I previously worked at a small park called Navajo National Monument. I don't know if anyone here has heard of it or been there. It's a really small park on the Navajo Nation.

It protects three ancestral cliff-dwelling sites. And I'm actually a fourth-generation park ranger. So the photo behind us here is actually photos of my great-grandfathers, Floyd and Hubert Laughter.

Hubert was one of the first Navajo park rangers at that small park in the 1950s. So it's kind of astounding to me where that park became a park in 1909, but yet it took until the 1950s to hire local Native people in the Park Service. So yeah, he was one of the first Navajo park rangers.

Before that, he was working with the Navajo Nation Police. He's a veteran. And then his brother Floyd there, they're both medicine men, so they conduct ceremonies, healing ceremonies for our local community and our family.

So that's what really sparked my interest in the Park Service. I grew up on the Navajo Nation just five miles from this area. And growing up, I would be on the school bus, drive by it all the time, see all the visitors there.

And I'm just like, what are they doing? It's just a canyon and a bunch of old houses there. I was just like, why are they coming to visit this area? But after high school, I got to do Youth Conservation Corps, which is similar to what Meranden and Lakin are doing with their internships at Desert View. And that gave me the opportunity to work at this park.

And I just saw everyone come from all over the world and have this genuine interest and respect for the landscape, for our people, and our history. So that really reignited in myself my own connection to my culture, my connection to the land, and just started this lifelong passion I have for working with the Park Service. So that's how I ended up working with the park.

[Meranden]

Nice. That's really good. I think it really relates to why we're here as well.

We're here to show that kind of empowerment and be there for our tribes here. Like we mentioned, there's the 11 tribes. I'm Hopi and Navajo and Lakin is Zuni, so we're part of those 11 tribes.

And being able to represent and be here to show that we are here to take care of our land and things like that is really important. So with the number of years you've been here in the Park Service and the generations of park rangers in your family, how do you feel you have served your indigenous community?

[Kelkiyana Yazzie]

Yeah, so a big thing, I'm pretty sure everyone in this room and whoever is listening to the podcast have been to so many National Parks across the country. And when you think about it, you see all these stories, even just looking at these quotes on the wall.

They're all from non-Native people. And that's usually the dominant narrative that's told in these National Parks, is that it's coming from a voice that's newer than the voices that have been here for generations. So that's something that I really want to bring forward is we call it first voice interpretation, meaning that our stories are coming from us as Native people.

And I really want to help share that. So when I first came here to Grand Canyon in 2021, I started working as a ranger here in the village giving programs. And I talked to the other rangers, and I'm like, what's the indigenous programs look like here or the signs? And they're like, ah, it's non-existent.

And that was in 2021. And there's actually signs here in the park. This one actually just got removed back in 2022, where it talks about Native people in the past tense.

On the sign, it says prehistoric people used this trail to hunt and gather. But we're like, what? We're not prehistoric. Like, we're still here.

So that's just something I'm really proud of working with the Park Service today. And this role is to bring our voices to the forefront. And we're not in the past.

We're not past tense. Like, how these dominant narratives have existed. Like, there's that sign if you've been out to Hermit Road.

It's at Powell Memorial. And on that sign, it calls him the first explorer of the Grand Canyon. But we're like, what about the Native people that have been here way before the 1800s? So yeah, that's just a big thing I really want to push forward in helping represent our tribes here at the park.

Because it's our homelands. And it always will be.

[Lakin]

In your introduction, you did mention that you're part of the Tribal Affairs Program and we'd like to know more about the Tribal Affairs Program and what some projects and work you've done and accomplished.

[Kelkiyana Yazzie]

Yeah, so the Tribal Affairs Program is fairly new. When you go to other National Parks, they really don't have a tribal liaison.

I actually work with two other people. Vincent, who's a member of the Hualapai Tribe, and Rising Buffalo, who's part Arapaho. And we're the only national park out of the 400-plus units in the country that has three people dedicated to tribal affairs.

And usually it's the park's anthropologists or their archaeologists, and it's a collateral duty for them. But here, our superintendent, our park manager, is really dedicated to tribal affairs. It's actually his number one priority as the manager of the park, is to bring these voices forward.

And so that's what the tribal program is, is that we work on various things. And just sharing our voices and our presence that has been here for generations. These are actually from the park's museum collection.

So there's some split twig figurines that have been found along the river corridor. Pottery. This is like the physical aspects of our presence in the canyon.

But we ourselves as tribal people, we have stories through oral history. A lot of tribes, we don't have a written language. If we do, it's fairly new.

So a lot of our stories and traditions are passed down through oral history, or through pottery, or pictographs and petroglyphs. Here throughout Grand Canyon, it's over 200 miles long, and there's so many ancestral sites and pictograph and petroglyph panels along the way. But a pictograph is painted onto a rock wall with a plant or mineral dye, and a petroglyph is etched into the rock wall with a sharp object.

But yeah, as a tribal program, we're really just trying to bring those voices forward and make it known that this canyon's a living landscape. And a big part of my job is just helping us connect, reconnect to the landscape. Because just like every national park, we do have that story of forced removal.

It happened back in the 1920s. The Park Service forcibly removed the Havasupai people from what's now known as Havasupai Gardens to make this a national park. So we're doing what we can to help reconnect that and welcome tribes back to this area, including supporting pilgrimages for ceremonial plant gathering, that the park is free for tribes because we shouldn't have to pay to access our homelands, supporting first voice interpretation.

Like I mentioned, the stories being told from Native people ourselves. This is a photo of some Havasupai working on the signage down at Havasupai Gardens from their own words. The cultural demonstration program is another example of that for people to share their crafts here.

The Grand Canyon Speaks program, which we're doing right now. This is a little different. We usually do it out at Desert View at the amphitheater there.

But it's a little chilly. Supporting tribes coming to the park and seeing what's in the museum collections. One of the curators, Colleen there, she was just like, wow, I didn't know that about this.

The tribes were talking about the different artifacts there and she was just learning so much new stuff. Supporting tribal internships. This is a photo from our bison.

If you didn't know, we have bison on the North Rim. So we supported live capture and transfer of bison to the Cheyenne River Sioux Tribe. Since this project started, we've helped transfer 382 bison to tribal lands.

Working with the Intertribal Working Group, of course. That's really important that this working group is made up of tribal community members. And we're the team that helps make it happen.

What they want to see in the park. So those are a couple of examples.

[Meranden]

That's more than a couple.

That's so cool. This might be an obvious question just based on how you answered this one. There's so many national parks that are around here.

You were able to work close to home and now you're at Grand Canyon. What made you choose Grand Canyon and what is the significance of Grand Canyon to you?

[Kelkiyana Yazzie]

That's a great question. Like I mentioned earlier, I worked at Navajo National Monument.

That place honestly has my heart and soul. It's actually my career goal to go back as superintendent of that park. But for the time being, this opportunity at Grand Canyon happened.

It was actually the manager of the interpretation rangers. He was just like, we need to make this change here at Grand Canyon. And we think you would be a great fit to help us make that happen.

So that's how I ended up here. It helped me develop in my career. Because at my old park, I was stuck as a seasonal park ranger.

But here I was able to get a permanent position. But my own connection to the Grand Canyon, Navajo and the Navajo culture. We have many, many stories that tie back to it.

I got to join a river trip with the Navajo Nation a couple years ago. And we were down in the canyon and saw old sheep campsites. Where Navajo families would be camping and tending to their livestock down there.

So yeah, we just have this long history and tie to the Grand Canyon. And of course the Colorado River itself. If you ever get an opportunity to go down there into the river, it's a whole other world.

And you can truly feel the spiritual presence down there. So that's how I connect to the Grand Canyon. Is spiritually living here. I've lived here for a couple years now. And I never get tired of that view. I always feel like I see it for the first time every time I look at it.

We're very, very blessed to have that here. And for us to be able to see it. And yeah, just be here in its presence.

[Lakin]

And we look forward to you fulfilling those aspirations. And continuing to inspire us and also the indigenous communities at large. So the next question is, as an Indigenous woman, what does Women's History Month mean to you?

[Kelkiyana Yazzie]

Yeah, so Women's History Month is very important to me.

Especially as a Navajo woman because our culture is very matrilineal. Meaning that a lot of our practices, our traditions, even where we live, it's all done through the female side. And that just shows how sacred and how vital and important our Navajo people hold females and women.

I introduced my clans at the beginning. And that's how we continue and pass on the clans. If I ever have kids in the future, my first clan that Folded Arm People one will pass down to them.

That's my mom's clan, that's my grandma's clan, and so on. So having something like Women's History Month, it really kind of shines like that spotlight on our stories as women and females. Because usually, we just do so much that people may not realize.

So I think that's why it's really important to me. And some of the most important people in my life are women. And I think it's really important to show that appreciation to us as females.

[Meranden]

Yeah, definitely. And speaking of those inspirational and very important women in your life, is there a number of them that mean a lot to you? And is there specific names that you wanted to mention on that?

[Kelkiyana Yazzie]

Yeah, so one being my mom. My mom's actually here today.

She's done so much. She's just the most hardworking person I know. And she's my favorite person who's just really taught me a lot.

And I really carry a lot with that with me. And she was diagnosed with cancer a couple years ago. And just seeing that challenge and seeing her go through that really gave me a lot of strength as well.

And another important person was my aunt Heather. Unfortunately, she lost her battle to colon cancer back in 2022. And yeah, it's just tough to see these health challenges come to our communities like this.

And yeah, see the strength and perseverance that people like my mom and my aunt Heather had. Other people would be my sister. Her name's Keline.

She just moved to San Diego. I already miss her. She used to live in Flagstaff, which is pretty close. And honestly, in my career-wise, this is the only picture I was able to include, but it's my mentor. Her name's Kalinda Blacksheep. She worked at my old park for over 20 years.

And she came here to Grand Canyon for a while. And now she's currently a superintendent, a park manager of Pipe Springs National Monument. I don't know if anyone's been there, but it's up north by Fredonia and that area at Kanab.

But yeah, it was just really cool to have a mentor. We really need that in this line of work, especially working for the federal government, you may realize. So challenges come with that line of work.

And having someone who looks like you and has your same similar lived experiences in this field of work is really important to just go to and lean on to be able to achieve, yeah, our career goals and where we would like to go. And then I would say another important person and people is our youth, like Meranden. She reached out to me a couple years ago through social media on Instagram when she was still a university student.

And she's just like, hey, I want to get a career at the Park Service. And, like, I really want to do, like, what you're doing is, like, telling these stories of Native people. So we developed a relationship, a friendship over that.

And I'm really, really proud to see her here at the Grand Canyon just, like, sending me a DM, a direct message over Instagram to this, like, where you get to do this interview and all these awesome programs and doing Native American Heritage Month and all those events. So, yeah.

[Meranden]

Yeah, I was going to say that, too.

It was just, like, a simple DM of, like, it was just, like, saying, like, hey, I'm a park my major was parks, recreation, and sports management. And I knew I wanted to be a park ranger. And then there was a post about Kelki that was, like, you got an award.

And I was like, okay, wait, I need to look up her name. So I looked you up on Google. And then I found your Insta.

And I DM’d you. And then I just told you, like, this is my passion. And I just want to be like you.

So then we kind of sparked this whole thing. And that's the whole thing of, like, scheduling this is, like, we came a long way. And we're here now.

And it's crazy, like, how just a simple thing like that can go to this. Like, when I first met her, like, I used to work for Grand Canyon Trust as an intern. And Jack was my supervisor.

And I met Kelki that way. And it's, like, I thought she was a celebrity when I first saw her. It was really, really cool. And I just want to thank mom for everything that you've done. And, like, you've raised her so well. And, like, she's literally the reason why I'm here today.

She's just inspired me so much. So I'm really grateful that you're here and you're able to talk to me. And this means a lot. So, yeah, I wanted to say that.

[Kelkiyana Yazzie]

Oh, thank you.

[Lakin]

And it's also great that we get to see you fulfill that leadership and mentor role for the next generation.

So we like to continue to see those kind of seeds and fruition develop over time. But now we like to get into a fun question.

So our question for you is, what's your favorite indigenous food?

[Kelkiyana Yazzie]

So, alright, has anyone been out towards Cameron? It's on the east side of the park. But if you haven't and if you have time, you can take the long way out of the park. And there's a little community called Cameron.

And there's a trading post there. And my favorite thing to get there is the Navajo beef stew and fry bread. So that's my favorite thing.

Like if I had like a last meal kind of thing, that would be it. Other than that, we have flea markets or swap meets or whatever you want to call it on the reservation. The one in Tuba City is every Friday.

So if you ever find yourself in the Tuba City area on Fridays, they have a lot of local vendors there selling roast mutton sandwiches. So it's a fry bread with roast mutton, potatoes, carrots, chili. It's so good.

But that would be my next favorite indigenous food.

[Meranden]

Nice. Yeah, we try to ask something like that every time because we're really big foodies.

So, yeah, it's always funny.

So we're getting to the end of this. We would like to open up to questions in just a little bit.

But as we wrap up here, is there anything that you would like to leave the audience with?

[Kelkiyana Yazzie]

Yeah, so just thank you to every single one of you who is here. And, of course, shout out to the people listening on the podcast. And, yeah, it's just really important.

This is so rare, but we're working really hard to not make it a rare occurrence. And we're really hoping to see this across the Park Service itself. If you've ever been to Glacier [National Park], they do have like a Native America Speaks program.

Yosemite [National Park] has cultural demonstrators. So we're really trying to make ourselves known. And I just really encourage everyone here, when you go to your next park, your next destination, even where you're coming from, just thinking about what indigenous knowledge or stories exist where you're at.

You know, even just thinking internationally, there might be some people from not in the United States here. I got to visit Ireland, Northern Ireland a couple years ago and the Giant's Causeway up in Northern Ireland. Like they have their own folktales about places like that.

So I just really encourage people to learn these old stories of these places, of where you're going or where you're from. And I actually have a short video here. I think it's like a minute and a half long.

But where Meranden and Lakin's coming from, it's a place called Desert View. It's where the Watchtower is. If you've been out there, you may have seen a lot of construction going on.

And what's happening is an intertribal welcome center. So you may have noticed while you've been visiting Grand Canyon, you go to the village where all the hotels are. You see Hopi House, but that's a gift shop.

And then we always get asked, like, where can we learn more about Native people? And we don't have a place for it. But anyway, the intertribal welcome center is going to be out at Desert View. It was supposed to debut like a couple years ago, but, you know, the pandemic happened.

And working with tribes, especially 11 of them, it's really hard to agree on one thing amongst ourselves. So we went through this process with every single 11 tribe, and everything that's there that you'll see was designed by them. And it was picked by them, and it was wanted by them.

So I really hope you get the chance to come back in the future. We're hoping for a ribbon cutting at the end of this year. But I also said that the same thing last year at this time.

But I think for sure we're finalizing the exhibit panels and everything. So if you get a chance to come back to the east side of the park, Desert View, you'll see our new tribal welcome center there. And it's one of the first of its kind in the entire National Park Service.

And we're, again, really hoping that more parks will follow suit. But yeah, we're still here, despite what that sign at the Bright Angel Trailhead used to say, calling us prehistoric. That's honestly, like, not true.

Like, we're here. We're people. And again, we've always had this connection to the landscape, and we continue to do so.

And we will, yeah, always be here and doing what we can to have our voices heard and our connections supported. And there's this quote from a Navajo woman I usually like to end with, where she says, the canyon's a sacred space. You only go there with prayers in your heart, purpose in your steps, and then you leave it the way you found it.

So I really hope everyone here has a safe and respectful visit. And, yeah, we usually just, like, treat this place like you would your own home or your home of a loved one, because it's our home. Ahéhee’, thank you.

[Meranden]

Thank you so much, Kelki. Before we do wrap everything up, we just want to ask the crowd and audience if anyone has any questions.

[Audience member]

Thank you.

I'd actually like to ask two quick questions. The first is I want to give a shout-out to Mesa Verde, which is right near where I live in southwest Colorado. And the question that I have that relates to that is Mesa Verde is known for its cliff dwellings.

And I was just wondering if you could talk a little bit about whether there were ever cliff dwellings here or whether there may still be and they're just not really available to the public. And then the other question, totally different subject, is you guys have been mostly talking about the National Park Service. We have the Bureau of Indian Affairs within the Department of Interior.

It supposedly interfaces with 574 nationally or federally recognized Indigenous Peoples groups. And I'm just wondering if you work with BIA or what you think of them and how that works and all that sort of stuff.

[Kelkiyana Yazzie]

Yeah, thank you for your questions. So with the cliff dwelling one, yeah, there's a lot of ancestral sites along here. We actually have some that are up on the south rim here.

So there's one called Tusayan Archeological Site or Tusayan Ancestral Site. That's along the Desert View Drive. So that one is there.

And then, yeah, there's several alcoves in the canyon that have cliff dwelling sites. A popular one is called Nankoweap. So if you ever get to do a Colorado River trip, it's a popular hike that people go up to.

There are granaries up there. But yeah, these cliff dwellings, if you don't know what I'm talking about, are those like sandstone houses in the cliff. So a lot of them, people did live inside.

We categorized them as living rooms. There's granaries. There's kivas, which is a name for a ceremonial space.

And a lot of those sites we like to refrain from calling ruins or abandoned just because today, us as Native people, we still have living connections to them. Even though they're not physically occupied by people today, we still have a spiritual connection to them. And a lot of our tribal members who visit these sites, they usually leave prayers and offerings at these locations just to acknowledge where we come from and to honor that.

Because without our ancestors, without that space that helped our people survive, yeah, we wouldn't be here today. So it's really important we acknowledge our past. It's very, very much in the present for us.

So yeah, there's lots of cliff dwellings here. For your second question with BIA, yeah, it is part of the Department of Interior, which National Park Service is as well. My dad actually works for the BIA, who's here too.

And so as far as us directly, I don't think we work with BIA directly. There is that opportunity because our current Deputy Superintendent, Brian Drapeau, he used to work for BIA with the Education Department, working with tribal schools. And a goal of his is to have tribal schools, like students from there, come here to work in the park.

So that's a dream of his, and we really want to help make that happen. It doesn't have to be a BIA school. It could be any tribal college where we want to support people there and get them jobs and employment here in the park.

So there is definitely potential for that.

[Audience member]

When did you start working at the Grand Canyon?

[Kelkiyana Yazzie]

Yeah, I started working here, 2021? Gosh, these years are going by fast. So it's going to be four years.

Yeah. What grade are you in? You're in third grade? Did you go to preschool? So when you're in preschool, that's when I started working here.

[Audience member]

What would be the hardest part of your job?

[Kelkiyana Yazzie]

The hardest part, I would say is, that's a really good question.

There's a lot. But I think I'll go with, like I mentioned earlier, working with the different tribes. So, you know, we're all different people.

We have different beliefs and different ways we all grew up. And so say, so I'm Navajo, and then I'll pick on Lakin, Zuni. He's from another tribe called Zuni.

And say we are designing this medallion for the [Intertribal] Welcome Center that the video just showed. And then there's something in there with water, and Lakin was like, hey, I want it in this way, the Zuni design. But I'm Navajo, and I'm like, oh, I want it like Navajo design.

So that was a big complication in working with tribes, is that we want different things to help represent us. So I would say that that's one of our biggest challenges, working in this position. And then when I was a park ranger, like giving programs, it was answering the same question all the time.

Which is like, where's the bathroom? Where's Mather point? So, yeah. So thank you for your question.

[Audience member]

I had two questions.

One is, I know you mentioned in 2021, they started updating the language and even adding more Natives. And that's pretty recent. So what are the biggest obstacles in getting your voices into the forefront? And as a public or non-American indigenous, how can we help in getting your voices into the forefront?

[Kelkiyana Yazzie]

That's a really, really great question.

Yeah, I think one of our biggest challenges is just the bureaucratic process of the federal government. Things move at such a snail pace, honestly. Like that sign that I showed earlier, it got removed right before the Havasupai Gardens renaming ceremony in 2022.

And we wanted to replace it with another sign. But if you go there today, there's no sign at all. There's nothing there.

So I would say it's like the pacing of these projects we're trying to do. Which is understandable, because, you know, there's a lot that ties into it. But lately, we've been working a lot with the Grand Canyon Conservancy, who is the park's official nonprofit partner.

And they provide a lot of funding that the federal government can't. They have donors, and they actually got like a half a million dollars. I might be wrong, but like a lot of money, we'll say, to help fund indigenous-focused projects here in the park.

So that funding will really help us move projects along and get that accomplished. And then as yourself, as a visiting member of the public, to help with these efforts. So I did a research project, a thesis for my graduate program, where I got to interview indigenous people all the way south in Tucson, all the way up north to Montana, like across the board. And I asked them how they wanted to be represented in national parks. That's what my thesis was focused on.

And a common thing that they said back to me is like, we just want to be mentioned, or we just want to be asked about. So I think that would really help if, say, you go to another national park, asking what their tribes are. Like, whose homelands are these? And getting that conversation, just a regular part of, yeah, the conversation that our park rangers provide.

Making us a part of, yeah, everyday topics. And I think the more that the visitors want to learn about our native people, the more you're going to see that information about us out there. So asking those questions wherever you're going, I would say, is a really big help.

Another is learning from tribes themselves. We're surrounded by three tribal reservations, Havasupai. Everyone's heard of the Skywalk, right? The glass platform over the Grand Canyon.

That's actually run by the Hualapai tribe. So I would say supporting tribal tourism. So visiting Grand Canyon West.

You see those turquoise blue waterfalls in the Grand Canyon? That's the Havasupai tribe. They're the ones who issue those backpacking permits. So supporting that.

Navajo Nation, you've probably heard of Antelope Canyon and Monument Valley. Those are all Navajo tribal parks. So I would really encourage visiting those places.

I would say 99, if not 100 percent of the time, people giving those tours are from the area and are tribal members themselves. So yeah, that would be my advice.

[Audience member]

I have about two questions.

My first question is, where is the majority of the tribes in the Grand Canyon? Like in the north, west, south, or east?

[Kelkiyana Yazzie]

Okay, yeah, that's a great question. Which state are you from?

[Audience member]

I'm from Washington, D.C.

[Kelkiyana Yazzie]

Oh, okay. Yeah, I was going to say, I was going to compare it to state size.

Washington, D.C. would be very tiny compared to this. But Arizona is a really big place. Did you go to Phoenix?

[Audience member]

Yeah, we flew into Phoenix.

[Kelkiyana Yazzie]

Okay, yeah. It was a long drive to get here, huh?

[Audience member]

Yeah.

[Kelkiyana Yazzie]

Yeah.

So that area between Phoenix and us, that's where Native people were and still are today. But then after the place became a country and Native people were being relocated, that's where our modern-day reservations are. And then to our east, so going back towards where Washington, D.C. is, we have the Navajo Nation and the Hopi.

And then if you go towards New Mexico, there's Zuni. And then if you're looking at the Grand Canyon, say if you go tomorrow and you look across the canyon, there's the Paiutes. So there's different bands.

There's the Moapa Paiutes, Paiute Indian Tribe of Utah, Kaibab, Las Vegas, San Juan Southern Paiute, who are all on that side across the canyon. So does that help? Does that make sense? Alright. But, yeah, that's where our tribes are today.

But we consider the entire Grand Canyon our home. And the Havasupai people actually live on the bottom of the Grand Canyon. Did you see how big it is? They actually live all the way at the bottom.

They don't have cars. What they do is either fly in by helicopter, or they hike, or they have little ATVs like four-tracks. But, yeah, there's a thriving community who lives at the bottom of the Grand Canyon today.

I think about 90 miles to the west of us is their reservation. So, yeah, that's where our Native people are today. So thank you for your question.

[Audience member]

And for my second question, do you guys have, like, any Native clothing?

[Kelkiyana Yazzie]

Yeah. So that's what Lakin, Meranden, and myself are wearing. I'll give you a chance to answer that.

But with Navajo, a very popular thing we wear is turquoise. So turquoise is usually worn for protection for ourselves. And we usually wear some type of turquoise on us at all times because we never know when our time in the physical world is up because this helps with our passage to the next phase of life, which is in the spiritual world.

And then this is a squash blossom here. So this is very popular we worn with us. We have a concho belt.

This is just like a regular belt with more sterling silver and turquoise. Women, we usually wear a skirt. I'm wearing my National Park skirt today.

And then we have moccasins here that are usually made from deer, from the deer hide. So you probably might have seen some deer while you were in the park, but we use that to wear on our feet. But Meranden, I don't know if you want to talk a little bit about what you're wearing.

[Meranden]

Yeah, ours is a little similar. We usually wear dresses or skirts. And none of this stuff is just because we want to.

Everything has a meaning. So there's a certain reason why the red is on top and the green is here, why this is fringed like this, or the strings are a certain way like this, or why this one's out and this one's not. Everything has a meaning of why it's like that.

And we also have moccasins too. Mine are white, though. They're like fully white.

And then I have earrings. We usually wear earrings, necklaces, bracelets. And we also wear a lot of different kind of, not just turquoise, but a lot of different stones.

So I don't know if you want to say anything else, Lakin.

[Lakin]

Yeah, I'll just talk about my necklace because I didn't wear my full fit today. So, like I said, I'm from Zuni, and a big part of our jewelry is putting shells, seashells.

So we call them shodonne or shodo:we, which is plural, because a long time ago the rain priests would make a pilgrimage down to the Gulf of California, and they would collect these seashells. And they would put turquoise on top, and then the jet and mother of pearl, and these black and white lines. They can either resemble a rainbow or a pattern that resembles life and death, kind of that pattern.

It's popular among a lot of the Puebloan jewelry, such as Santo Domingo.

[Audience member]

So do you guys have a different guest every time?

[Meranden]

Yeah, we do. That's actually a great segway, because we actually have the next one with Kelli Jones, who is actually at the door over there.

We work with her at Desert View as well. So we have these Grand Canyon Speaks every now and then. We barely started with Kelki’s today.

It's the first one for the year. And then next week we have Kelli's. So, yeah, it's a good question.

Is there any more questions? Okay. So, yeah, thank you so much, Kelki, for being here today. We can give Kelki a round of applause.

[Ranger Jonah]

Grand Canyon Speaks is a program hosted by Grand Canyon National Park and the Grand Canyon Conservancy. A special thanks to Aaron White for the theme music. This recording reflects the personal, lived experiences of tribal members and do not encompass the views of their tribal nation or that of the National Park.

To learn more about Grand Canyon First Voices, visit www.nps.gov/GRCA. Here at Grand Canyon National Park, we are on the ancestral homelands of the 11 associated tribes of the Grand Canyon. These being the Havasupai Tribe, the Hualapai Tribe, the Navajo Nation, the Hopi Tribe, the Pueblo of Zuni, the Yavapai Apache Nation, the Kaibab Band of Paiute Indians, the Las Vegas Paiute Tribe, the Moapa Band of Paiutes, the Paiute Indian Tribe of Utah, and the San Juan Southern Paiute Tribe.

We’re excited to highlighted Kelkiyana Yazzie (Diné) who works at Grand Canyon National Park under the Tribal Affairs program. She started her career as an interpretive ranger at Navajo National Monument and now continues her efforts to provide Indigenous communities with resources through the National Park Service. Kelki also emphasizes the role that women fulfil in her culture and mentions several women who’ve inspired her journey. Join us as we celebrate Women’s History Month in this episode and enjoy!

Episode 11

Kelli Jones Speaks (BONUS)

Transcript

[Kelli Jones]

I learned more about my cultural identity while working here from the affiliated tribes and my affiliated tribe and there's also great people who do work here that also empowers me to learn more about myself. So it's just learning from the people who are taking care of these places that is part of our ancestors and I thought that this is a place to be for sure.

[Meranden]

Hello, welcome to Grand Canyon Speaks. This is Meranden.

[Lakin]

And this is Lakin.

[Meranden]

Although we have been highlighting some amazing athletes, we wanted to provide a second bonus episode for this season. March is Women's History Month so we decided to highlight two indigenous women park rangers who work at Grand Canyon National Park.

[Lakin]

This episode features Kelli Jones, a Diné Park ranger from Rock Point, Arizona. She talks about the different roles she fulfilled to get to where she is today and how she is bringing in more indigenous representation for the community and thousands of visitors of Grand Canyon.

[Meranden]

Kelli is actually one of the rangers we work with at Desert View and has provided us with guidance throughout our internships, especially working with tribal members.

[Lakin]

As we stick to the theme of Women's History Month, Kelli also shares some inspirational women in her life and the important roles they play in her culture.

[Meranden]

This was an emotional interview for me so just a fair warning to our listeners.

[Lakin]

Thank you for tuning in to season 3 and here is Kelli Jones.

[Kelli Jones]

(Introduces self in Navajo)

Hello, my relatives and my people. My name is Kelli Jones. I am the Tangle Clan, born for the Towering House people and this is who I am as a Navajo woman.

So yeah and I'm really excited to, you know, for this interview have Meranden know a little bit more about me. I think that there was a lot of things that once you started your internship we just kind of rolled into Native American Heritage Month so I'm really excited for this interview.

[Meranden]

Yeah, me too and if you guys didn't notice like in our clans, my second clan is Kiyaa'aanii and hers is Kiyaa'aanii so we're related like immediately once we met each other we knew like we're related which is really cool. So as we're talking about your experience living here in the in Arizona and working in the Park Service, what sparked your interest to work here and how long have you been an employee for?

[Kelli Jones]

Yeah, I actually have a slide that kind of just talks a little bit about kind of my my job and how I got here to Grand Canyon. I'm actually from Rock Point, Arizona which is a very small community in the middle of the Navajo Nation. All we have is just literally a gas station and I think our community is even smaller than Grand Canyon here which is interesting because the Grand Canyon is about two to three thousand people living here but it's smaller than that.

So I actually graduated from Fort Lewis College which is an amazing college where I met a lot of great indigenous people that are actually doing a lot in their communities as well. So Fort Lewis College is within the Four Corners region. It's actually in Durango, Colorado but it's a place where that college offers free tuition to Native Americans.

I took that advantage to you know pursue my college in that area and I didn't know what to do to be honest when I went right after high school. I was like what do I want to do? I want to become a dentist.

So I started going to biology and I did really bad in school with biology and I went to my advisor. I'm like this is not for me and she was like what what do you enjoy? And I was like I enjoy the outdoors.

I played volleyball and basketball so I was really active in my high school years. I am 5'10 so it's pretty tall Navajo to see in my community but I really enjoyed just being outdoors and that kind of pursued me into exercise science. I wanted to go into a field where I can help my community out fighting epidemic diseases such as diabetes, nutrition, you know getting back to our ancestral sovereign foods.

So that was kind of my goal when I went to college was actually focusing on getting the youth outdoors and something in that degree also helped me out to get an internship at Southwest Conservation Corps. I never knew anything about conservation corps in high school or even in college until one of my friends from college actually works for the Southwest Conservation Corps through an administration I guess you can say background and this Corps was actually having a hard time trying to find indigenous young adults to do internships at national parks. So he knew me and he was like I think you would love this job.

This job is at Mesa Verde National Park and I was like sure why not? So that kind of started me into opening the doors to conservation world and then just barely starting knowing anything. So that was just something that I learned and I thought that was a very cool experience but the challenge with Mesa Verde is it's a very heavily sacred place for the Diné people, the Navajo people.

It's a place where it's hard to have that cultural sensitivity to work at. So for me the challenge there was I couldn't be at these places where I should be working at. So at that time I was like kind of lost in knowing what I could do for interpretation education and that internship.

So basically my supervisor at that time was like you should just try to invite the local community out. You know in the community that we have a hard time bringing out to our park is the Ute Mountain Ute Reservation which is really just adjacent to that park. Kind of like the Navajo Nation and the Havasupai Nation and the Hualapai Nations are just surrounded by the National Park Service boundaries and I was like yeah I could try to do that and I thought that was a very challenging job.

It felt like a tribal liaisons job. I think yeah that was really hard yeah but yeah I guess that empowered me to want to do something that does focus on working in a place where I do feel like I can talk about you know our history here to the public. So I want to do more active interpretation to the public because that's something I've never done at Mesa Verde and that kind of pursued me into the internship here at Grand Canyon.

Word of mouth again people were like this is another opportunity if you want to pursue more in education. So that's something that drove me into wanting to work here to get that experience and that's the picture on to the right of in the red dress where I was during my internship at Desert View and I don't know I'm a very big community person. I have a big community value and I wanted to serve my tribe so I worked with my tribe for two years on the Navajo Nation at Office of Diné Youth which is kind of like a nonprofit program that is similar to Boys and Girls Club.

It's a after-school program for kids to come back to to learn cultural education to pursue outdoor education as well. So I was a program manager for that in Shiprock which is a northern part of the Navajo Nation and I really enjoyed that but you know some jobs have their challenges. It was during COVID so that was a bigger challenge with working with the tribe and especially for younger kids it was really hard and I ended up coming back here to Grand Canyon and applying for a seasonal job here so and that kind of was an easy place for me to be.

I love this place so went from a seasonal ranger to a permanent ranger and that's where I am today. Kind of a long path to get here.

[Meranden]

That's good though like you allowed that time to figure out what you really wanted. I think that's good when you know you try something out and you don't think it's a perfect fix so you try something new and it's perfect and it's exactly what you want to do and taking you to new heights and new experiences. So I'm glad you found something that you really want to do now so and as we as you mentioned like you went from all these internships and now a seasonal and then a permanent with the number of years you've been within the Park Service itself how do you feel you have served your indigenous community?

[Kelli Jones]

I feel like it all started at Mesa Verde working as an intern there and trying to bring in more indigenous representation from a local community level and basically that was all they told me they just want more representation from their local tribes and I'm like cool you know how am I gonna do that I have no idea. So I figured that you know going to the tribal nation which I'm not affiliated with you know I'm Diné and this is the Ute Mountain Ute reservation and that was a challenge itself just to introduce myself to that community letting them know what the goals are for the Park Service and then you know introducing myself as an indigenous woman and coming in letting them know that there is no representation there it does feel you know very lost out there without seeing my own community out there and that was my first time even learning about the Park Service so coming into the Park Service it felt like this place isn't for me because it felt very disconnected and I don't know what that disconnection was at that time so by reconnecting the local community you know to our ancestral land I figured that I would feel a sense a place that this is a right path for me so right when I started my my season here I also felt the same way how I felt at Mesa Verde and then felt that here at Grand Canyon I didn't see the community out here and found out that Grand Canyon community itself has about almost 40% of their community who are tribal representatives so I'm like okay well where are they you know we talk about tribal people and I'm over here like where's my community at and something that I realized like working with the community here at Grand Canyon and just really getting their stories understanding the community out here because when you come out to new places you just don't want to enter it and not understand the meaning behind it and the history I have learned from books and then learning from training through interpreting from other tribes but I think that also what was missing was okay I'm living here now and I want to understand what is this community about here at Grand Canyon and I didn't know that there was a school here a K through 12 school which is one of the only schools that within the Park Service that is within the Park Service boundaries which is really neat and that school is very diverse where we have a lot of kids from different backgrounds and predominantly tribal members as well so and I asked them if they you know feel represented here at Grand Canyon and we even did a school trip up to the rim and it was me and Kelkeana where we did ask like you know do you feel yourself represented here and they said no so and doing these photos was for Native American Heritage Month and asking our local community members to come out to the rim and take their pictures so that our social media and people who come out to visit Grand Canyon can see that there are Native representation here and either you don't see them in the front lines or you know but they are here taking care of this place and they live here and coming to realize that one of the families is actually a sixth generation and now her grandchild is going to be the seventh generation living here so you have these generations of family members still living here and working here at Grand Canyon which is really neat.

[Meranden]

Yeah it's really cool and like we mentioned we plan Native American Heritage Month and they usually have a community event that happens during that time and we've been able to meet a lot of community members who are indigenous who live here so it's really nice to meet them and then also hear about their experiences working here and I feel more at home when I see that they're also here with me as well.

So as we're speaking about the community with your work here I noticed that you're very community based and very passionate about supporting the indigenous youth. What are some projects that you've been able to fulfill not just only as a permanent but just overall your time in the Park Service?

[Kelli Jones]

Yeah I think that you know something that I really want to focus on and my priorities was the community itself here. Focusing on the kids here at the school, seeing what I could do with them to make themselves feel valued not just them but also their families and from the start of that actually been bringing out tribal I guess you can say performers and presenters from affiliated tribes here and around this region bringing them out to the school and just have the kids be inspired by their identity because of that cultural identity is a challenge you know even for me growing up it was you know my mom was actually going through different families and I didn't really know where my culture was at and all I was told when I was young was go to school get educated you know it's that's that survival technique I felt like and it was just like okay I went to school got my degree now what but I think that just making sure that people from this from this community and the kids themselves are proud of their identity their cultural identity that was my main focus is being proud of who they see you know they want to see themselves represented they never seen a native park ranger sometimes or they never seen themselves being valued in this space so I think that was the one of my goals here was trying to figure out what the kids need here at Grand Canyon but also bringing out people from our 11 affiliate tribes from our reservations and some of our kids from our reservations and our people are really great at educating and expressing their identity in different ways it's very diverse so I want that to be represented here to have that being expressed to the public because our cultures are not monolith so when we see one native person we think of oh we speak all the languages or we all live in teepees you know and I feel like it's exhausting to talk about that sometimes as being always in the front lines getting asked those questions where we can bring in people that educate about that too so I really enjoy that hearing from them and then expressing that to the public.

[Meranden]

Yeah and I think also our work that we do at Desert View is very indigenous based so we do a lot of bringing out those tribal members so like Kelli has really introduced me to that side of it of like performances that happen out here and she's in charge of that most of the time along with doing the outreach like we've been able to do a lot as interns to go to these tribal reservations for example we were just on the Hopi Day School and just go do some outreach about what we do and explain also the Grand Canyon Speaks what that platform does and then we were able to meet Billy Mills there which is really cool if you're not familiar with him he's an indigenous runner who won the one gold at the Olympics in the 10k race so that was really cool we've been able to learn a lot from Kelli just based on those trips and those performances and things like that.

[Kelli Jones]

And I forgot to also add that as a ranger was something that was really out of my comfort zone I went out to Washington to do a Christmas tree lighting so that was really neat it was during the time that Chuck Sams was was the head of our Department of Interior which is really neat and Deb Holland was also Secretary of Interior at that time so it's just nice to do that at the time there was that representation on leadership in our nation so I felt very like empowered to be part of that and just to continue on to keep doing what we're doing because of all that support from that level and then coming on down because they're also not my only my inspiration but they were also wanting to improve indigenous representation in the National Park Service so that was the Christmas tree lighting I don't think Meranden knows about this so it was just like that time Shania Twain was there and LL Cool J was the host of that show so I didn't really take a lot of pictures because I was so nervous trying to make sure I don't trip or fall going on stage or it was also really cold and windy but yeah there was it was a pretty good time it was around winter season so you have the own challenge itself with the environment and weather.

[Meranden]

Wow, yeah I didn't know this, that's really cool. And I know like that you're from here the Navajo Nation which is really close to where we are right now I just want to ask why did you choose Grand Canyon and what does it mean to you?

[Kelli Jones]

Yeah for me I think that Grand Canyon when I first came as a intern I already had a lot of support at Desert View from people who are working from the Conservancy that are not even working for the Park Service who were if you go to the watchtower you'll see our Conservancy staff who actually also works across from us the visitor park store so the Conservancy staff at Desert View they focus on hiring within the local community of Cameron and I thought that right when I started there was already some representation there from Desert View and her name was Caroline Wilson she's from a Cameron community and she just welcomed me you know I was she's this older lady she's like my mom's age and she just treated me like her daughter so I felt very like at home already there and then when I came here I just learned from the community itself here and the people who live here I just felt very like wow this is a you know this place is calling me and it's also makes me feel comfortable so I think it's just the community itself that made me feel like this place is special but also I learned more about my cultural identity while working here from the affiliated tribes and my affiliated tribe and there's also great people who do work here that also empowers me to learn more about myself so it's just learning from the people who are taking care of these places that is part of our ancestors and I thought that this is a place to be for sure it's only two hours from home too so I go home all the time on weekends and home I never left the Four Corners area in my whole life like my career and you know travel for work and stuff across everywhere but I never wanted to leave this Colorado Plateau area.

[Meranden]

Yeah I think we're very similar on that as well yeah because like that's also how like being here is really feels like home and once again like seeing all the tribal members who live here it does really bring that sense of community and wanting to feel more connected to your culture and so I really enjoy being here and being able to work with you on all the things that we've been able to do and as we mentioned this is the last day of March but this is also Women's History Month so as we have that and as an indigenous woman, what does Women's History Month mean to you?

[Kelli Jones]

Oh my gosh it's like it means a lot you know I think you know Women's History Month is it's it hits me differently for some reason part of it it's just not like performative because we have themes every month you know Women's History Month should be celebrated every month but it is a very sacred I guess you can say cultural significance for the Diné woman and part of that is celebration I think you know celebrating the resiliency of us indigenous women and what we go through you know recently the hardest thing that was really hard for me to kind of like celebrate this month was it's even hard for me to say and explain it in a way where people can understand it's just the injustices that indigenous women face we have missing murdered indigenous women and children so recently there was a case within Arizona that really hit hard and this has been happening for a very long time so it's just kind of hard to kind of think about Women's History Month this month and then knowing that this happened here in Arizona and where it's a 14 year old girl you know and that really hit me hard because the children are a future generation and you know we want to empower them to take on that role of their culture because in our culture we are leaders our deities gave us gave the woman a reason to give life so and that is to rematriate the land you know make sure that she's also heard and we take care of her it's just not you know human nature it's not human nature to you and that's something that we walk on every day so it's a very sacred thing and how we think about Women's History Month and then as well as for indigenous women but you also think about the challenges that we do face too that should be heard and expressed to the public.

[Meranden]

Yeah I agree. And I know you said that there's a lot of empowerment and meaning for Diné women and Diné is actually matriarchal so what are some important roles that the woman play in your culture?

[Kelli Jones]

Oh there's a lot. So one of the strong values in our culture focuses on family you know kinship make sure we have that family lineage to keep moving on for generations and then community I think that I think that's something I carry deep within my heart and I think that's something that is a very strong value in our culture and then not only that but we also have a kinaalda which is a ceremony when a girl becomes a woman we have a sacred ceremony and that's just you know that celebration of what the deities gave to changing women so it's part of that creation story that it's just something that is very important and part of that is that community and that value of family so and when we have those ceremonies our whole family comes together so you have those ceremonies and it brings that kinship back which is very important.

[Meranden]

Yeah and speaking of like that community and just coming here when I first got here I immediately felt welcomed when I first met you and along with like we mentioned GCC there's another woman besides Caroline who was her sister her name is Marian she's Diné as well and whenever I see her she's like my grandma to me she always says “hi Shi’yazh how are you doing?” and she hugs me and asked me how I'm doing and she's my neighbor so it's really nice that she's there and these women are very important to us and culturally they have a lot of significance so as we speak of these women who is and who are some strong women in your life and that have a very special meaning to you?

[Kelli Jones]

I have some pictures oh oh yeah so this is um so some of the people that inspire me from my family is obviously my nieces who are up there and my two nieces they kind of empower me to be the person that I am today and try to be their role model so I always look at them you know okay I'm auntie to them so that means I have to behave but also I just want to you know have them be just like empowered to kind of find their value in life so the people who kind of brought me to where I'm at are a few of so this is a picture of my grandmother this is a actual a yearbook from Chilocco Indian boarding school which was in Oklahoma so she was actually put into boarding school all the way from the Navajo Nation to Oklahoma and I look at this photo because it's that history that we don't know about and I never grew up learning about the boarding school and how the assimilation and genocide that our grandparents and great-grandparents and so forth have to face and just to get to where we're at today and just for me to be who I am so I look at what this photo represents and how strong and resilient you know my grandma had to go through just for me to be here you know and I think that emotional she is the one who never finished school there it's like a vocational school my grandparents met here at Chilocco which is funny because like my grandpa graduated and then they went back to the rez they built a home there and then they started doing some farming in the area but my grandmother always really just forced me to finish school and I was also raised by her until I was about I guess you can say eight years old my mom was pretty young she was like 25 when she had me so being born and raised by my grandparents until I was like almost 8 to 10 years old that's basically my mom you know and then my grandparents too is my dad so my dad left me so I didn't really have a dad but my grandpa and my uncles kind of fulfilled that role and basically and they were my father's too so I really appreciate you know them and all this history I think that you know has been erased and I think that's something that I love you know when I'm an interpreter here to kind of talk about this history it might be hard history but it's also showing the resiliency of what our people have gone through and how they survived and how we got to where we're at today so and then the other person so that's my grandparents when they came back to the res and then the other person is my mom and she's the one that is on the horse so my mom she is a single parent and she basically worked minimum very minimum wage when I was born and my grandmother told my mom that you know until you are have stability financially in your home your own home and I'm able to give back your daughter's you know so my mom really worked hard to kind of get that home and that roof over our heads and and you know I went to school in Kayenta because that's where she got her job and that's where I'm actually you know I a lot of the community members in Canton know me but I'm not really from Kayenta I'm actually from Rock Point so that's when I moved to Kayenta and Kayenta is a place where you probably drove through when you're going through Monument Valley or going through the Four Corners but yeah my mom is my inspiration because we had a dinosaur TV until like five years ago so she really valued everything that she had the most important thing that she put her financial stability to was obviously making sure there's food on our table the animals that she has and then the roof over our heads so anything within that otherwise like TV and other things were nothing to her and I was embarrassed you know when I was in high school because when where I was a I was athlete so we eat out all the time when we travel to places and I always had like my own sandwich in my sandwich bags and kind of like take my food to go but looking at it today like you know I really appreciate that from her because she just wanted me to kind of be here you know like understand that yeah like I just want you to finish school and then pursue something that you enjoy so I really appreciate that and then that's a picture of my grandma and me I'm in the little dress with this I was sitting on the saddle and then my little sister is the baby that my grandma's holding so yeah.

[Meranden]

Yeah hold on....

Yeah women are really important to us but yeah they're the reasons why we're here my mom's really important to me too and just the people I work with like I mentioned Marian and Kelli and Kelki like they mean a lot to us so we're really happy that they're here to guide us and continue to be our cheerleaders on the sideline let's get out of this little emotional side and I wanted to go into a fun little question which we like to ask during this podcast so if you could have any traditional food right now what would it be?

[Kelli Jones]

Oh my gosh I was just telling I can't I got back from home this past weekend in Oak Springs on my dad's side and I was kind of disappointed because I wanted to have some you know grilled only like meat yeah and we call it my end which is like sheep but I was actually craving Ach'íí' so Ach'íí' is a kind of, it's funny cuz like little kids will call it telephone wire I'll probably grow some of y'all out right now just kind of heads up and warning but it's um the sheep intestines wrapped with sheep fat and then you grill it so in our culture we eat everything from the sheep we don't waste anything we even eat the head and yeah so it's like it's a delicacy that we eat on our reservations at flea markets there's like different areas within our reservation and regions where they have flea markets in different towns and they sell it all the time to their community but yeah I've been craving that and you just wrap it with like tortilla or fry bread.

[Meranden]

Yeah that sounds really good, so yeah as we're wrapping up here and you know this is a really impactful and emotional conversation and just talking about women and being an indigenous woman there's so much to it and you'd work here at the Grand Canyon is there anything that you would like to leave here with the audience?

[Kelli Jones]

Yeah I think that I worked here and interpretation for almost five years I brought out a lot of challenges and as well as a lot of people don't understand a lot of our cultural worldviews from in our perspectives and it's very hard to be authentic sometimes you know and just be ourselves and explaining things but I think that I'd like to leave you with we have over 400 National Parks within the nation and each National Park has an important cultural and spiritual connection to tribes and I think it's just not knowing the land that you walk on and who it belongs to and how that connection is still there for the tribes but also knowing the history the history is really deep here at Grand Canyon you know we have we have a lot of dispossession that happened with our communities and that still is embedded with historical trauma and I think that is a challenge to kind of bring back those reconnections within communities today and you know a lot of people always ask why is there no tribal representation why this that history goes way back before Park Service boundaries were created it goes back into the photo I showed you with the boarding school you know a lot of that colonialism that did happen in our families and it still has affected families today and I think even the history here at Grand Canyon is bringing that light back into having our interpreters and our staff talk about it more and that is something I really appreciate you know working here and the goals that Grand Canyon does have is to bring back that reconciliation but not just using it in a performative way you know like land acknowledgement is something that is it performative or is it not performative and how can we repair just not checking off the list but also understanding and that's where allies come in you know people who are coming to visit these places they can you know challenge our public lands to bring in more stories and history that does focus on different backgrounds of people and where we can also see our younger generation see themselves so I think that's just something I'd like to leave you with you know and I think that I just really appreciate this and I wasn't too sure if I have any more photos I'm like really bad at the PowerPoint stuff but oh yeah it's a Grand Canyon so yeah I like this picture because it has that light shining on Grand Canyon so I kind of see Grand Canyon as you know bringing that spotlight out and also us as representing this place too so yeah.

[Meranden]

Well, thank you so much Kelli for being here if you give a round of applause.

[Ranger Jonah]

Grand Canyon speaks is a program hosted by Grand Canyon National Park and the Grand Canyon Conservancy a special thanks to Aaron White for the theme music this recording reflects the personal lived experiences of tribal members and do not encompass the views of their tribal nation or that of the National Park to learn more about Grand Canyon first voices visit www.nps.gov /GRCA here at Grand Canyon National Park we are on the ancestral homelands of the 11 associated tribes of the Grand Canyon these being the Havasupai tribe, the Hualapai tribe, the Navajo Nation, the Hopi tribe, the Pueblo of Zuni, the Yavapai Apache Nation, the Kaibab Band of Paiute Indians, the Las Vegas Paiute tribe, the Moapa Band of Paiutes, the Paiute Indian tribe of Utah and the San Juan Southern Paiute tribe.

Another bonus episode! This one features Kelli Jones, a Diné park ranger at Grand Canyon National Park. Her work consists of working with and inviting tribal members for programs, performances, and more to educate visitors and elevate the voices of those who call the Grand Canyon home. As this interview was conducted in March, which is Women’s History Month, she shares some heartfelt stories about the women in her life and how their support has helped her along the way.

Episode 12

Meranden Numkena and Lakin Epaloose Speaks

Transcript

[Meranden Numkena]

And then she looked at me and then all of a sudden she started crying and then she hugged me and she's like thank you so much for like doing what you're doing and that was a really big thing.

I was like wow like what I'm doing is really impacting and that youth is very much important to highlight and make sure we're educating them and letting them know how much our culture means to not only us but everybody because they we want people to know we're here and that we're doing stuff to amplify our voices.

[Lakin Epaloose]

When I thought of the NPS I thought of everyone having like kind of like telling you not to do things.

Then they'll be like no don't do that no you can't do that no that's illegal.

But actually it's the opposite like the people of not just the Grand Canyon but also other Parks are working to provide those ways to practice culture on government land because of course like the land is that of the ancestors of all our people.

[Meranden Numkena]

Hello everyone, welcome back to season three of Grand Canyon Speaks. I'm Meranden.

[Lakin Epaloose]

And this is Lakin.

[Meranden Numkena]

We hope you appreciated the stories shared throughout season three. Lakin and I have been producing and managing Grand Canyon Speaks throughout our internship at the canyon however this marks the final episode of this season.

[Lakin Epaloose]

To wrap up season three we have an episode of our own where we share our internship experience with Rangers Dan and Brian. This interview was part of a festival that Meranden and I planned and hosted in celebration of Native American Heritage Month.

[Meranden Numkena]

We appreciate everyone for tuning in to this season as we highlighted indigenous athletes and coaches of the 11 tribes that connect to Grand Canyon.

[Lakin Epaloose]

Take a listen as Meranden and I talk about behind the scenes at the canyon and enjoy.

[Meranden Numkena]

I'm from Tuba City and Moenkopi which is about an hour away from here and I am an intern with Lakin at Desert View and it's been really cool.

I feel like one of the questions will tell why I'm here but yeah really excited to be doing this and share a lot of what we've done because we did a lot of cool stuff so happy you guys are here too and more people come in.

[Lakin Epaloose]

Yeah I'm one of the interns here at Desert View well we are at the village but out at Desert View we do most of our work there our programming our Grand Canyon Speaks podcast editing.

Every now and then we'll come to the village to help out with performances or to work the desk or just to come hang out here but yeah I'm one of the interns I'm from Zuni.

[Ranger Dan]

Alright so this is this podcast has a specific focus and it is about your internship and what you have done in over a year here because you started in August of 2024 in our office and you've seen a couple generations of seasonals in that time frame supervisors even.

So you've been here quite a while but it all starts with one thing and that's an application to do this job and so our first question here is what about this internship made you want to apply for it?

[Lakin Epaloose]

I first found out about the internship through an organization in Zuni called Zuni Youth Enrichment Project. There's a program or an organization in Zuni that provides youth with opportunities to grow closer to their culture and practice their culture in many different ways and so I participated in a hike with them down to Phantom Ranch several years ago and then I kind of kept in close contact with them.

I was an art instructor for them so I taught an apprenticeship for watercolor students and after that I saw that they were sharing the opportunity to come out here as an intern at the Desert View office and it was kind of like a last minute decision it was like the night before the closing of the application and I don't know what came over me I just I just decided to do it but I think it was the best decision I've made in the past five years.

[Ranger Dan]

Very cool, very cool.

[Meranden Numkena]

So mine goes back to my first time coming to the canyon. I went on this trip with Talent Search with Northern Arizona University and they give students a chance to go like prepare for college so basically we went on a trip to Grand Canyon and the first thing we went to was headquarters because that used to be where like the visitor center was and people would go there first.

We parked there and we went to see the canyon for the first time and from that moment I knew I was like okay like when I saw the view I was like okay I want to grow old here and I want to work here so I pretty much worked my way to there to get there.

Another thing is my mom she always prioritized our education so she was like no matter what you guys do because I'm the oldest she's like I want all of you guys to go to college it doesn't matter where as long as you go get your education and when you have your bachelor's at least and then you can do whatever you want you can have a family kids whatever but she said as long as you get your education you can do whatever you want.

So I was like okay I'm going to college and growing up my mom went to ASU Arizona State University so I went there too because it was a really big thing in our family and also I got really homesick so I wanted to choose something that was close.

I knew I was going with the Grand Canyon trip I was going to go into something in that field so I majored in park sports and recreation management at ASU and then I also with that I knew I was going to work at the park.

I just didn't know exactly what the purpose was I knew I wanted to be a ranger like okay work with the public let them know who we are and stuff like that and then I started looking at stuff online and then I came across somebody who works here and I noticed how she was working with tribes that called the Grand Canyon home and that's actually Kelki that's here in front row.

She became a role model to me from that moment I saw her and online saying how the works that she's doing for the tribes and stuff like that so I knew I want to reach out to her and see how she got to where she was so I was able to talk with her and then she's kind of been a mentor there since then this was probably like my sophomore year in college so we kind of just talked back and forth about different opportunities and then she told me about this internship and I was like she's told me like you should apply they're a pretty cool team out in Desert View and I was like okay so same thing with Lakin a little bit, I kind of took a little while because I don't know what I'm going to do after I graduate from college and then I thought about the interview and then I was like okay we might as well just try it you never know like what if it you never know let's just do the interview.

And I did it and honestly it was like the best most perfect thing in the world like we just felt like everything clicked because I was talking with Brian and it's just like everything worked and I felt like I answers the questions like really passionately and I just knew in that moment like this is something that I want to do so and it's been working really good so that's how I heard about this opportunity .

[Ranger Brian]

It has been working really good this has been a pretty amazing year plus I kind of want to backtrack and ask Lakin because he specified that five-year time frame and like if there was a decision five and a half years ago that was better but I'm not going to put him on the spot I'm going to keep going.

You guys have had so many different experiences and done so many different things while you've been here.

I'm wondering like what are the things you're going to take away? What are one of the moments that you won't forget?

[Lakin Epaloose]

I feel like through this opportunity it gave me a greater perspective on how the tribes express their culture and how that's important and when it comes to sustaining their identity because each culture not just ones of the canyon but of Native America have their unique way of expressing who they are where they come from and how they want to cultivate that sense of culture and family.

So growing up in Zuni I knew a lot about Zuni I knew some Hopi but it gave me a better idea of how we can better manage the lands that we all share and lands that we have called home forever and so that that's the number one thing that this internship has provided me with, this a position to develop that knowledge and ways to share that knowledge and stewardship.

But besides that I would say working with youth more; my favorite part of the internship was going on the river and that gave me a lot of motivation to get back on the river and work with youth and provide them cultural knowledge so that they take care of land when they're visiting whether they're indigenous or non-indigenous so yeah.

[Meranden Numkena]

When I went to college I didn't really spend a lot of time at home and I would stay in Phoenix because I didn't have a way to come home. Sometimes it would have to be my mom and with that I felt like I kind of became like they call them a city native or urban native and I didn't really get to connect with my culture as much or go home for ceremonies and things like that.

So through this internship I feel like with being so close to home I'm able to go there go home more and then also the cultural demonstrators being able to talk to a lot of the Hopi ones they have told me like a lot of different things.

There's a lot of them that are really welcoming. I know sometimes some tend to be upset like you don't know what where you come from you don't you spent too much time in the city now you don't know anything but it's like there's people here that have welcomed me and told me like it's okay you can ask these questions there's always going to be some things you don't know you're not going to know everything.

So it's good to that you're asking these questions so I think that was one good thing is that they were welcoming and that made me understand like I need to learn my culture more so with that I've been asking those questions and also just learning about all the other cultures and tribes that have a connection to the canyon and understanding also through our presentations or performers or like what we have today just seeing how they celebrate and share this land.

Another is like the importance of the Havasupai because they're the main ones here that have the canyon as their home like they're the ones who are here and learning about how they're doing dealing with a lot of different stuff like that.

So just really learning about how the tribes connect to the canyon and also me connecting back to my culture.

[Ranger Brian]

Thanks Meranden and thanks Lakin and yeah you guys have gotten the chance to connect on so many different levels with this place and with the river and with youth and with all those different cultural demonstrators and learn so much from all of them. I'm curious if there's something that that you're thinking about from this internship that it taught you about yourself?

[Lakin Epaloose]

I feel like it taught me that we can manage money yeah and that we that we're able to utilize the resources of the National Park Service in a way that benefits not only us as a team but also the communities of those tribal nations.

When I say that I mean like we can bring out artists youth artists like the youth demonstrators we have outside or inside the visitor center we can bring out performers and connect with people not only in our communities but outside of our communities.

Like I was saying connecting with the other cultures and learning more about them and one thing it taught me was just to be just to keep an open mind when it comes to co-managing all of the resources that we share kind of like what I said earlier yeah.

[Meranden Numkena]

Growing up I like I mentioned I'm the oldest so I've always been the one that needs to take control of everything like I need to make sure my siblings are okay they're fed they're paid for like all this stuff and I kind of brought that to here and I've always felt like I need to be in charge or like I need to it has to go my way and that's a like a hard thing to admit but a hard and also a hard thing to understand and like put it through my mind like you're not the one in charge all the time.

There's a whole team that's working here so I think that's one of the biggest ones because I remember talking to Dan about it and he's like I don't know we just talked about it I was like oh yeah that's not good and like we worked through it though like okay you need to make sure you're passing on those certain things to do I guess to other people not just me myself so I think that was a hard thing I had to learn but it's also learning like there's a whole team you need to work together it's not just you and things like that I think it's a hard thing to admit but it was one thing that I really had to work on is like making sure everyone has a piece because that's it's not just me so I think that's probably one of the biggest things I learned.

[Ranger Brian]

Yeah I guess like when you care about something a lot right and you know you've been really invested with the work and when you care about something that much it can be hard to like hand it off to someone else because you feel that responsibility but then I guess when we bring other people in we can do more and so yeah that's awesome lesson.

[Ranger Dan]

So yeah there's a lot of learning going on a lot of perspectives have changed is what you're talking about already but this internship is focused on working with the public working with communities it's very public facing and this right now is actually your last biggest event that is public facing as well which is really cool and so I have a question here of how is your view of working in public service changed or working with the NPS changed throughout your internship if so like how is it how has it changed?

[Lakin Epaloose]

I realize that you'll get a lot of the same questions they'll ask you where the restroom's at but besides that we have an opportunity here to share our voice and our authentic perspective and I think that through that we can provide an authentic representation of our people.

When I thought of the NPS I thought of everyone having like kind of like telling you not to do things when they say that I mean like you have the NPS people here and the tribal people here and like tribal people tribal nations and people of those nations want to practice their culture on government land and then they'll be like no don't do that no you can't do that no that's illegal but actually it's the opposite.

Like the people of not just the Grand Canyon but also other parks are working to provide those ways to practice their culture on government land because of course like the land is that of the ancestors of all our people.

[Meranden Numkena]

I think it helped me fulfill the dream of being a park ranger like when I knew I want to come here I can I can easily say I accomplished the goal I had the moment I saw the canyon for the first time of being able to be that person in green and gray and talk to people and answer questions and a lot of them are repetitive but one thing that I learned too is that like a lot of questions are crazy to hear especially about us.

Like they're like it's just like movies where's the teepees where's the indians where's this and that and it's like it's funny I kind of laugh at it because I'm just like what's going on like why are we saying this but I mean that's just how people are seeing us without like us actually saying things they see the stereotypical stuff and that's really what drives me to keep doing this kind of stuff so people know how we actually live.

Like some people think we live outside still or we don't have cars or anything and I'm like I'm right here like I have a car I have a place to live and stuff like that and like we go to school so that's one thing I learned is how important our interpretation is whether it's about us or even just taking care of the canyon itself.

It's really really important and yeah that's one thing I really thought about is how other people think about us or talk about us and how important our presence is here behind the desk talking to people and saying like hey you're saying the wrong things let's correct it or let me show you this kind of information and teach you what's the correct way I guess.

[Ranger Brian]

Thanks Meranden. I think you guys both like I think you both really touched on a lot of the core of the work at Desert View which is bringing that authenticity and bringing those actual first voices directly to the visitor to give them the opportunity to learn to learn about things that they don't know and cultures that they don't know you know that's really the heart of the work that we do at Desert View and I feel like you've already kind of spoken to this question in this last answer but I'll give you the opportunity to kind of add to it is just you know.

What are some of the ways that you were able to bring your culture into the workplace into the agency or to the visitors?

[Lakin Epaloose]

I was able to do that through a lot of the programming that we did during the summer and I think that was of my one of the things I enjoyed the most was sharing that information and a lot of what I talked about was the elements of nature and how we connect to them through our Zuni culture how we identify them and why that's important for sustaining the values that create the foundation for our families back home.

And one example is like I would talk about the migration story of Zuni and how it originates in the Grand Canyon at Ribbon Falls and how that's connected to a lot of the ancestral sites throughout the southwest particularly the Four Corners states and how we carry that in our in our everyday lives whether it's through our art our agriculture our ceremonies like our dances all that is still carried on as it was a long time ago.

Programming like that I feel like that was one way I was able to educate people from my Zuni perspective and I think one cool program that I had was I'm talking about different birds and hunting because hunting is like a huge tradition for Zuni and so when we hunt we can hunt birds and a lot of the birds have different meanings some being like a moisture and water others being for like directions or strength.

And I'll like make bird calls like I can do a flicker.

Like so you hear flickers like that out in the forest but yeah it was cool like providing programs like that and getting reactions like that from people and just showing like that we still carry these traditions yeah.

[Meranden Numkena]

I would say a lot of it is just also I forgot to touch on this one is also what the culture demonstrators they taught me a lot of stuff about the canyon that I wasn't sure about or I yeah like I had questions about it but like one important thing is that I like to tell people although I live here at the canyon I can't actually go in it on my Hopi side because it can affect certain things for me.

So that was like a really important thing for me to learn and I feel like just telling them all these different things of how we need to respect each other and like sometimes there's been questions where it's a little too touchy so I make sure like hey you can ask certain things but not too far also like that's a big thing is just showing that respect if you're going to talk to us like be respectful of what you're asking because sometimes it can go a little further and I have people who like try to go deeper.

I'm like okay just hold on but yeah just making sure that respect is there and then also like I said like interpreting our culture into our programs so like sometimes I only did one pop-up and that was about like the snow we got.

So I would tell them like certain words in Hopi of what things were so that was cool to share with them and have them pronounce it so they know what it means and it was cool to have like different questions they ask me and they're actually interested in learning about who I am as a person..

[Ranger Dan]

What I'm hearing is there's a lot of education with the public but a lot of education for yourselves as well that you've gained in your time frame here and a lot of pride as well that I think both of you have started with but then also really expanded upon on with your work and we can see it especially towards the end here of what this means to you and I would like to like to ask about this internship it's a focus on indigenous voices and raising those voices inside the park.

Do you feel you have made an impact for indigenous voices here at the canyon?

[Lakin Epaloose]

Yeah I feel like we definitely have and one specific group that I would like to focus on is the youth because of course they’re the future of our communities and our indigenous community as a whole.

Doing youth-based programming like not just this year but last year we had a youth art gallery that was one way we were able to amplify the voices of the youth through their art. Other ways were of course like the Grand Canyon Speaks we were able to highlight athletes in our native communities and the reason why we did that is athletes and athletics has a huge influence on the children of our nations.

[Meranden Numkena]

I'd say yes as well that we've made a big impact the podcast that one's been really cool to highlight indigenous voices and then they can share it on social media and everyone else hears it that way as well.

Another really cool one was what that trip I went on to Grand Canyon was with Talent Search and then that was like 2016 I think and it was really cool because this year that same trip happened again so I got to talk to the kids who went on the trip I went on and I was able to talk to them about like how I got here my kind of like my story of how I worked my way from that dream to being here now and after that I talked to them.

I told them about who I was and where I'm from and making sure I told them a lot of like like certain places because they were Hopi primarily Hopi and Navajo students so I was able to talk to them about certain words or they had questions about where I was from and after I was done talking with them they had the chance to look around at the Desert View Watchtower.

So we had them look around and then one Hopi girl came up to me and she was just saying like it's really cool that you work here and like I think one of my you might know one of my uncles he's a demonstrator and I was like oh yeah they've been here at the bottom of the tower and I've been able to talk to them and she's like yeah that's really cool.

Athen she looked at me and then all of a sudden she started crying and then she hugged me and she's like thank you so much for like doing what you're doing and that was a really big thing I was like wow like that's what I'm doing is really impacting and that youth is very much important to highlight and make sure we're educating them and letting them know how much our culture means to not only us but everybody because they we want people to know we're here and that we're doing stuff to amplify our voices so that was a really big thing of like knowing okay they're listening to me and the work I'm doing is important yeah.

[Ranger Brian]

The work that you both have done has been really impactful and you know you've taken on big projects and lots of responsibilities like you know Lakin and you mentioned managing money right you know for I think you guys managed about twenty thousand dollars for us thirty thousand dollars for a whole bunch of different events like that's a lot of responsibility in addition to all the logistics and things like that you know as you took on all these projects and accomplished all these things.

What's one of what's one of the skills that you developed in the internship that you'll be taking away with you?

[Lakin Epaloose]

Working under on dance supervision has helped me kind of learn how to work with a team more effectively because kind of similar to Meranden’s experience I was used to working by myself on a lot of projects whether it was like my art or things that I did in school and just to give people context I kind of came out of high school before I came into this internship even though the preferred qualifications was like a four-year degree but I was very passionate about the work I was doing and so that kind of led me into this position when I was like 19-20 and when I first came here I couldn't really drive a car because I wasn't old enough yet to be on the insurance.

But anyway working with a team and being able to put up events like this not just the interview we're having today but the entire festival and learning to work with Meranden and because me and Meranden were able to share ideas and develop those ideas as time went on and that happened right when we got here.

And right when we had our conversation with our supervisor at the time her name is Melissa Panter she was here a couple months before she left but yeah I think working with Meranden taught me a lot of how you can collaborate on big projects and have a greater outcome than you thought was possible and I feel like I can take that into the future when it comes to like projects as an artist so like fashion shows fashion design and collections things like that I feel like that's one way I can utilize that skill in a different field.

[Meranden Numkena]

I think the big thing is like working with us a team but another thing is just communication overall especially working with other tribes because I know even though we have 11 sometimes it's hard to get communicate to communicate to other ones and it's good if we have a good relationship with them.

So over the years we've been able to work with a lot of different I think I would say like at least five or six different tribes that call the canyon home but we are still trying to work with a bunch of others and just learning how to connect with them I know one big thing that kind of stopped us from doing that is outreach.

We couldn't travel so I feel like being able to connect with those tribes and also as a tribal member myself I would really like to see like the parks go to the to the reservations or wherever they're at to do a face-to-face kind of conversation so they know that we really want to work with them so I think that communication is really important.

And also like back what I said about working as a team it was really hard to work independent or really hard not to work independently and give things to other people to work on but being able to just talk it out and understand like we have a whole team.

You're not going to have to stress out over everything yourself like there's other people who want to help you and will make it easier so communication and working as a team are probably the biggest skills I'll take with me.

[Ranger Dan]

Those are very valuable skills that both of you have come across and yeah handling money is a big one too and like you've learned so much about this internship and what goes along with it you were you've been exposed to things that you never thought you would be learning about or be experiencing in this internship because we've had so much time we could do so many things and hopefully there's someone listening to this podcast who is in your shoes but over a year ago and they're trying to look for something to do.

And maybe they will apply for an Ancestral Lands internship with the park and if they do what kind of advice do you have for those future interns here at Grand Canyon?

[Lakin Epaloose]

Be prepared for no phone signal. We have bad cell service at Desert View and sometimes I try to like call people like or I'll try to call like Meranden and I can't the phone just goes dead.

So be prepared to kind of live a secluded life but also to be mindful. It gives you time to reflect. That seclusion gives you time to be by yourself and to reflect on your life where it's going and if you're stepping into an internship similar to ours understand that this is just like a big step to whatever's coming next so whether it's like becoming a ranger here at Grand Canyon or a different park or if it's like taking a step into a different aspiration you'll learn a lot and pick up a lot here at the park.

If you're going to be working here and also don't forget to go outside and like go for runs or hikes because I feel like that's one of the most special parts of living here is being outside.

[Meranden Numkena]

I think mine's pretty similar but if you're going to work with this exact team, Dan eats a lot of carrots so be ready for a lot of chewing of carrots also hot cheetos if you like hot cheetos we have a lot of snacks there so have a good have one good snack you're going to choose because we get that.

Yeah I think mine is also making sure you go outside because that's what me and Lakin ended up doing. We did a, me Lakin and Brian did a half marathon a couple weeks ago here at Grand Canyon so that was a really big accomplishment and we ran that so that was a cool thing to learn how to run in this higher elevation.

Also being careful of like your footing because those trails are really not like they're uneven so just learning that is really cool.

Also being on the watch for a lot of elk I've seen a lot of crazy things this is also to all of you guys, do not approach the elk so closely.

I’ve literally have seen someone like pet one and I was like that's really scary so yeah I think it's just also the animals don't touch them.

[Ranger Brian]

So our last question is kind of a good follow-up to what you're talking about with getting out and experiencing nature but before I ask you that question I want to just sort of like wrap this up about the internship and all the work you've done and I just want to take the opportunity that we have here in front of a group to really say thank you to both of you and to acknowledge all the work that you've done.

You've been here for over a year and the amount of work that you've accomplished the amount of good that you've done for the traditionally associated tribes as well as the park and the visitors is really an impressive list of things and accomplishments.

It's something that I hope you're both really proud of something that I'm really grateful to both of you for so I just want to say thank you.

So the last question that I have for you is about that idea of getting out connecting with nature experiencing the place using all of your senses to connect.

And so my question for you is what is a sound that you experience that you won't forget

[Lakin Epaloose]

I would say there's two I don't want to take one from Meranden and so I think I know which one you're going to talk about.

But my first one is when we went on a bird count for the Christmas bird count last year. We got to this point between Desert View and the village and we're kind of looking down into the canyon and I heard these birds and I was surprised to hear them but they're the Clark's nutcracker and in Zuni they're called Lohaya Bo’ya.

I was really surprised to hear those nutcrackers and they're if you can imagine them they're gray and they have a black wing and they're flying into the canyon and I've never seen that before.

I only see them like in high elevation forests so hearing them was my favorite noise.

I'm just going to take the other one.

When we went on the hike last month or I think it was last month or two months ago with the Desert View team we hiked into this canyon and we were hiking back out after like five miles and me and Dan were kind of.

No all of us were taking a rest under this little shade shaded area and then we heard this weird noise and then we got quiet and that was like meowing and then hissing and then a loud growl and all that at the same time and we looked kind of or we kind of waited and then we knew that it was a mountain lion and it was about a mile away and we're all like very excited and then well we were walking closer to the mountain lion because it was between us and our right and we're getting closer and it wouldn't stop.

And then I was like joking with the Meranden and I was like don't move and then I stepped and I stepped on this branch and it cracked and it made a loud crack and then we were laughing really hard but yeah I feel like that those two noises were pretty cool.

[Meranden Numkena]

He said we were excited to see it.

Me and Kelli were so scared because I'd never heard anything like that that was really cool but it was scary because we did it it was a long hike and pretty cool.

One time so with our ALCC we have or Ancestral Lands we have to have a monthly meeting with our site supervisor with ALCC so we were about to get ready for it and we usually I usually do mine on my computer and we share a webcam and one day we were going to I was going to I think we were going to do it together actually we were going go on a call and her name's Teiyanknei.

We're going to call Teiyanknei and I had it up on my computer and somehow the cord got like stuck on his big like computer thing and like it fell and it was really loud and like the whole like computer the computer itself I guess it like it really made it made a really loud sound and like we had to be on the call with Teiyanknei and I was trying to be serious.

And yeah it was a really loud sound and I was trying so hard not to laugh but like and I was trying to pick it up and thankfully the computer was okay but like we were worried about it and I was trying so hard not to laugh but that's probably one I thought of that's really funny

[Ranger Dan]

Thanks for sharing and that.

I got to say that mountain lion day that was that was a lot of fun yeah because we all heard it and then a bunch of us look at each other and we go “let's go find it let's go see this cat”.”

We did not see the cat but I think it really kind of encompasses memories in that last part and you have two months left here and we got a lot to do and it's hard to think about that the time is coming to an end and we've done so much in this time frame and so to kind of reiterate Brian it's been amazing having you both here and as you know I didn't really want to supervise anybody at any point in this part of my career but working with both of you for the few months before Melissa left I was like yeah I can I can supervise Lakin and Meranden.

Because you're doing so well and so much that you just needed a little bit of guidance honestly but you also helped me to learn how to supervise people and build new qualities that I can bring into the future with more people that work at Desert View as well so there's been a lot of teaching like for both of you to learn the NPS because it's a hard system to learn but that teaching has also come back to us especially me in the office as well so it's been amazing and we're really happy to do this Grand Canyon Speaks with you who knows if we need another part two Grand Canyon Speaks to continue conversation because I feel we could talk for an hour and a half so I want to thank you for this day this whole internship as well so thank you very much.

[Ranger Jonah]

Grand Canyon Speaks is a program hosted by Grand Canyon National Park and the Grand Canyon Conservancy. A special thanks to Aaron White for the theme music. This recording reflects the personal lived experiences of tribal members and do not encompass the views of their tribal nation or that of the National Park.

To learn more about Grand Canyon First Voices visit www.nps.gov/grca. Here at Grand Canyon National Park we are on the ancestral homelands of the 11 associated tribes of the Grand Canyon. These being the Havasupai tribe, the Hualapai tribe, the Navajo Nation, the Hopi tribe, the Pueblo of Zuni, the Yavapai Apache Nation, the Kaibab Band of Paiute Indians, the Las Vegas Paiute tribe, the Moapa Band of Paiutes, the Paiute Indian tribe of Utah, and the San Juan Southern Paiute tribe.

We hope you appreciated the stories shared throughout Season 3! To wrap up this season, Meranden and Lakin were interviewed about their experiences while working at Grand Canyon National Park as interns with Arizona Conservation Corps and Ancestral Lands Conservation Corps. They expressed the importance of highlighting Indigenous voices through Grand Canyon Speaks, event planning, and programming at the Park. Take a listen as Meranden and Lakin share behind the scenes at the canyon and enjoy!

Season 2

Season 2 Trailer

Season Two Trailer

Transcript

(0:02) I feel like every day begins with land acknowledgement; you know. (0:05) I mean, you're encouraged to rise up every day when the sun comes up to greet the sun. (0:11) We need to go back to our roots, the kind that you eat, you know, and really embrace (0:16) it and start revitalizing that food as medicine. (0:21) All kind of indigenous people accepted the term as two-spirit, but our culture has lived with this since the beginning of time. (0:32) Welcome to season two of Grand Canyon Speaks, where we interview members of the 11 associated tribes who call the Grand Canyon home. This online podcast series brings our in-the-park programming right to your ears and into your homes. This season, we're excited to introduce more stories, more voices, and more lived experiences. Stay tuned. (0:52) You know, when I'm weaving, it's like I'm communicating with my ancestors. (1:00) We come down here to get inspiration, to get the power to take back home. (1:08) We have a strong connection to the Grand Canyon, and Grand Canyon is very important to our (1:15) soul. (1:17) It's important to love who you are. (1:20) There's no one like you. (1:21) You're unique, special, just love yourself.

Welcome to season two of Grand Canyon Speaks! We are airing live interviews that park rangers conducted with artists and representatives from the 11 associated tribes of Grand Canyon National Park. This series explores the lives and perspectives of people who call Grand Canyon home. Sit back and enjoy!

Episode 1

Zane Jacobs Speaks

Transcript

[Zane Jacobs]

I like to play with gender roles. I will put some eyelashes on, some highlighter, and a full beat on my face and go out. I've gone out in heels, I've gone out in corsets, I've played both roles, and I've never felt uncomfortable in my skin, and I wish I had that confidence back then.

[Meranden]

Hey y'all, welcome to Grand Canyon Speaks. This is Meranden, and I'm an intern here at Grand Canyon National Park.

[Ranger Melissa]

And this is Ranger Melissa.

[Meranden]

Before we jump into this episode, we are so excited to welcome you to season two of the podcast. Oh yeah!

[Ranger Melissa]

Yes, our team has been able to have some amazing stories and conversations with more voices, more lived experiences, and more fun.

[Meranden]

We hope you are just as excited as we are to venture through season two and get to hear some amazing stories.

[Ranger Melissa]

Speaking of amazing stories, let's start off with Zane Jacobs. He is Diné and the first traditional indigenous and local president of Flagstaff Pride.

[Meranden]

Yeah, and it was so exciting to hear his connections to the Grand Canyon, his experiences with Flagstaff Pride, going from a volunteer to now president, and what it means to live in Hozho. Once again, welcome to season two. And without further ado, here is Zane.

[Ranger Annie]

I'll let you introduce yourself, Zane.

[Zane Jacobs]

Hi everybody. My name is Zane Jacobs (Introduces self in Navajo) I go by pronouns he/him. I am also the president of Flagstaff Pride. And yeah, I live in Flagstaff, Arizona. So yeah, I'm excited to be here.

[Ranger Annie]

Cool. And so I do like too that you mentioned your pronouns. So he/him. I go by pronouns, or I use pronouns they/them. Do you want to talk a bit about why those are important?

[Zane Jacobs]

Yeah, I think pronouns are extremely important, not just our community, talking about the 2SLGBTQIA+ community, but in all communities, it's an easy way to reaffirm someone's identity. It's, you know, it's validate who we are. And it's simple.

It's just, it's an easy way to do it. And I think it's, yeah, why not? Yeah.

[Ranger Annie]

And so how do you identify?

[Zane Jacobs]

I am actually a gay Diné man. So I am a Navajo male that is gay. Yeah.

[Ranger Annie]

And so what is some of the history of queerness in Diné and Indigenous cultures?

[Zane Jacobs]

So quite a bit. So I wrote some talking points down, so I didn't forget them because I'm horrible on a mic and a stage, which is kind of crazy because you see me on a stage a lot. So in Indigenous cultures, queer identities were actually just part of the community in the past.

They've always been recognized. They've always been appreciated, especially in Diné culture. We have had, I forget the word.

I mean, my mom's in the audience here, so she may actually know the word, but it means special people. So where we are all genders and no gender at the same time. So our two-spirit, which we go by nowadays, has always been recognized by the Diné people here.

[Ranger Annie]

And did you ever notice like a change, like when people started using the terminology two-spirit in your community?

[Zane Jacobs]

I did. So two-spirit comes from the mostly Plains tribes. It started in the 1990s and then all kind of Indigenous people kind of accepted the term as two-spirit.

There has been a little bit of change with the Diné people who go by two-spirit, but our culture has lived with this since the beginning of time. So I say two-spirit because it's easier for some other communities to relate to that, but I identify in my culture as I am who I am. I've always been that person.

I've never had to say that I'm two-spirit in my Diné culture. So there is a little bit of a change, I guess, just to have everyone kind of have a common space, but I've never actually had to do it in my actual family.

[Ranger Annie]

So yes. And so what was your journey to learning about your identity?

[Zane Jacobs]

It's a long, important journey, and I think it's an important journey for everybody, you know, for some self-reflecting and knowing who you are and actually being able to speak who you are. My journey was very simple because I come from an amazing family. So I have an amazing foundation.

I have a very traditional Diné family, but I'm also half-white, so a very supportive family on my white side as well. I've actually never come out of the closet, and I joke about it all the time. I've always just been myself.

So nowadays you hear these kids having these elaborate coming out parties, so maybe I'll have one soon. But right, I've actually, I've always been so comfortable in my own self. I've never had to do it. I've never questioned about bringing a boyfriend home. It was just, "Zane's gonna bring someone", you know? I've just always been myself, and they've always accepted me.

[Ranger Annie]

Yeah.

[Zane Jacobs]

Yeah.

[Ranger Annie]

And do you want to talk too more about your experiences like outside of your family too?

[Zane Jacobs]

Yes. So I'm very, and I'm very outspoken. I am very who I am and will tell you to your face if you don't like it, get over it, or I'll leave. I don't have to be there, and I don't like confrontation.

I don't, you know? But more and more, I feel like this generation especially has been so accepting and just open to more things that it's kind of easier now. Growing up, maybe not so much.

We had to fight a lot. I'm 42, so in my generation we had to fight for gay marriage. It was a big thing, you know?

This generation didn't have to do that. I have been part of, like I said, I'm president of Flagstaff Pride. I have been on the board of directors for 17 years in volunteering ways on the executive committee and now president, and pride has changed.

Before it was more of an adult community that would come to our events, and now I'm seeing more kids. We tend to focus our festival as a family-friendly festival, which means we don't allow any adult kind of geared vendors at all. We don't have an adult area.

We don't allow any lube or condom vendors or sponsors. We have a kids area. We have a dry area with no alcohol.

We have an area specifically focused on health and wellness, which is in a dry area, and now this indigenous market that we've started for the first time for this year has made Pride so successful. It's changed. The community's changed, and I give credit to this generation for it.

[Ranger Annie]

Nice. You talked a little bit about indigenous market and stuff, but do you want to talk about being the first traditional indigenous president of Flagstaff Pride?

[Zane Jacobs]

Yeah. I'm actually the first local too. I'm from Flagstaff.

Northern Arizona is my home. I was born in Tuba City, raised my whole life in Flagstaff, Arizona, came back to Arizona after college. I started out as a volunteer at Flagstaff Pride and then have seen these kind of waves of presidents and people come in. They're amazing people, but we have never had a local president speak from our community, be the president of our organization. This year, it was probably the first time that we've really given indigenous people a voice at our festival, and it is speaking volumes. This is the largest festival Flagstaff Pride has ever had, which makes us now the largest festival in Northern Arizona, which is amazing.

This year, we had the first indigenous market, which we had 32 Indigenous queer-focused indigenous artists at the festival, which we let in, and it was so successful. I don't see us ever turning back or changing it now. It's good to see that indigenous people are actually having a voice and using it, and people are seeing it now.

I'm fortunate just to be lucky to say that I'm indigenous and to be part of it. I knew it was going to happen. I knew there was going to be a first indigenous president, first local traditional president sometime.

I didn't think it was going to be me, but it happened to me, and I'm really fortunate, and I'm really lucky to be able to be part of it.

[Ranger Annie]

You said you volunteered too. How long did it take to get to the position you're in now?

[Zane Jacobs]

17 years. Off and on, I say 17 years. I started as a volunteer.

I've been part of several different organizations, Jerry's Kids, American Cancer Society, most recently the Shadows Foundation in Flagstaff, I was on the board of directors of, and now Flagstaff Pride, I've always been a part of, but I started as a volunteer, worked my way up to the volunteer coordinator, and then soon after that became the vice president of Flagstaff Pride, and then I kind of just stayed in the back seat for Flagstaff Pride probably for a good 10 years, and then I stepped away for a little bit, and then came back and saw a need where our president emeritus, Deb Taylor, who is just phenomenal, she's changed Flagstaff Pride in so many ways and given us a foundation to do what I'm doing now, and I couldn't be more grateful for her.

To become the first president, she was terming out, and they needed a president, and I accepted the position last September, so this is going on two years now.

[Ranger Annie]

Cool, nice, and so we've talked a lot about, you know, these pride festivals and everything, but what does pride mean to you?

[Zane Jacobs]

It means the celebration, being seen, being who your authentic self is. I wrote all these notes down, and I'm not even looking at them, but I think it's being who you are and having people see your authentic self, and when you're your authentic self, you can truly live, and I think that's what all humans should do. We should be living, and in Navajo, they say hozho, which is living in the hozho way, which is the beauty way, and being in sync with nature, with life, the universe, the land, you know, the animals, living in this spirit kind of way has always been my goal, I guess. It's what I seek. It's what I reach for, and I could never do that if I didn't think I was living my authentic self, so yeah.

[Ranger Annie]

Nice, I love that, yeah, and so you said you were born in Tuba City, live in Flagstaff. Why is the Grand Canyon important to you?

[Zane Jacobs]

So personally, I mean, I'm from Tuba City. If you, if we look over these trees right over here, my cheii, my shimasani is buried right over there. My ancestors are from this land.

Me and my mom were talking on the drive here. This land has provided for our family, personally, for generations. We're from here.

This dirt is in my blood. We still hold cattle over there, branding yearly. My uncles still hunt this land, you know.

The Grand Canyon has always been part of who we are, and the Diné people, our ancestors are from this land. You can just look around over my shoulder here, like you cannot look there and not feel something internally and be like, wow, that's bigger than what we are. That's our ancestors.

That's our people. That's our connection to the earth here, yeah.

[Ranger Annie]

So is this your first time coming to the Grand Canyon, like in the park section?

[Zane Jacobs]

So I grew up, like we were saying, we have a ranch right over there, actually. It's called Big Canyon Ranch. So I actually grew up taking trips and going chasing cattle, finding horses, run off the edge of the canyon.

So we, I've grown up on this land. This is not my first time. This is my second time to the park, but growing up, I've been part of this canyon forever, so yeah.

[Ranger Annie]

Nice. So where do you see the intersection between your identity as a gay man and as a Diné man?

[Zane Jacobs]

So this one I'm definitely going to look at my notes for. So because I really wanted to make sure that I knew that I was hitting this point because I really, I think it's important because they are, okay, so I did say I find strength and purpose. My identity as a Diné man informs my activism in the community, and my experience as a gay man gives me a unique insight how to create more inclusive spaces in our culture.

[Ranger Annie]

This wasn't something we had talked about beforehand, but what, how do you kind of define activism like in this context?

[Zane Jacobs]

That's a hard one. So I feel like I am an activist by just being my authentic self, honestly. I mean, being who I am has put me into an activist position.

Being indigenous today makes me an activist. Speaking up for our people and just putting a light on indigenous people makes me an activist. So just being who I am has already done that.

I can tell you that I've gone to a million protests. I've helped create protests. I've walked them.

I've been at the White House, speaking at the White House. I've been protesting the White House. I've done marches and, you know, I have done all of that, but I don't think that necessarily makes me the activist.

Being my authentic self has made me an activist in this community.

[Ranger Annie]

Nice.

[Zane Jacobs]

Yeah.

[Ranger Annie]

Yeah. What, you know, gives you hope, especially in terms of like pride and everything kind of going on in the world? Yeah. What's your kind of like source of hope?

[Zane Jacobs]

I hope by being myself and being vocal and being seen gives that opportunity to these young people and these young leaders that they can do it too. I'm fortunate. I came from a very strong foundation.

Thank you, mom. And I've come from this, you know, this accepting world where I didn't have to fight so hard, but as president, I've seen the coming out stories. I've taken in kids who have literally been kicked out of their houses for just coming out. I've helped parents take their trans kids to go see doctors, to talk to counselors, to introduce them to people who are part of this community. I've seen that struggle. I've had friends commit suicide because of it.

I've had family commit suicide over it. I hope by being myself, my hope would be to have these other young people, parents, kids, family members, everybody, see that it's okay to be yourself. It does get better.

As cheesy as that sounds nowadays, it does get better. And there's a space for you in this community and hopefully all communities.

[Ranger Annie]

So what would you tell your younger self if you had a chance?

[Zane Jacobs]

A lot. I think I wish I had this confidence that I had it back then. I mean, I came from a very supportive family.

I keep saying it, but I don't think I've ever been as confident as I am now. I will walk into a sporting event in any way, in glitter, in sequins, in a mesh shirt, and feel super confident and not let anyone give me kind of a stare or I'm right there with them. You know?

I wish I had this confidence that I did as a younger person. I like to play with gender roles. I will put some eyelashes on, some highlighter, and a full beat on my face.

And go out. I've gone out in heels. I've gone out in corsets.

I've played both roles, and I've never felt uncomfortable in my skin. And I wish I had that confidence back then. Yeah.

[Ranger Annie]

And so you've worked a lot with kids, like you were talking about. Do you have any advice for younger people who might be listening to this later and maybe are kind of lacking that confidence that you just talked about?

[Zane Jacobs]

It comes. It comes. It might not be here yet, but it comes.

It will be here. And find yourself in a community. There's a community out here, the LGBTQI+.

It's a long alphabet. . But there, we, I can speak for myself, and I can speak for our board of directors.

We are here to support. We can give you outlets. We can give you what you need if you can't find that space.

But we like to call it our chosen family, because people kind of get kicked out, or people lose some of those people who don't necessarily get it yet. They come around. They do.

And I hope that young people know that there's a community there for them. And maybe it's hard now, but hopefully you will get there. And if not, I'm here to help.

I'm a phone call away. So yeah. And there's not just me.

A whole community.

[Ranger Annie]

Yeah. And so what are, you've already done so much as president of Flagstaff Pride. Like, what are you hoping to achieve in the future in this role?

[Zane Jacobs]

Well, I mean, as a, you know, a president of an organization, growth is always my number one. I always want to see us do bigger and better. Sometimes bigger and better doesn't mean numbers though to me.

So I, right now we're the biggest festival in Northern Arizona. Makes us the second largest right now LGBTQI+ festival in Arizona. I believe Phoenix Pride is number one.

Then it goes Flagstaff Pride, then Phoenix Pride's Rainbow Festival, and then Tucson Pride. This year we had 126 vendors at our festival, which is unheard of and stressful. But it is like, I'm thinking about maybe turning it down a notch.

Maybe we're losing that sense of self and maybe growing in numbers is not where we should be, but maybe growing in community is where we need to be more. So I'm reflecting. I'm going to take what I've learned so far in my first year as president.

And I want to see, I want to do more. I want to do more free events. I want to do, you know, I want to see us not just stuck in a park throwing a great festival with great music, but I want to see events happening all year round.

I mean, we do do other events in town, but I want to see them just as big as Flagstaff Pride is right now. So yeah.

[Ranger Annie]

Do you have kind of like a favorite memory from working in this role or, you know, with Flagstaff Pride for so long?

[Zane Jacobs]

Yes. But I'm going to keep that for myself. There are some things in life that you should keep to yourself and enjoy them for you only.

There are amazing memories that I have, but those favorite ones are for me only. I, and I have cherished them and I have been truly thankful to be a part of where I am today because of them. And those, those, those are for me.

Yeah.

[Ranger Annie]

I love that.

[Zane Jacobs]

Yeah.

[Ranger Annie]

Yeah. And so what is kind of coming up next for you? I know you've got a lot going on.

[Zane Jacobs]

So this has been a big year. So, so being, I became, I took over as president in September. Flagstaff Pride happened in June.

I knew a month before our festival that Jill, Dr. Jill Biden was going to come to our festival and we were able to bring her out. I was 72 hours before I could tell the public that we were bringing Jill Biden to our festival. And then after that, the White House actually flew me out to the White House and I was able to go to the White House Pride, um, which was amazing because also the American Voices of Indigenous People Festival was going on and the whole, the whole, um, National Mall was just full of indigenous people.

It was unreal. Like it was just, it was so, it was just so crazy that I could talk 45 minutes on that because like I, flying into DC was hard for me because there's, I have a lot of, there's a lot of torn America, you know, white people, a lot of rich white old men making rules about our country. And I didn't see my place going there and it didn't feel right until I saw that festival.

And I go, I belong here. I should be seen and I should be part of this. And I wasn't even at the, I wasn't even part of that festival.

I was going to the White House. So that all happened. Um, you guys called me to come out here and speak.

Next month I am doing the, uh, Aaron White's Tribal Stomp, who was on this podcast, um, at the beginning. I'm emceeing that with Zahn McClarnon from Reservation Dogs and all these amazing artists. Like, you know, if I could keep doing all these events and giving a voice to this community and showing that Flagstaff is, you know, they didn't make a wrong decision in making me president, then I'm happy to be the face of it.

So, yeah.

[Ranger Annie]

Yeah. So how can people here get involved both, you know, with Flagstaff Pride and your organizations as well as, you know, in their own hometowns?

[Zane Jacobs]

So this, this one I'm definitely going to read to you because this one I want to make sure that you all hear because I think it's important. I think being, so there's many ways to get involved. From volunteering with Flagstaff Pride to participating in events, whether they're drag shows, parades.

Our parade was the second one this year. We had over 42, 42 floats in this place and almost 1,200, um, attendees just watching. And it was, like, it was chilling.

Like, it was so, we came around the corner and the whole square was just full of rainbow flags and trans flags and non-binary flags. And it was just like, wow, this community sees us. Like, it was really, really cool.

But being part of these events, supporting other, other local queens and local talent, being part of, you know, a queer collective or a gay straight alliance, supporting these kind of clubs and letting other families know, like, there's a community here to keep people safe and creating a safe place. And, you know, it's, we're always looking for passionate people. We have board seats open.

If you're interested in being part of the board, volunteer. Come see what we do. If you want to be part of it, we want you to be part of it.

So come. Yeah. You can always come.

You can reach out to me at zane at flagstaffpride.org. You can go to our website at flagstaffpride.org, list all of our events, follow us on social media, Facebook, Instagram.

[Ranger Annie]

Nice. And so before we kind of open it up to the audience, I have kind of two more questions. One, is there anything that I haven't asked you yet that you were wanting to talk about?

[Zane Jacobs]

No, I think we covered a lot.

[Ranger Annie]

What do you want the audience here today and those listening to take away from our conversation?

[Zane Jacobs]

I think honestly, and I can't repeat it enough, create a safe space. Let the youth know that we're here to create an environment and a community that people should be who they are and enjoy being their authentic selves. I think it's important for everyone.

If you don't agree with it, maybe you need to learn more about it. And if you did not learn more about it, then maybe that's not for you. Some things aren't for me and I don't let it bug me.

Let it go. So I think if I can let someone take something away, let people be themselves. And if you have questions and as long as you have no ill intentions towards someone, ask those questions.

Let's spread this knowledge and let people be who they are.

[Ranger Annie]

Thank you so much. And I also really appreciate that you were like, "ask me anything". And I was like, oh, the possibilities. So now, yeah, if anyone in the audience has a question. Feel free

[Zane Jacobs]

Yeah.

[Guest #1]

I just want to start though, but my second clan is Kiyaa'aanii and I'm also from Tuba.

[Zane Jacobs]

Oh, yay!

[Guest #1]

But my question is, well, actually, you're really inspirational and like so much confidence and there's a lot of motivation. I'm just curious of who your mentor is?

[Zane Jacobs]

You're sitting right next to her. You really are. My mom has come from a world that not many would survive.

And to see my mom do it is all the motivation I know that I need to do it in this world. Stay close to your traditional ways because that's all you really need to. Navajo and Diné people, traditional ways, it's beauty.

It's the hozho way. So living this lifestyle, being close to your culture, be close to your mothers and your grandmothers and your aunts. That's my foundation.

I come from a line of strong women. I'm getting chills. I love you, mom.

I am so fortunate just to see these women be like strong indigenous women. Take it in. Soak it.

When I lost my grandmother, it was one of the hardest things because she was just, she was a woman that you were like, you never wanted to cross, but you wanted to be everything that she was. I see that in my mom. You'll see it in your family.

Diné women are special. Take it in, especially Kiyaa'aanii You know that.

Yeah, of course.

[Ranger Annie]

Any other questions?

[Zane Jacobs]

Yeah.

[Guest #2]

We're from Australia, so I don't know a lot about, I guess, the indigenous people of here. You mentioned that being homosexual men in that community, it's not really a thing. It's just part of the culture. Can you speak a bit more about that?

[Zane Jacobs]

Yeah. So actually, so being two-spirit in indigenous communities, not all, there are some indigenous communities where it wasn't accepted. And I don't want to speak for all indigenous communities, but a lot of indigenous communities have kind of come together and accepted this term as two-spirit.

Someone who's lived in both of these gender roles. There is no masculine feminine in this two-spirit world. And actually, in Australia, the indigenous people there have the same thing.

So, you know, Souksavanh, who's on our board of directors, actually has his PhD and just came back from Australia. He actually teaches at NAU. He's doing this amazing class on sexual identity.

He speaks about it all the time. He's amazing. Look him up.

He's on our board of directors. Flagstaffpride.org. For me, it's just a life.

I don't go preaching it. I don't go around practicing. I have no awards about being a two-spirit of the world.

I don't. I just, this is who I am and this is what I live. So it's hard to kind of just, yeah, "what do you want to know?" Because it's just my life. And I can say that for the two-spirit people that I know, it's just them being themselves and living their life. And we never really been saying, you have to do it this way.

You have to do it that way. We're just who we are. Well, thank you.

[Ranger Annie]

Yeah. Thank you so much. This has been great. Thank y'all for coming out. Looks like it's also going to be a beautiful sunset. *fades out*

[Ranger Jonah]

Grand Canyon Speaks is a program hosted by Grand Canyon National Park and the Grand Canyon Conservancy. A special thanks to Aaron White for the theme music. This recording reflects the personal lived experiences of tribal members and do not encompass the views of their tribal nation or that of the national park. To learn more about Grand Canyon First Voices, visit www.nps.gov/GRCA.

[Ranger Annie]

Here at Grand Canyon National Park, we're on the ancestral homelands of the 11 associated tribes of the Grand Canyon. These being the Havasupai Tribe, the Hualapai Tribe, the Navajo Nation, the Hopi Tribe, the Pueblo of Zuni, the Yavapai-Apache Nation, the Kaibab Band of Paiute Indians, the Las Vegas Paiute Tribe, the Moapa Band of Paiutes, the Paiute Indian Tribe of Utah, and the San Juan Southern Paiute Tribe.

In this episode, Ranger Annie speaks with Zane Jacobs (he/him), who is Diné and the first traditional, local president of Flagstaff Pride! The conversation revolves around his experiences with Flagstaff Pride starting as a volunteer to now president, along with how he grew up with the Grand Canyon in his backyard.

Episode 2

Ciara Minjarez and Shalitha Peaches Speaks - Native American Heritage Month Special

Transcript

Ciara and Salitha GRCA Speaks Episode 2 Season 2

[Ciara]

So when we think about it, we have really still been eating like we're on rations. So now with the younger generation, we're starting to realize and acknowledge that, yeah, we need to make that change. We need to go back to our roots, the kind that you eat, you know, and really embrace it and start revitalizing that food as medicine, really.

[Ranger Lizzy]

Welcome, I'm Ranger Lizzy.

[Ranger Melissa]

And I'm Ranger Melissa.

[Ranger Lizzy]

We are so excited to share this episode with y'all.

We sat down with Shalitha and Ciara from White Mountain Apache Tribe to talk about food sovereignty. I really love the way that they're decolonizing their relationship with food.

[Ranger Melissa]

Yeah, they're really doing amazing work. Listening to this episode, I love the way they refer to themselves as women of change because they're breaking the norms, like not just for themselves and their community, but for the global community and the next generation.

[Ranger Lizzy]

These women are truly amazing. So without further ado, Shalitha and Ciara.

[Shalitha]

Hi, everyone. My name is Salitha. I am coming from the White Mountain Apache Tribe.

Also, just to kind of identify myself with the land. So I come from a, Ciara and I both come from a band [band name in Apache]. So this is the connection that we associate when we're introducing ourselves to the community or to another indigenous tribe.

But basically, in our language, that it just basically means two hills that cut into each other. So on a reservation, it explains a certain location. So I work in four different job areas.

One is actually my own personal one. It's a, I'm hoping to be a business, which is fostering young Apache gatherers. Elderlies in training is one of the one things that I really like to say.

And it's basically working with youth and teaching them the Apache foodways within our reservation. Another one that I'm a part of is a non-profit in coordinating with people that want to come to our reservation and help local projects that are happening, especially with the agriculture area. And then also working at a tribal farm called Ndée Bikíyaa, the people's farm, as a farmer's market coordinator and marketing a lot of the produce that's growing at the farm. And what was my fourth one? There's another one. I just tend to like my mind right now.

But yeah, so that's who I am and kind of where I come from.

[Ciara]

Awesome. Yes. Thank you, Shai.

So hello, everyone. My name is Ciara Minjarez, and I come from the Fort Apache Indian Reservation. A lot of my background work is in our background work is in farming.

We really try to get with our roots back into we say like it's we need to return back to our roots, the kind that you eat, you know. So when we talk about our work and in terms of food sovereignty and resiliency, we have a lot of programs that are dedicated to to working with those those food systems and really tweaking them to be self-sufficient so that we don't have to really rely on that many people. So for me, I work with Local First Arizona as the Indigenous Foodways Program Manager.

And with through that job, they allow me to work with all the Indigenous tribes in southeastern Arizona, mainly farmers, ranchers, gardeners and growers, providing technical service, technical support and resources throughout our our entire nonprofit. I'm also a part of different community committees. One of them is called Chaghashe Bidan Siine, and that's the White Mountain Apache Child Food Security Program. And what we did was we tried to come up with out of the box ideas on how to get children fed on the reservation. So we can talk more about that later. But another one, that's how me and Shai really kind of got together and had a partnership with what she's doing and and coming out here and talking about teaching the kids and expanding their knowledge.

Because like when COVID came, gosh, you know, we lost a lot of knowledge there. So it's up to us to keep keep it going. And then I'm also part of a nonprofit called Spring to Action, which we we like to, we're in the process of really becoming a physical sponsor.

We want to be able to provide funds through our tribe without getting through the whole paperwork process. We want to make it easier to access that not just for our tribes, but for all tribes. And we started just building this alliance with our partner tribes.

And it's just been a wonderful experience because, you know, there's one thing that we always all have in common, food. You know, we always all need food. So we're excited to talk to you guys today about food sovereignty.

[Ranger Dawn]

Yeah, I'm so excited. This is like so my jam too. So I kind of wanted to yeah, just get a background on y'all.

What was your relationship to food and farming like growing up? Like, how did you get into this work? Like, where did that curiosity spark from?

[Shalitha]

Oh, my gosh. So for me, I was your average res kid running around in the summer, like by down by the river getting all tshie and everything. But when I say tshie, I mean, like all dry skin and very dark. So but for me, food has always been a connection I had, especially within the Grand Canyon area, we have so much similarities with food. And we were able to do some walks here and see some of the food that are familiar back home. And one of them was the sumac berries, and it's very sweet and tart.

And we had a walk this morning, between 11 and one. And so we're able to do a share that taste testing. And so for me, I've always remember having that food and not really knowing the importance of it.

And so it's always been something that I felt connected with, especially with a lot of the jobs that I have currently, and currently work with and network with. So there's, I feel like for me, food has always been a vast connection. I'm actually looking at being an ethnobotanist, which is basically the study of plants within a certain region.

I mainly geared towards the White Mountain Apache region and highlighting what our Apache foods are and hopefully being able to share it with the world and networking with other indigenous tribes and trying to help them create that and decolonizing our way of food and revitalizing a lot of those teachings back into the indigenous communities.

[Ciara]

So awesome. I love that. Yeah.

So for me, I had growing up on the reservation, you know, we're always, always looking forward to that time of the month, when they would give you different commodities, they gave you a box of commodities, they had all different types of food. And it wasn't until I got older, that I realized these foods are really high in preservatives. There's a reason why our people are dying from diet related diseases.

And it's because of this, this food that we get so excited over, you know, there's this brick of cheese, we call Apache gold, you know, and it's commodity cheese. But it's, it was stuff like that, that I always used to identify, like even fry bread, you know, everybody loves fry bread, but they don't know the reason why it's that we started making fry bread, that is not an indigenous food, but it was more like a culinary creation out of what we were given. And they talk about buggy flour, and rancid lard.

And that was kind of where we, that was kind of where I started my journey and looking into that. And when I started working at the farm, they were able to teach me like, did, did you know that this food that we used to eat, and then that food pyramid that they have that they're giving us now, it's not for our indigenous bodies. That's not how we used to eat, we never used to sit around all the time, we were always out getting our food.

So when I started looking into different ways of like, even my body, myself, I had was like, diagnosed with prediabetes. And I started freaking out, like, why I try to like, you know, I've been eating the food that has we've all been eating. And then it made sense, because a lot of people I knew had it, my grandma had it and just going back to the farm and for them teaching me like, well, you know what, it's because it's traveling all these ways, and they're trying to make it last forever.

And when they do that, it lasts forever, inside your belly, inside your gut, inside your your body. And so, yeah, there's a lot of food that we like to share when it comes to each other. So when we think about it, we have really still been eating like we're on rations.

So now with the younger generation, we're starting to realize and acknowledge that, yeah, we need to make that change. We need to go back to our roots, the kind that you eat, you know, and, and really embrace it and start revitalizing that food as medicine, really. So that's where I kind of like built it was really when I came to the farm, and I met Shai and all the cool farmers from Ndée Bikíyaa.

[Shalitha]

And just to let you guys know, I've actually been doing this for about going on eight years. And a lot of the team teachings that I have currently and was able to share with Ciara and do demos with I have learned from my elders, I do not go to school for this. It's something that I was able to learn from my elders, but also learn in my language first, which is Apache, or also known as an Athabascan language.

And so being able to walk in what seems like two or three worlds, because I have to know the plant's name in my language, and then also know the scientific name, and then also identify it in the common name. So for me, learning about foods is not just one world. It's also my people's world in a larger scale of other teachings.

[Ranger Dawn]

So yeah, I love how you give a lot of credit to your elders. And I like what you say, elders in training, like that's what you're trying to do to become to to teach the younger generation. I also know you wanted to talk about like women of change.

So what does it mean for you as like women to be in this role of like elders in training?

[Ciara]

You want to start?

[Shalitha]

Oh, yeah. Okay. So we're one of the main things that we definitely want a lot of people to take away from this podcast is definitely, Ciara, Sometimes I view both of us as women of change, because a lot of the projects that we have came from a simple idea that we wanted to introduce to the community. And so for us women, we are women of change within our community. And we hope to network on a larger scale with other people, with other indigenous people within Indian territory, and then also within the world, you know, because a lot of people, I feel like don't really know indigenous people or their history.

And so and I hope to share that in a way that educates people and understands that we're all the same, regardless. If one of us gets cut, it's going to bleed red. So knowing that we're all equal, we're all the same, but we're also women are people that are very rooted in our beliefs, especially with women, I feel like women, usually the men are the ones who are the head of the house.

At the end of the day, I feel like it's the women who runs the household because they have to make sure all the dishes is washed, make sure supper is on at the time at the same time, make sure the kids are all good to go. And so the man is just a moral support. [giggles] So but that, but then again, they're the protector of the home.

So it's a yin and yang dance for me.

[Ciara]

Yeah. And so like, for us, when we say women of change, I feel like we're the ones who are breaking those change, changing those norms. I know I like to use the reference, well, you know, now we have WiFi in our wiki ups, you know, and it's something new. We're embracing that technology, especially when it comes to really fighting the norms of what it used to be. And like I said, we're used to having rations, we're used to relying on the government. And that's where we come in, because we don't want to be like that no more.

We want to be able to take care of ourselves. We want to be able to grow our food the way we want to healthy. We want to be able to go out there and find our medicine because now we can.

When I look back at our reservation, there's so many things that need to change, really need to change. And I feel like in order for us to make an impact, we have to be the ones to put together these events. We have to be the ones to learn about them and make these connections because it's not really for us.

It was never really for us. And I was telling Shai this too, that when we were coming here, we're saying, how can we make this better, the earth better? How can we make sure there's food better?

Not just for us, not for our kids, but for their kids. Make sure this place is still there for them. Make sure they're able to just be healthy, you know, and live long lives.

And I want to be able to see that day, you know, where we can all get along, we can all be healthy together, we can share things. And when I say this, I see it. I see it.

And that's when I say we are women of change, because a lot of people recognize tribes as we always fight. They always fought with each other. They just always just, they're territorial.

But now we say, no, we don't fight no more. We're trying to unite. We're trying to learn from each other and heal with each other.

We've all have this connection. Like even when we talk to different people, we can joke around and it feels good. It feels normal.

And there's trust. Yeah, it feels like trust. Yeah, there's that trust there.

So that's where we said, we see it and we can feel it. You know, that's the change. And we're the women that help try and bring that, you know, to the, not just our community, but to all the tribal communities, to even the surrounding communities.

Because like Shai said, we're all one person. We all deserve to eat and live together in peace, you know.

[Ranger Dawn]

Yeah, we were chatting on the phone like earlier in the week. I loved how you're talking about like collaboration between the tribes and how that meant a lot to you. And I also appreciate how much you value education and like teaching younger people.

Did you want to talk about like the programs with, where you're at when you're teaching younger people these things?

[Ciara]

Yeah. All right. So yeah, one of the things we did back on our tribe in the White Mountains, and that's Fort Apache Indian Reservation, we were out there, we were able to, well, it all started off with a simple survey.

We asked the tribe, what do you want when it comes to your food systems? How can we support you? And unanimously, hands down, everyone said, we're tired of seeing our kids hungry.

You know, we don't want any of the kids to be hungry. And it wasn't just our reservation. It was Hualapai.

It was Hopi. It was CRIT. You know, it was all of these different tribal nations.

And so we came together and with our tribe and we had to ask ourselves, how can we get these kids fed? How can we get them sustenance when they don't have a ride? They don't have money, you know, and they just are miles away from the nearest food source.

And so we talked to our elders, how can we, how can we feed the kids? And they said, are you crazy? Do you see all this food around you?

You know, and so we were like, oh, wow, okay. And we learned how to make a yucca blossom soup. It's like a wild cabbage where we come from.

And it's a really sweet wild cabbage. And so through that, we were able to invite different tribes to come and share this meal with us. And just having them share that meal and that conversation, that laugh, that bond we had, they started coming up with their own ideas.

And we just, we recently visited Hualapai's community garden and they're able to feed their tribe for four days, their whole tribe. And that's big on a scale that we are at, you know, like where we still have hungry kids. So that's where we really, we're learning from them and we're partnering with them to build these resources and connect in that way.

And like I said, we're all about uniting each other now and we're done fighting each other. We're ready to heal together and grow together. And that's just like one of the many projects that we work on together.

And I know like, there's just so much going on and there's so many, and I feel like one of the reasons why we like to do this, like we all know what happened with COVID, but that really took a lot of our elders. And I think it really put a fire under all of us to start learning and writing our own books and learning how to pass that knowledge onto the kids, like metaphorically, because we don't really write our own books, you know, like we don't really do it like that. We have to go observe, touch the plant, smell the plant, see the colors, and even just looking at it, you know, is it spiky?

Where is it growing at? What's next to it? What eats it even?

So in just identifying those few things, it was super important to our survival. It was like, and it was something that we were told was detrimental. You cannot leave the reservation.

And so now we encourage everyone. There's nobody telling you, no, you know, you don't have to eat like this no more. I can show you, you know, I can show you how to get it, how to clean it, how to cook it, how to eat it, and how to preserve it.

And that's how, and I always tell myself, it's nothing that we didn't know already.

[Shalitha]

So for me, having to like really find out where my starting point was in my community is really just like, I wanted to hear from the community what they wanted, what was impacting them and making it harder for them to have access to healthier foods. And so we did a survey and I really just reached out to the community and hearing from them in that way. And then on a larger scale, we also reached out to farmers and getting ideas from them and really working with them and making them, they really became a family.

And so within these territories, I'm actually pretty familiar with a lot of the farmers in the area. And there was one that we really met with, his name is Tyrone Thompson, and he just recently passed, but he was a really good friend that really connected me with these areas and networking with them. So for me, it's always been just being able to have a casual conversation with whoever and finding out what is it that we can do to make this work, whether whatever project it may have been.

[Ranger Dawn]

Yeah, I like how you're empowering the youth. I agree, it's so important. You also said you wanted to mention avoiding exploiting plants.

So did you want to expand on that?

[Ciara]

Yes, yes. Oh my gosh. So we like to talk about a lot of our plants and share a lot of traditional foods, but there's a lot of things that we get scared of.

If we show you this plant, will you harvest it to extinction? But we don't want to be selective about who gets to learn this because it should be common knowledge to eat climate smart and acclimated to where your environment is. So we try to teach, but at the same time, we want to teach that don't leave things worse than when you found it.

Don't overharvest these plants. Don't sell them for your own benefit to where we can't buy them no more. And it's easy to do that.

And we always try to expand on really making sure you know how to sow the seeds, even though you take some. Don't take the whole plant. Don't rip it out from its roots.

There's some ways that you can harvest things. There's safe ways to make sure that they will keep growing, that there will be plants for the next generation and the next generation. There's times when we had, for example, the century plant, and that's how long it takes for it to be full maturity.

A century, you know, that's a hundred years. And for us to be cutting it down and eating it like sugar cane, I know it's delicious, but I mean, if you cut all of them down, then there's no more for anybody to enjoy sugar cane no more. So we really wanted to get out there and say, you know, be careful of how you take things and only take what you need.

That's a big lesson on where we come from. You don't really need too much. And when we think about the value of things, we don't measure our wealth in what we have and what we're saving up. We measure our wealth in what we give. And it's always like that. It's always been like that.

And that's why we want to really get out there, that there is a way to work together and make it healthy in a healthy way.

[Shalitha]

Yeah. A lot of the times when we do a lot of wild food walk, hopefully we'll be able to do one tomorrow. So if you guys want to come back and check it out, we'll be here.

But usually a lot of the times when I do wild food walks within the community or within other areas, I tend to do like a little small introduction on safety food practices. And so there's different levels of that. And for me, it's just basically respecting the land and leaving it better than what it is.

And basically trying to teach that with the kids to a level that they understand. And what does that look like in making it a lot healthier? Because within Indian country, a lot of kids or a lot of parents tend to yell or spank or do something in that concept.

So I'm trying to do it in a more healthier manner and trying to break that trauma that was instilled in a lot of our communities with boarding schools. So trying to break that trauma and making sure that what we teach is not exploited, especially for the indigenous communities, because a lot of the wild foods are vastly grown from California coast all the way to within Arizona, all the way leading up to New Mexico. So that's a lot of the harvesting areas that I know of, but also I know it because I network with multiple people within agriculture fields, especially with farming, because that's one of the main things that I do outside of my life.

So I'm a full time farmer, eight hours for work, and then the rest is outside of life in my little garden with my family. So really a lot of the teachings that I instill is also something that I do at home. I'm the oldest, and so I teach my oldest to seven siblings.

So I carry the responsibility of teaching a lot of our Apache teachings. And what I teach them is what I use to teach the kids within the outer communities and learning how to handle certain situations. And so for me, just introducing that to a kid and at their level, and as it gets to adults, it's a lot more easier.

And I feel like it's a lot more fun because you get the actual questions, the hard questions. And I love it when they ask me questions, it keeps me on my toes. And it also lets me know, okay, I need to learn about this topic because they're asking about it.

If I do not know the answer, I'm going to go find it and I'll get back to you. So that's a lot of the things that for me, I fairly enjoy with the kids and teaching those ways, but making it in a healthier environment for them.

[Ciara]

Yeah. And then one last thing that I wanted to really share with you guys was that a Hopi elder had talked to us. And when she had joined us in our wild foods walk, she had told us that all these plants that you see out here, they're not just plants.

And when you think about your family and your history, you got to remember that all these plants have their own families. They have ancestors and roots that have been here way longer than we've been here. Our families probably ate these same plants.

So when you're out there and looking at things to eat, always remember to just treat them with respect and let them know that, you know, I'm here, I'm here with you guys. And thank you for letting me be here. Because a lot of the times you don't know what's poisonous.

When we were doing our demo earlier, we were talking about the [Tree name in Apache]. And there's a tree over here. It's right over here.

And it looks just like it. And so when our elders teach us, we walk with them and they tell you, you can drink this one. But that one right there, that one will kill you.

[Shalitha]

And they go right next to each other.

[Ciara]

Yeah. And they go right next to each other. So it's really, and they will only tell you one time.

So you really have to pay attention. And so that's always embedded into my psyche when I come go and teach the kids like, that one will kill you, you know, and that really wakes them up. Like, yeah, these plants, they're very powerful.

And then there's ways you can eat them. There's ways that they can be used for medicine. There's all kinds of things.

Just with the sumac drink that we had, it had been researched by different nutritionists that came and tested it. And there was different beneficial things that had come out of that plant. And they had tried to take it off the reservation and domesticate it for medicine.

But when they did that, it completely depleted it of all its nutrition. And so it's like the land is telling you, leave it alone. You know, it stays there.

And there's a reason why. And I feel like for us being able to share that with you guys and that drink and all of that stuff, it was because you're friends, you're our visitors, and we're happy to have you here and even show you guys like, if God forbid, you know, you're ever out there on your own, at least you know there's a sumac berry out here that can help me. And then there's also like wild tea, yucca blossoms, yucca bananas, juniper, juniper berries, there's so much going on.

So yeah, I think, yeah, that's all you have. So much, so much there for, for all of you guys to just look at and explore. And even just if you have to, there's ways to survive.

[Ranger Dawn]

Yeah, I love that ending statement. That was great. Yeah, just like, walking with reverence on the land and with reciprocity too. I guess, well, I don't know. Yeah.

So I guess, how can people strengthen their relationship to the land?

[Shalitha]

That's a good question. Hmm. Well, it all depends on the individual. I feel like it depends on how connected do they want to feel grounded.

And also, where is your connection to the land? Where do you come from? So for me, as a White Mountain Apache, I identify myself from a certain landscape on our reservation.

And so for some of you guys, I identify myself as a [Apache Tribe Name] and on the reservation. So that's Apache language. And it translates to the two hills that cut.

And on the reservation, that's actually an area called Diamond Creek. And that's where Ciara and I identify ourselves, or know our connection to the land. And when you know the connection to the land, you know where you're from.

It grounds you. So for us, for me, if you wanted to get connected to the land, get to know yourself. Because at the end of the day, I feel like a lot of people don't do that or take the time to.

Even at the moment, this view, you know, like, look at this view, I would have never thought to see it. So at the end of the day, get to know yourself, connect yourself, know where you come from. So you can have that feeling, that sense of groundedness to the connection to the land.

[Ciara]

And I feel like for me, being able to really reconnect is just helping out, you know, doing your part when it comes to recycling. I cannot stress this enough, composting, you know, a lot of that waste and that trash, it's very detrimental to our environment. And as farmers, we know this.

Every year, we see the berries going further and further in their lifespan, getting shorter and shorter. And we can see these changes and even just preserving water, learning about groundwater and where it comes from. And I feel like for one, being self-sufficient.

If you're able to rely on yourself and grow your own food, I can honestly say like growing your own food, eating your own produce, that is the reward. It's such a reward, but it's hard work. And I feel like that's a lot of things people take for granted.

We all eat, but do you know who or where your food came from? You know, like not, and I don't mean the store, you know, like we all know you went to the store, but like how many miles did it take for your food to get there when you could just like, let's go walk right there and go get that, you know? And that is just saying like all of those different organisms that live inside that one little plant that's right there, those are healthier than anything you can buy at the store.

And I feel like even just trying to learn how to revive your soil and even reintroduce nutrients in the soil, anywhere you go, you know, that's, it's always a little help, a little push in the right direction can get you there. Even if you, you need resources, you know, we, the farm has great ones on the website. We can even, I'm pretty sure the park has a bunch of stuff that we can look to.

I see that they're recycling and that's just, it really, it brings joy to my heart because like we said, we would be nothing without the land. You know, we literally wouldn't have no clothes, no shelter, no food to eat if it wasn't for this land. And look at how we're treating it.

Look at what we eat. Why do we need all these preservatives? Why do we need this fake meat?

You know, we have healthy stuff. Food is medicine. And when we think about what we put in our bodies, we should think about the stuff that's growing around us.

That doesn't really hurt society in a way that alfalfa and cotton has because can we eat that? Why are we growing so much of it? You know, it's just thinking of it that way.

[Ranger Dawn]

Yeah. Thank you so much for sharing. I also want to open it up to questions if anyone has any too.

He asked, what are their favorite foods to harvest?

[Shalitha]

Yeah, for me, I feel like one of the ones that always takes me home is always the sumac berries. I remember when I was a little kid, like seven, eight, I would run around in my backyard and just grab it off the bush or the shrub and just eat it like it was candy. So for me, I say sumac berries is one of my favorite ones.

I love it when we make it a drink. But for me, when sharing a drink with a visitor that's not from my area, it's a way of welcoming you into our home or into our land or into our area. So for at that sense, for us, that's kind of what sharing a drink for us looks like, especially back in the day before we had transportation, we walk or ride horses.

For us, our people, our relatives would travel over the mountain or into the canyon just to go visit us. And so when they got to us, we would say, you've you traveled such a long distance over the mountain to come see me. Here's a drink, refresh yourself.

And this is also considered a seasonal drink. So sumac berries is one of the ones that I fairly enjoy. Another one is actually wild onions.

So in our area, we have seven different varieties. And I enjoy the ones that are pretty rare, but they're pretty sweet. They're considered a part of the potato family, but they are they are considered onion.

So so those are probably one of my two favorite, favorite ones to eat.

[Ciara]

I know this is gonna sound funny, but I like nuts. So if you can see, yeah, if you can see this, this tree, this is a pinyon tree or that one. That's a pinyon tree.

And you can pick those pinyons in November. And they're so good. They're addictive.

You can't just get one bag and say you're going to eat a couple. No, you'll eat the whole thing. So and then where we come from, specifically, we have the emery oak tree and it grows golden acorn, which we harvest like right before monsoon season and we grind it up.

Yeah, we we call it Apache gold. And it's got a bitter taste to it. You know, it's an acquired taste.

But oh, my gosh, I can eat that by the handful. You know, it's just and then there's so many where we come from. We even have black walnuts.

We harvested them one year and we all look like demons with black fingers for like two weeks. Yeah, it was.

[Ranger Dawn]

Yeah.

[Ciara]

And so it's also used as a dye. And so there's so many different plants out there and nuts that we can eat that have just been around since time immemorial. You know, and our ancestors just needed a little bit of them to get by.

So we're excited to even just have them and the ability to harvest them. And and we want to there's really, if anything, acknowledge our elders and our ancestors, because if they didn't fight hard to keep these food ways for even just us to be able to listen to them and still learn about them like that's that that was hard, you know, for them. And even just going back to what they came through and and even for them to teach us and for my generation, for me personally, I don't speak my language, but I'm trying to learn.

I'm trying to learn as much as I can through translation. I'm always asking, "what'd they say?" "What they say?" You know, and that's my barrier. My parents thought, oh, don't don't teach her Apache, because if she knows English, she'll be able to get a good education. She'll be able to get farther in life and better work skills.

But here I am like now I'm trying to learn Apache so I could be a tribal chairwoman. You know, but it just it's just things like that, that we that's why we call ourselves women of change. And that's why we like to do what we do today.

[Shalitha]

And so the main reason why we really talk about the things that we're really experts in in our community is because it introduces the whole concept of food sovereignty. And what does that look like in your communities?

And so for those of you guys who do not know what food sovereignty is or or sovereignty, sovereignty is okay. Oh, okay. So, so food sovereignty, basically, basically means to be able to feed yourself and not rely on outside resources to feed yourself.

And so for me, when we talk about this to you guys is to introduce that concept. And what does that look like in your community? How like from so when I did the farmers market coordinating, I had to research and figure out why I was doing certain calls, why I wanted to do certain things.

And one of the main thing was to educate people about food sovereignty, being able to feed themselves, being able to support travel owned businesses, and and leave the money on the reservation so it doesn't go off the reservation. So that's what we really want to introduce when we're talking about a lot of things that we do within our communities is just to let you guys know, like, hey, this is what food sovereignty looks like. And it doesn't matter where you come from, in the world that looks different in wherever you come from.

So definitely think about that concept when we talk about these things is what is food sovereignty? And what does that look like in your community? In 2016, we didn't have a White Mountain Apache co op.

Now we do we have six members. This is our first year in it. We're hoping to go another year but add members as we go and support farmers that are on the reservation who need that help.

And so it's a slow change. It may be something that we might see when we're elders, or see some of our children, children might see that change. But knowing that I was a part of that to create that for them.

is definitely still going to be a win regardless of I'm here or not. But I know that my work carried on.

[Ciara]

So and like we were told before, by the teachers who taught us, we're not trying to teach you this because we want you to stay at our level. We're trying to teach you this so you can run past us and, and show me how to get there, you know, or even just help us work out run with me, you know, let's run together. And let's let's learn.

Let's trailblaze through this, this resilient society called food sovereignty and learn how to do that for ourselves.

[Ranger Jonah]

Grand Canyon speaks is a program hosted by Grand Canyon National Park and the Grand Canyon Conservancy. A special thanks to Aaron White for the theme music. This recording reflects the personal lived experiences of tribal members and do not encompass the views of their tribal nation or that of the National Park.

To learn more about Grand Canyon first voices visit www.nps.gov/GRCA. Here at Grand Canyon National Park, we're on the ancestral homelands of the 11 associated tribes of the Grand Canyon. These being the Havasupai tribe, the Hualapai tribe, the Navajo Nation, the Hopi tribe, the Pueblo of Zuni, the Yavapai Apache Nation, the Kaibab band of Paiute Indians, the Las Vegas Paiute tribe, the Moapa band of Paiutes, the Paiute Indian tribe of Utah, and the San Juan Southern Paiute tribe.

In this episode, Ciara and Shalitha sit down with Ranger Dawn to explore their inspiring journey of connecting indigenous communities to food sovereignty. Together, they share insights into how this work has deepened their understanding of stewardship, culture, and what it means to be "elders in training."

Episode 3

Zuni Royalty Speaks

Transcript

Keia Gasper: It just makes me happy seeing the younger generation get involved with culture and religious activities and wanting to know about who they are and where they come from and it's just very important for our culture.

Lakin: Welcome back everyone, my name is Lakin and I'm an intern at the Grand Canyon National Park.

Ranger Melissa: And this is Ranger Melissa.

Lakin: It's always inspiring to see youth from the Zuni Pueblo, where I'm from, grow into leaders and take action for our community. Ranger Melissa: Yeah, what's cool is this episode is with Zuni royalty who served in 2023 and 2024.

Lakin: So both Keia Gasper and Jaynie Lalio walked us through their experiences and how they become role models for the Zuni people.

Ranger Melissa: Yeah, it's really inspiring to hear from them and hear about, you know, what are their aspirations, how they're connected to the Zuni history and culture, as well as maybe even learning some cool delicious recipes.

Lakin: Yeah, so sit back, relax, and without further ado, here is Keia and Jaynie.

Keia Gasper: Keshi, ko' don sunhapk'yanapkya. Ho' Keia Gasper le'shinna. Hom annodi:we Ana:kwe deyan Yaddokya:kwe a:wan cha'le. Ho' asdemłan ha'ilekk'ya yałdo debikwayik'ya. Hom a:łashinna a:chi Ronda Johnson dap Antonio Gasper le'shinna. Lukkya debikwayinan ho' 2023-2024 Miss Zuni. .

Keia Gasper: Hi, good afternoon, my name is Keia Gasper. My parents' names are Ronda Johnson and Antonio Gasper. I am 18 years old. My clients are Tobacco and Child of the Sun, and this year I am the 2023-2024 Miss Zuni.

Jaynie Lalio: Keshi, ko' don sunhapk'yanapkya. Ho' Jaynie Lalio le'shinna. Ho' asdemłan dobalekk'ya yałdo debikwayik'ya. Hom annodi: Donashi:kwe deyan Dowa:kwe a:wan cha'le. Hom a:łashinna a:chi Erica dap Jason Lalio Jr. Lukkya debikwayinan, ho' don a:wan 2023-2024 Junior Miss Zuni. .

Jaynie Lalio: Hello, good evening, everyone. My name is Jaynie Lalio. I am 16 years old. My clients are Badger and Child of the Corn. My parents are Erica and Jason Lalio Jr. I am the 2023-2024 Junior Miss Zuni.

Ranger Kelli: Thank you, thank you. A lot of times people who come from all over the world here at Grand Canyon, they want to know, like, where's Zuni? So, like, can you explain to our audience, like, where is Zuni? . Keia Gasper: Well, Zuni is a small Pueblo, three miles out, and wait, oh my gosh, three hours out, and we come from the Grand Canyon, and we had to find the middle place, and so we went to our people, our elders, went down to find the middle place, which is Zuni.

Ranger Kelli: Yeah, and it's interesting because, you know, I think, like, we have these 11 tribes coming in from all different locations here at Grand Canyon, and then Grand Canyon is now a national park, and it just kind of created this, like, borderline for tribal communities in a way that people are always, like, amazed, like, how far Zuni is, and then they're like, how does this, how far Zuni is, and then they're like, how does it connect to the Grand Canyon, right, and I think this is important to kind of, like, talk about because, like, what you just said, it's a place of kind of, like, an emergence, right, and then as well, it's just, like, a very sacred connection, but also for Native communities, we kind of, like, it's just not, like, okay, Zuni is here, and then the canyon's here, and then that's it, like, we are connected in a whole, we connect this whole region, and it's just not the canyon and then Zuni, but also the water, you know, and I understand that with Zuni, the Colorado River and the Little Colorado River, that is a connection as well to Zuni, but I just want to let you all know, like, how, where Zuni is at, and if you all, like, have questions, we can definitely ask at the end, but my other question is, like, what is Zuni royalty? What does that mean? Do you all want to answer that?

Jaynie Lalio: So Zuni royalty, it's from an organization where they wanted someone to be able to represent the Zuni people and the community, so it's giving us a chance to represent on a different type of level, you could say.

Ranger Kelli: Do you want to answer that?

Keia Gasper: Yeah, it's, like, you're putting yourself out there, and you're getting to want your people to be known, and where you come from, and it's just very important for our culture, because we want to keep our, what we have, keep it going, and we don't want to lose it, because we see other tribes, like, they're beginning to lose what they have, and we're going strong with what we have, and it just makes me happy seeing the younger generation get involved with culture and religious activities, and just getting involved, wanting to know about who they are and where they come from, and it's just, Zuni is a beautiful, beautiful place. I'm proud to be Zuni, and it makes me happy. .

Ranger Kelli: Yeah, and, you know, what you both just said really speaks to, you know, I think that's important for people to hear, is that you are ambassadors in your community, but not just ambassadors for your community, but also for the next generation, right, and then you are leading a role not only for the younger generation in your community, but also keeping that culture going, and as a young woman, I see that you are dressed in your traditional attire, and is that something that you, when you're wearing the crown and representing your community, is that how you kind of, like, represent yourself when you go out into other communities and wearing that attire, and if you want to explain, like, your dress and the significance of that, you're more than welcome to, if you want to.

Keia Gasper: Oh yeah, our ancestors, they dressed like this back then, and we're just carrying on their tradition and making it known, like, where we come, like, what we have is something different than anybody else. I don't know, I've never seen anybody dressed like this or or have what we have, so it makes me happy knowing that we have a unique culture and with everything we have.

Ranger Kelli: I think I find it, like, really amazing today, so our royalty, for y'all who weren't here at the park earlier today, they're actually, we have four royalties here until Saturday, and they're doing demonstration from nine to four at the Watchtower, and so our two members here are, have been here all day at the tower talking about the role, but also talking about the generational knowledge of their community, and a lot of people have been, like, asking the young girls, like, are you selling your jewelry? Are you selling these different attires? But really, they're just wanting to dress how, like you said, your ancestors have been dressing, and I think that's beautiful to know that we're walking in our ancestors' shoes, basically, and we're, they're behind us, you know, and they're behind you right now, and you're wearing that crown, and just kind of representing that and carrying that knowledge, so I think that's really beautiful to express that to the public, and because, like, you're a royalty now, I want to know, like, how did you become, like, Miss Zuni or Junior Miss Zuni? So what are, what are some of the things that you had to do for competition to become royalty?

Jaynie Lalio: So we had a pageant-based, like, competition. We were judged off of a traditional talent, traditional food, public speaking, close interviews, and then there was also a best essay and most photogenic awards. .

Ranger Kelli: Was that all done in one day? .

Jaynie Lalio: Two days, yeah.

Keia Gasper: Yeah, like a week. We were all put together, and all the contestants and everybody, we just got to know each other, and we did the pageant and everything, but this year we ran against ourselves, so we had no contestants for our age, so we got the title, but we still had to go through the whole pageant and everything, and with going back to the getting your crown and the sash, it's, you get, you get, they make a crown for you, especially, because every crown gets made for every year, so there's always different crowns that come in and sashes and everything like that, so what you get during your reign or in the beginning of the reign, your crown and your sash is yours to keep, like, for life, so going, so if you, like, look back or go forward in the future, you can look back and see what you've done.

Ranger Kelli: That's really cool to keep the crown.

Jaynie Lalio: And can I add that the crown is also basically alive. It's your sister. We call it our sister because it chooses you. Yeah, it just, .

Keia Gasper: whatever, like, whatever you're feeling, your crown can feel it, and, like, if you're tired and she's tired, she'll make you more tired. It's, it's crazy. It's just, yeah, like, you can't, like, feel her. You can't know when she's talking to you and stuff, and you just gotta, when you put her on, you just gotta tell her, like, come on, let's go. We got this, and she'll motivate you into doing better for yourself for that day and just keeping it going, you know.

Ranger Kelli: I think that's amazing. Also, what inspired you both to compete? You know, I know, like, right now, you said that you, you already were competing for the crown and without any other competition, but what inspired you from the beginning before wearing the crown, any crown? What made you want to compete to become a royalty?

Jaynie Lalio: For me, what inspired me was I had the role of Zuni Princess before, and I thought that if, that was when I was young. I didn't know what to expect, so going into this year, I was influenced by the people around me saying, you should run another year. You can learn more, so that's what I decided to do, and I never thought that I would have ran by myself, so it was kind of unexpected, but it's been a pretty great experience. I'm glad for those people that inspired me, just, like, friends, family, so yeah.

Keia Gasper: Sorry, can we go back to the question?

Ranger Kelli: Yeah, and I just asked, like, you know, before you became royalty, what inspired you to want to compete and wanting to become a royalty or a title holder?

Keia Gasper: Okay, well, first of all, I, this is, this is not me, like, I, how would I put this into words? I didn't see myself in this position because I didn't think I was strong enough or I was good enough to be a good influencer for my people, and I just thought, I was like, people kept coming to me, and I kept hiding, and they kept coming to my house asking me if I'm running or if I'm gonna run for the position, and I was like, uh, I don't know, and then they pushed me into running for it, and I, I finally said, okay, I'm gonna do it, and I was, I was so nervous because I thought I was gonna have other people, um, like, running for the position, and I was like, I'm not gonna get it, I'm not gonna get it, and then here, once the deadline for the applications were over, and then here, uh, we looked on the royalty page, I looked on the royalty page, and then, actually, we were at volleyball practice, and then we looked at the volleyball page, and it was just only both of our names on it, and they were like, oh, my gosh, what did, what did we get ourselves into, but overall, it's been a great experience. It's, um, it makes me happy going places, seeing, seeing new people, and make good connections, and meeting new Crown sisters, or sash sisters, like, from other places, uh, like, Miss NTU, I'm really close with her, and Miss Indian New Mexico, I'm really close with those two, so I grew attached to them, and they're, like, my big sisters, they watch over me, and yeah, and just, and going back, going back, like, um, in 2009, I was also Crown baby princess, and I was a little baby, little baby, so I didn't know, and then here, look, look at me, I'm Miss Zuni, that's crazy.

Jaynie Lalio: Also, hold on, sorry, excuse me, no, go, funny part, we ran against each other, what's the title, princess?

Keia Gasper: Oh, yeah, then I lost that round, too, sorry, I bet,

Ranger Kelli: but you're both crazy, and then you said, too, like, you enjoy, um, traveling all over the place, you know, meeting new people, is this your first time coming to Grand Canyon?

Keia Gasper: Uh, yes, this is my first time coming to Grand Canyon. When I was leaving Zuni, like, it just, I was so nervous coming here, because knowing that our ancestors are here, and they're watching over us, and just makes me happy knowing that finally get to, like, feel their presence, knowing that they made it safe, safely there, and, oh, wait, sorry, overall, overall, this is a beautiful place, like, I'm so glad, like, our Zuni people came, like, out of this Grand Canyon, like, this is, that thing back there looks like a picture, like, it looks so unreal, but it makes me happy knowing that we have something like this within our history.

Jaynie Lalio: Yeah, this is also my first time coming here, I would say, it's been a wonderful day, just being able to go up to the watchtower, seeing the top, we were standing there, taking a picture, and I just looked and said, this doesn't look real, it looks like a green screen, it's, the beauty here, it's, it's something else, nothing can compare to it, honestly, being able to reconnect with nature on a different, different type of level feels like, like, getting, getting that clarity, to me, that's what it felt like, like, it just, whatever you see, the stresses, it's all gone.

Ranger Kelli: Yeah, and this is amazing to hear, also, like, heartfelt, as well, what you both said, because part of this program, and this Grand Canyon Speaks, a lot of our tribal members haven't come and visit Grand Canyon, even though it's an ancestral home from our 11 associated tribes, and I, being as a native ranger here, and hearing you both speak here, or even seeing your family here, and seeing the younger ones just enjoying the canyon, and this is their first time, as well, and I think that's important, that your voice is being heard here, you know, it's, your canyon hears you, and it feels you, your presence is here, is really amazing, and the whole program of this is to have your voices heard back in the space again, and when it became a national park, a lot of the native communities were forcibly removed out of this place that is home, and I think that's a very important thing to talk about.

Ranger Kelli: I know it's hard to hear, even being, as a native person, but it's now time for healing. It's also time to show your representation out here, and seeing your beautiful regalia, hearing the beautiful songs out here, it's really inspiring. Also, for the next community member who is a young adult, is gonna be inspired to want to sing here too, and to dance here as well, and set their foot here, and they want to come back again next year.

Ranger Kelli: I hope you all come back again next year, and then now your royalty, like, what are your future goals now? Like, you know, do you want to do another pageant, or, you know, school? I know you're all young, but goals are important.

Jaynie Lalio: So some of the goals I will have is to go to college. I'm currently choosing between having options open for schools here in Arizona, because Arizona is just so pretty, and I want to be close to home, so, and after that, I'm planning to go somewhere in the medical field. Still looking at my options, but today, some people were saying my goal should be to run for Miss Zuni again, but we'll see what's in store. We'll see, but I think this role is going to help my goals, because it's made me more open, I would say. It's, I'm able to communicate on an easier level than I used to.

Jaynie Lalio: It brought me out of my shell, so whatever I'm planning to go into, I know it'll help with, help with what I'm planning. .

Keia Gasper: And with me, my future goals, I have so much. So once my last month of high school came, I was like, what am I gonna do? And so I applied to colleges. I was like, I'm gonna go to college. I'm gonna go become a nurse, and then here, I, since I can't leave like Zuni, and I need to finish out my reign, I was like, nah, I want to join the army. I want to join the army, so that's what I'm gonna do.

Keia Gasper: I'm joining the army, and I'm gonna try and become a dog handler, so I work with the canines, so that's what I want to do, because I have a passion for dogs. And recently, my family, they didn't even tell me, I had a dog for like three years, and they called the rangers on my dog, and they took him, they took her, but yeah, her name was Koda, Koda Mae, and she was a cute little rez dog, yeah. But yeah, after the army, I'm gonna try, if I like it there, then I'm gonna do what I can to get my dream house and my dream car, like a western type of house, and I know this sounds so crazy, but I want to Porsche GTRS, so that's my big plan. Gotta save up a lot of money. .

Ranger Kelli: Love it. I love all of it. I love both of your goals. I think when, I'm just speaking from my personal young adult days, like I didn't really have a plan, so I think that it's just inspiring to hear you both, as young as you are, to know what you want, to know what your goals are in the future, and I think that, I think it's important for the kids to hear that, you know, to see a royalty, to speak about their goals, so they can kind of look at, okay, this is what they're doing, maybe I might do that too. I think it's really cool, and I have one more question, you know, I think that if you want to, well actually I have two more questions, but will you all, wanting to do an example of like, I know going back to the competition, when you all do competitions, like do you want to do an example of like an example of a competition, like through a talent that you are, you know, to our audience here, either through traditional talent or through a modern talent, is that all right with both of you to do something like that? .

Keia & Jaynie: Yes.

Ranger Kelli: Okay, so I'm not too sure who wants to go first. .

Keia Gasper: So during my talent, I, for traditional, I did pottery, and I still continue to do pottery. I love doing it because it just takes me away out of reality, and makes me live in a different world, like it's just crazy, like your mind is full set on something you want to create, and I make, I know I make like cool, fancy, or not fancy, but like good enough artwork to present to other people, and it's just, I've been working on pottery for about four years now, and it's just been carrying out since high school, and my uncle, Kevin Johnson, inspired me into wanting to try and see what I can do, what my mind can do with art and pottery, so, and this, I finished this seed bowl this morning, and it's just a representation of like asking for blessings for rain, and food, and water, and just for your plants to grow, and it's just, you're not also like asking for blessings for just that, it's just asking for blessings for the whole community, everybody, and just wanting to make it rain, like we need the rain, it's hot out here, like, but yeah, that's what I did, and I'll pass around an example, and yeah.

Jaynie Lalio: Okay, and for me, I'm gonna stand up for this. This was one of my, what I was presenting today as well, in the top right corner, I, right here, I made a pozole stew called chuleya:we. I was taught by my grandmother, my Wowo, so I thought, being at the recent pageants, I saw that no one really made this type of stew, so I thought, let me give it a try, maybe I can, so it's like a, like a week-long, took me a week-long process, kinda, so first, we had to, like, chop up, or cut the meat, saw it, so I could be able to cut it into pieces, and here, I'm cutting, cutting, putting water into it with corn, so it's able to get that flavor, which we also added salt, I'll get back to that, but here, we, this is the oven that we, I made the fire out of, with wood, in our outside oven, it's called, Hebok'o:we, and then, we close it off with mud, seal it overnight, and then, it should be ready in the morning, which I opened right the morning of our pageant, I was getting ready, walked outside, had my dad open it for me, and just that smell of it was so, so, I don't know, made me hungry, and I didn't eat it yet, so that's the first thing I wanted, but I couldn't, had to serve it to my judges, and it's kinda what I made, and it's also an important stew, which is, which we usually eat on every traditional occasion, and it's also just like, oh, I'm craving some chuleya:we, let's make some, that's basically the type of food it is.

Oh my gosh, I'm getting so hungry now. I love talking about food, by the way. I'll bring you a bowl next time.

Ranger Kelli: Oh my gosh, I love food, and I think that's really cool, because like, it's different talents, you know, you're doing pottery making, and then you're doing food, traditional foods, you know, that is eaten in your, in the home, and how that connects back into your ancestors as well, and then if we, right now, we're at 7:22, which is just very close to sunset, and for the audience, we can kind of look at this board a little bit closer after we're done, but this is my last question for the evening, is what do you want all of us to take away with what we just kind of talked about this evening? What is something you want our audience members to take away back to their home, or coming out to visit Grand Canyon from what we just talked about?

Keia Gasper: Well, like, we're all human beings, and we should, we should all love each other, love everybody, and because nobody has, like, a perfect life, so I just want everyone to go home happy, feeling happy, and knowing that ancestors are proud of who they are, and that you're strong, and just keep going, don't stop, do you, and live your life, live your life to the fullest, like, you got this, and yeah. .

Jaynie Lalio: I just want people to be able to embrace where they come from. Every, every story matters. It's important to love who you are, and just be confident with what, with who you are, because there's no one like you. You're unique, special, every person is different, just, just love yourself is basically what I want people to do from this experience, embrace.

Keia Gasper: One more thing is to make a challenge for yourself, try something new, go out, try something new, find what you see that you may not see yourself doing, like, like me right now, this is crazy, I'm so happy though, but yeah, just try it, because it'll take you bigger and happier places, just like this.

Ranger Kelli: I just want to send my gratitude to both of you, to explaining, and expressing, and then showing a lot of what your title holder means, but also, like, you, what you both expressed to me is just really amazing to know that you're very proud of your culture, you want to keep that going, and keep it going for the next generation. Thank you all for coming this evening, and enjoy sunset.

Ranger Jonah: Grand Canyon Speaks is a program hosted by Grand Canyon National Park and the Grand Canyon Conservancy. A special thanks to Aaron White for the theme music. This recording reflects the personal, lived experiences of tribal members and do not encompass the views of their tribal nation. or that of the National Park.

Ranger Jonah: To learn more about Grand Canyon First Voices, visit www.nps.gov/grca . Here at Grand Canyon National Park, we are on the ancestral homelands of the 11 associated tribes of the Grand Canyon. These being the Havasupai tribe, the Hualapai tribe, the Navajo Nation, the Hopi tribe, the Pueblo of Zuni, the Yavapai Apache Nation, the Kaibab Band of Paiute Indians, the Las Vegas Paiute tribe, the Moapa Band of Paiutes, the Paiute Indian tribe of Utah, and the San Juan Southern Paiute tribe.

In this episode, 2023-2024 Zuni Royalty, Keia Gasper and Jaynie Lalio, walk us through their experience as representatives of the Zuni community and how it has shaped their character. They also shared some of their aspirations, traditional practices and beliefs that empower their connections with Zuni culture and the Grand Canyon.

Episode 4

Skylar Blackbull Speaks - Veteran's Day Special

Transcript

Skylar Blackbull: So it's really neat to see kind of the breakdown of this code because I think when a lot of times we hear about this history you don't actually get to see what the code looked like and I wanted to use this project to kind of give a chance for people to not only know more about the history but also see the code and see what how it worked and how it operated.

Meranden: Welcome or welcome back to Grand Canyon Speaks. This is Meranden

Lakin: And this is Lakin and we're both interns at Desert View.

Meranden: In this episode we talked with Skylar Blackbull who is a Diné artist. We invited her out for an in-person conversation but as we head into winter here the snow decided to come and she wasn't able to make it.

Lakin: But we didn't let that stop us though, so thankfully we were able to meet with her virtually.

Meranden: And as this is our Veterans Day special episode she was able to talk with us about her amazing piece called Unbreakable Code that highlights the Navajo Code Talkers.

Lakin: Yeah it was really interesting to learn more about the different components of this artwork along with getting to know more about her creative journey.

Meranden: Also it was really cool hearing about an opportunity she had to collaborate with someone she looks up to.

Lakin: So we hope you enjoy this episode and here is Skylar Blackbull.

Skylar: My name is Skylar Blackbull. I am from the Hosta Butte area in New Mexico currently in Colorado but no I've been you know doing art outside of college for about about two a year and a half almost two years and I've been on my artist journey since goodness since I can remember and I'm just thrilled to be able to be part of this podcast be able to share you know my journey as an artist and the way that I use the way my experiences growing up to influence my work.

Lakin: Have you been to the Grand Canyon?

Skylar: I have a very long time ago. I was just a young girl. My parents had taken my sister and I twice and we both did not actually walk down the canyon. We were strapped onto a backpack and our dad walked us down the canyon. But the two times that I have gone it I have very fond memories of being out there and just how beautiful the scenery is.

Meranden: Nice yeah I think that's something I noticed with these speaks is that usually when we bring them out or it's a cultural demonstration it's usually their first time coming or it's something they haven't been here in a long time. We can go ahead and go to the second question. When did you first start your artistic journey?

Skylar: Sure to be honest I always had a love for art and creativity growing up. My dad being a very gifted illustrator himself and just being around that and him you know doodling for my sister and I on napkins and things of that sort.

I've always had such a connection with creativity including drawing on our walls at home which was probably not the best thing ever. But no like art was such a big stress reliever for me growing up. I loved being part of art classes all through elementary school, middle school, you know high school.

I really didn't you know find my passion or my niche until about when I went to college in my undergrad. I initially started off with a degree in science. I was planning on going in biology and then eventually I switched to kinesiology and then I was like ooh nutrition sounds great.

And then I throughout those first two years of college I had been taking a lot of art classes as a way to just kind of have a breather from all of the other college classes and ended up having so much fun with these classes and enjoying them so much that my professors even convinced me to you know switch my major over to the art department. And the end of my sophomore year beginning of junior year I completely switched gears and went full towards a degree in graphic design and studio art and never looked back.

Meranden: It's really interesting seeing how much the classes and like those experiences and like professors play a big role in what we want to do. So yeah that's really cool.

Lakin: Yeah it's also good to hear that you follow your intuition and that you weren't afraid in that action. So it's always good to hear when people do that whether it's creatively or just when it comes to following a path that's oriented towards a set of value goals.

Skylar: Yeah absolutely and I agree a lot of times when you go into college you kind of go in with these big expectations of I need to go with a science degree or like a very you know a big degree. And you know just have like you said the professors really are big influences in your time at those universities and just hearing their own experiences and their own encouragement of just saying hey you know any possible career or life that you want is very possible. It's just figuring out what works for you and what drives you.

Because the last thing you want to do is go into a field for you know a career and not feel fulfilled in it and feel that you didn't take the road that you should have taken. And not that saying that you can't restart at any age but it's always it's a blessing to know that I was able to figure it out within my undergraduate degree.

Lakin: Since you started creating what medium or media have you explored with?

Skylar: I started off with just your basic pen, paper, pencils, charcoals. At the beginning of my art journey I used to be really against color. I hated anything with color partly because I didn't quite understand it either. It was really intimidating but in having different art teachers and professors they were able to kind of you know break those walls of just the intimidation of certain mediums.

And I took a lot of classes in college to kind of learn you know different styles of art. So I had to I now have kind of expanded my artistry with not only traditional illustration but I'm also an oil painter, acrylic painter. I took a print making class in college and now I started implementing that in my own work.

So I do linoleum prints. I also taught myself how to bead about two years about three years ago I'd say. Yeah those have been my my main sources of work as well as of course my digital work as well.

Meranden: When we first met you I really liked your bags and I was like really excited for you to come out here because I was like I'm gonna buy it finally. But yeah like I like your bags and then the stickers it's just like it brings like a really homey vibe of like being back home on the rez. The spam can, the cheii, like all those things.

I really like those kind of little reminders that make you feel like back at home. So those are my favorite that I really enjoyed seeing. And then I have seen like your beadwork and things like that on like socials.

So it's really cool to see how you've diversified yourself over time.

Lakin: And I also feel like when you do approach those I guess a new skill set, you go into it knowing that you'll have some mistakes and failures in that initial learning process. But once you get over that learning curve it becomes I would say like therapeutic in a way.

Skylar: Absolutely, absolutely. I always you know in taking all of those classes or you know the self-teaching component, I feel like those challenges are what pushes me like no I'm gonna figure this out. I want to figure this out.

This is something I've always wanted you know. And it also is really neat because the more that I have expanded the mediums that I work with, the more that I'm realizing a lot of them kind of bleed into each other. That you don't have to just use certain skills from one type of artistry.

You can use it for multiple. Like I have recently just started blending my beadwork and paintings. Like I feel like there's a way that you can merge different styles of artwork together to kind of create your own unique style but also improve upon many different you know parts of your your art.

Lakin: And I feel like that's a special characteristic of being an innovator or a visionary. So yeah.

Meranden: Yesterday was Veterans Day.

This is our Veterans Day special episode. We are very interested in highlighting your art as it revolves around the Navajo Code Talkers. Would you be able to explain a little bit of who they are and what your artwork entails?

Skylar: Yeah absolutely. So you know my initial interest in this project that I created really did stem from not only by having family who had served in the military. My husband is currently on active duty in the army now. But also just you know I feel like this is such an important part of history that's not as highlighted in your history courses within the education system.

And I didn't realize that until I left the rez. Until I was in college on the east coast. And I have always get questions like "Oh where are you from? What are you?" And I'm like I'm Navajo.

I'm from the Navajo Nation in New Mexico. And they're like "What is that?" And I'm like what do you mean what is that? And just those countless interactions of people just not even knowing who the Navajo people are was really that it was such a big eye-opener for me to know that like wow people don't have the privilege of learning that history. And being one of the few indigenous students on that campus and since I had switched my major to you know art I thought this would be a great opportunity to kind of utilize the skills into creating some sort of visual memorial but also a way for others to be a little more aware of the importance of this history.

So the project that I made was called the Unbreakable Code. And it brings recognition to the bravery and sacrifice of the Navajo Code Talkers during World War II. And the great thing is that the Code Talkers really did restore you know pride in our sacred language.

And this entire project honors 420 plus Code Talkers that I've served but highlights the 29 men who created the initial code. As with the history of that it's important to know that you know in the making of this code Navajo wasn't a written language. So it's really neat to see kind of the breakdown of this code because I think when a lot of times we hear about this history you don't actually get to see what the code looked like.

And I wanted to use this project to kind of give a chance for people to not only know more about the history but also see the code and see what how it worked and how it operated. So with one of the pieces here I can show you now. So this is Nelson S Thompson.

This is his name that covers the entirety of this panel. So what I had done was I used the original code dictionary from World War II and took the alphabet component and used the alphabet to spell out their name in code which was a really neat way because not only did using the alphabet I also got to learn more about the code itself which was really great. So this 29 panel installation it covers many different images as you can see in like different pieces here different images as well as different coding to honor different aspects of the Navajo people.

So for instance you have this one has arrowheads this one has the feathers and then there are two more that highlights corn as in representing corn pollen and then this one representing the tobacco leaf and that all together kind of hints at the ceremony that they do for soldiers before and after they go to war the enemy way ceremony and about how it protects them from harmful spirits before and after the war. It's a very subtle way of hinting that but it's a nice you know way to kind of see that they still maintain their their practices throughout this whole time. But yes in all of my colors as well also have meaning they all reflect back to the Navajo medicine wheel and of course the four sacred mountains.

So those are the colors in the incorporation of red symbolizes bloodshed during war. So there's a lot of hidden components in this project that I created but I also wanted to use those hidden components to represent their the Code Talkers inability to speak about what they have done during World War II till after 1969. But now with this project it was such an honor to present a visual memorial for the 400 plus men who have sacrificed so much and our people continue to sacrifice so much and creating this project it was a way for people just to see this type of history in a different way but also learn more about it as well.

Lakin: Yeah that's good too, I mean it's very interesting obviously not only good but it's very interesting when you see art and hear about artists who connect all these aspects of culture and just understanding the physical and the metaphysical world and like you connected the aspect of color and then also the landscape and just the history itself. That's regarding the Navajo Code Talkers and being able to express that in this one artwork. It's like a huge story in one intangible expression. So when it comes to understanding the landscape and how it informs your identity we'd like to know what does the Grand Canyon mean to you?

Skylar: Sure so you know in learning about our traditional stories with the Grand Canyon for instance you know the story of one of the last battles the twins have with your monster slayer has is at the Grand Canyon with the wandering rock monster and it's really interesting because when you think about that traditional story about how monster slayer is you know going to go fight this wandering rock monster because he's hoarding water and it's kind of reminiscent of the current battle today with the Navajo people in the Colorado River. But now I mean in terms of like that importance of the Grand Canyon is understanding the importance of that Colorado River for the Navajo people and another thing too is I wanted to mention as well is that growing up on the northeastern agency of the Navajo Nation you don't quite hear or understand the importance of that Colorado River for the Navajo people because it's not something that's talked about a lot on the rez just because it's mainly with the people on the western agency you know that have that who need that water and I think it's really important that it is a conversation amongst the entire nation because you know we didn't really hear about it too much especially with you know growing up where I was and I'm really thankful and happy now that I have now become more aware of the importance of that Colorado River and the water for our people but no I mean in terms of it's really interesting just to kind of think about oral traditional stories kind of you know foreshadowing or something just kind of recircling back around how it still circles around this water issue and it's really interesting.

Meranden: And I just want to backtrack on your artwork on the whole Navajo Code Talkers it's like makes me speechless to see it not a lot of people know about that or like you said there's people who don't know that we exist or they don't know about the Code Talkers we have this knowledge and being able to learn these different things so that we can spread that to other people so that they know that we're here we're still doing things and our tribes are still here so your pieces have a lot of impact on me just seeing like seeing that being able to hear the stories on it it's really cool.

Skylar: Wonderful I honestly that's the whole point of the work that I started making especially within these past few years that I want the work that I create to not only be visually fun to look at but also it it is conveying an important message and with the countless countless years that you know we've been wanting to have we want our voice to matter we want our voice to be heard and sometimes art can do art can be one of those voices that can shine through and just show a different way of looking at someone's way of life and someone's you know history and I think it's really important because we learn so much from one another within just artwork itself I mean the countless of art history classes I took the amount you just learn from paintings is insane and when you and when you are able to like incorporate that into your own work you kind of see like oh my goodness like I have this whole other way to use my to my work to speak to different audiences and that's I think with a lot of artists out there we all try and you know find that right audience to kind of convey a message that we were so passionate about

Meranden: Yeah exactly and speaking of like that impact it plays a huge influence on our work and what things we do and that kind of takes me to the next question of did you have a mentor who helped you along the way or you know someone who plays a huge role in your art making?

Skylar: Absolutely! Oh my goodness, my influences and mentors have have really allowed me to have so much on this journey. My mentors go all the way back to high school like one of my biggest ones who was Elmer Yazzie he was my art teacher and also my track coach in high school and he really instilled my love for art I absolutely loved his approach to our education it was very different compared to the it was very different because he really allowed his students to kind of lose themselves in their work he hardly ever put deadlines because he really wanted to give us a chance to kind of focus on a piece and understand what we're doing and connect with the work Yazzie taught with a lot of spirituality as well he always talked about like his emotions when he would work and it wasn't about the technical aspect of art and it was so interesting to kind of be part of that Yazzie was someone who with every student he pushed our artistic boundaries and encouraged so much innovation with our projects and not only he had some of the best stories to share in that class because he's been an artist for a very long time and he's traveled all over the world painting murals presenting his work and just hearing his stories was so encouraging to know that he's had a very fulfilling and successful life as an artist he was a a big big person for me especially in high school you know getting me to to understand the importance of art and um still love him today I always call him my adopted grandfather he's the best ever and another really big mentor for me is Lyndon Tsosie, the silversmith from Gallup, New Mexico he was a really big mentor for me and upon you know just entering in with this art industry when I was fresh out of college it was a whole new whole new life and a whole new path that I was very unfamiliar with and upon meeting Lyndon at a gallery opening which I was showing my Unbreakable Code project it sparked a conversation between us and I had explained my project to him and from there he wanted to collaborate with me on a piece and the piece that we collaborated on was also to honor the Navajo Code Talker it's a belt called "No Place Like Home" and it honors the 400+ Navajo Code Talkers so Lyndon had done all the silversmith on the concho silversmithing of the concho belt and I had created the paintings on the inside of the belt and it was really neat because not only did I get to see a different type of art because I don't know anything about silversmithing I don't know much, but he was just so transparent with his advice when it came to navigating the industry as an artist and he's he's so helpful and the fact that he has an entire foundation about empowering you know the future generations of artists and ensuring that these traditional skills of silversmithing or any type of artistry are passed to that those younger artists I think is incredible the fact that he puts all of that his efforts and you know his accomplishments as an artist back to the young folk and it's incredible and lastly you know I had two college professors that were just incredible and extremely patient I had Steven Pearson and Chloe Irla. Steven Pearson was part of the studio art department and Chloe Irla was part of the graphic design department and both of them were really big in terms of guiding me in understanding the different types of things you can do within our world Pearson was really great at helping me understand the technical ability with art and understanding like perspective and how to properly use your materials and how to take something from a three-dimensional world into a two-dimensional space so it was really nice to understand that technical aspect of art that I didn't really I didn't know um and then with Irla she opened my eyes to a whole new world of art since she was in the graphic design department I knew very little about graphic design upon taking her classes and she really you know just helped me expand my work so much further that's part of that is a huge reason as to why this Unbreakable Code you know was so successful was because she really did help guide me through understanding how to use all of these digital platforms to make this project successful but no each of each of those people have really have made such a big impact in my journey as an artist I have so much I have so much to thank for them because not only were they super patient super transparent with their advice it's just they made a huge impact on making me feel confident going into this career

Lakin: Yeah it's amazing to see how these figures and people have such a huge impact on not only your creative life but your just your life in general and I'm also looking forward to who you're able to I guess I would say be a mentor for in the future like whether you have students or just people who look up to you as a source of inspiration and I'm also glad that you brought up Lyndon because I did want to ask you about the belt I remember I had seen it recently and I was interested in wondering how that was created.

Skylar: Yeah, absolutely so it was actually the the Unbreakable Code project was one of the first ways that we kind of sparked up this conversation of the belt Lyndon had been wanting to do a Code Talker piece for I think about 10 years you know like he had this was something that he's been really wanting to do and when we met he he really loved the direction that I took my project and he was like we need to collaborate let's figure out a way where we can mesh these two these two ideas together he told me about you know the story of what he wanted to do with the silversmithing and the great the really cool thing was that on the actual concho belt each concho kind of had a series of different stamps and the stamps were telling like a whole story of you know the Code Talkers and World War II and like on the left side you see that the stamps are you have like the hogan on the bottom and you see all these arrowheads like kind of circling around the perimeter of the belt kind of shows how the spirit is protecting the soldiers and on the other side you have like the war side where you see like the fighter planes and everything and it's just a really neat way to convey a story through the stamp work and the one thing that I loved you know working with Lyndon was that he wanted to put so much meaning behind this belt and I loved how you know he was telling me how this belt is not meant to be worn type thing so the belt ended up being extremely heavy at the end of it with the amount of silver on it and the whole reason why he made it so heavy was another way to kind of convey that message of these men had to go home and not speak a single word about what they had done not even to their own siblings and it was the heaviness of you know of not being able to share any of that I can't imagine on anyone so he made the belt you know that heavy to kind of convey that message of like this is what they came home with and it was such a unique piece to be part of not only hearing like his story from the silversmithing but also incorporating you know the work that that I put into it as well I created these super tiny like two inch by one inch paintings that went on the back side of the belts and they also had hand-painted images and as well as the text but the text was English and Navajo so the Navajo text was highlighting the the message that was sent during the battle of Iwo Jima the send demolition team to Hill 362B so I had that written out in Navajo so that was part of the paintings that I created and the other part we're listing out the 29 men who created the initial code. So it was really neat to kind of have like two different types of art combined into one piece you very rarely see painting and silversmithing in one so it was so much fun I really enjoyed it and just hearing Lyndon's passion and my passion behind this just really blend itself for us to create such a unique and moving piece.

Lakin: I don't even know what to say, I'm just no but, I was really interested in how that piece was created.

Skylar: Yeah it was such an honor and it was funny because I had didn't realize but I had gone to school with a couple of his and his boys so that was also a funny thing I'm like yeah I went to school like two new kids but no, we've become really good friends, you know meeting at the gallery opening collaborating at a piece and we have very we realized we had a lot of similar mindsets in creating work that is different from what people see especially at different shows like Lyndon was really helpful with you know how to approach these shows such as the Autry, Heard Museum and the Indian Market and you know being part of those experiences you get to see the level of art it's just insane but to also go into that knowing that you can push artistic boundaries every single time and it's incredible to see what people take and make being but being part of this collaboration with Lyndon was super eye-opening but also just such an honor to be working with an artist such as himself

Lakin: Yeah and I'm really looking forward to seeing where your creative journey goes at this point and I'm sure many other people do as well. So since we're getting to the end of this we like to just recognize this month as being Native American Heritage Month and we would like to know what does Native American Heritage Month mean to you?

Skylar: Absolutely, I mean it's an exciting month, it's a national recognition for you know, our all Indigenous communities, people, and everything of that sorts. It's a time to provide recognition to celebrate, to bring acknowledgement to the challenges of many nations across the country I always say and I live by that the motto "Every day is a good day to be Indigenous". Yes, this month is extremely important and it's you know it's wonderful to know that we have this month to celebrate but I think every day should be a celebration of our past, our present, and our future and that every day should be an opportunity for us to step closer to having our voices heard and knowing that people that yes we we are here, we are resilient people, and we are continuing to fight for everything that we believe in and you know that month allows us that extra push that every day should be like that. So the motto is, "Every day is a good day to be Indigenous"! Meranden: Yes I like that, but we did just want to end with one more question. Is there anything that you would like to leave the audience with? Skylar: Oh good question, I mean to anyone out there that you know is any type of creativity out there I feel is important to share especially if it shares who you are as a person with your way of life regardless I think it's it's wonderful to see people's personal journey reflected in their work regardless of what that work is even including in the sciences just seeing your personal journey reflected in your work I think is so important to see and you know I think with you know this month, it it's a reminder that every day should be a day that we speak a little louder and have our challenges be acknowledged and celebrate who we are as a people because every day is a good day to be Indigenous! So yeah.

Meranden: Awesome!

Lakin: Yeah, that was it was great talking with you and learning more about who you are as a person not only as an artist and giving you a chance to elaborate on your artwork especially about the Navajo Code Talkers since we are celebrating Veterans Day and honoring the veterans you know we appreciate it very much

Skylar: Of course, and thank you so much it was such an honor to be part of this and if anyone who would like to see any more of my work you're welcome to visit my portfolio site all of my work is out there, the belt is on there, the Unbreakable Code is there, so please feel free to to visit, but no thank you so much it was such an honor to talk to y'all and appreciate everything.

Ranger Jonah: Grand Canyon Speaks is a program hosted by Grand Canyon National Park and the Grand Canyon Conservancy. A special thanks to Aaron White for the theme music. This recording reflects the personal lived experiences of tribal members and do not encompass the views of their tribal nation or that of the National Park.

To learn more about Grand Canyon First Voices visit www.nps.gov/grca. Here at Grand Canyon National Park we are on the ancestral homelands of the 11 associated tribes of the Grand Canyon these being the Havasupai tribe, the Hualapai tribe, the Navajo Nation, the Hopi tribe, the Pueblo Zuni, the Yavapai Apache Nation, the Kaibab Band of Paiute Indians, the Las Vegas Paiute Tribe, the Moapa Band of Paiutes, the Paiute Indian Tribe of Utah, and the San Juan Southern Paiute Tribe.

In this episode, interns Meranden Numkena and Lakin Epaloose speak virtually with Diné artist Skylar Blackbull for the Veteran’s Day Special as she explains her artwork on the Navajo Code Talkers, collaborating with one of her role models, and the importance of the Grand Canyon to her tribe.

Episode 5

Kiana Omi Toadlena Speaks

Transcript

Kiana GC Speaks

Kiana Omi Toadlena: Yeah, so Native American Heritage Month for me means being Diné and being resilient. Always finding a way for yourself and paving the path no matter where you come from and how far you've come. Being Native American should be recognized every day because we're always on Native land.

Lakin: Welcome back to Grand Canyon Speaks. This is Lakin.

Meranden: And this is Meranden.

Lakin: In celebration of Native American Heritage Month, we sat down with Kiana Omi Toadlena, who was a contestant for Miss Navajo this past year.

Meranden: Yeah, she was able to explain what the pageant consists of, her purpose for running, and a fun experience of silversmithing with other contestants.

Lakin: And she also explained how family is a root source of her inspiration, especially the strong women in her life.

Meranden: We were very honored to have her speak during our festival in November. So we hope you enjoy this episode. Kiana Omi Toadlena: Yá'át'ééh shik’éí dóó shidine’é. Shí eí Kiana Omi Toadlena yinishyé.

Kiana: Naakaii Dine’é nishlo' Táchii’nii bashishchiin,Tó Dích’íi’nii dashicheii, aadóó Kinyaa’áanii dashinalí. (Continues to introduce self in Navajo). Hello everyone. Thank you all for coming.

Kiana: My name is Kiana Omi Toadlena. I introduce myself in my native language. I am of the Mexican people clan and born for Red Streak Through the Water people clan.

Kiana: I am from Sawmill, Arizona. It's a small community near Window Rock, Arizona. I like to identify as a Diné woman through my clans and originally from the Navajo Nation.

Kiana: Thank you all for having me. I'm really excited. I studied at Northern Arizona University with a major in health science.

Kiana: My line of profession is consisting of medical science. That's a little bit about me. Thank you.

Meranden: Awesome. We're really excited to have her here. One thing I really wanted to have is really empowering our indigenous women. I'm really a big advocate for having those indigenous women empower and be seen through these kind of programs and things like that. I'm really glad you're here. I'm going to start.

Meranden: Is this your first time to the Grand Canyon? How far was your drive? Kiana: No, it's not my first time at the Grand Canyon. This is actually my third time. I visited the Grand Canyon for the first time when I was about 12.

Kiana: It was a brief family trip here. I think my dad was really interested in showing us the landscapes because we're from Arizona. I think it's kind of funny.

Kiana: We've never seen the Grand Canyon for almost 12 years. The second time I went with some friends. They were from Georgia.

Kiana: They really wanted to know what the Grand Canyon looked like. We came here. This is my third time.

Kiana: Some of my connections with the Grand Canyon, I absolutely love the landscapes and the environment. It really reminds me of being home and knowing that this is a part of my identity as a Diné woman. Growing up, my grandma always told me that the canyon landscapes are very, very sacred.

Kiana: They mean a lot to us as Diné people. I don't know if you guys know. There's kind of a mini version of the Grand Canyon on the reservation near Chinle, Arizona.

Kiana: It's called Canyon de Chelly. She [grandmother] used to share stories that our ancestors used to hide in the canyons from a lot of the colonizers that were causing genocide in our communities. That's kind of my personal connection with the Grand Canyon.

Kiana: I kind of like to channel that spirit every time I come here. Lakin: Thank you for sharing those connections. I think it's always nice to hear from every individual and also from every culture.

Lakin: There are a lot of differences and similarities between connections and just how we interpret those connections. People who come from the same culture as us and people who are also foreign to our culture. That's nice to hear.

Lakin: I think we'll just get into the next question. There may be some in the audience who may be unfamiliar with what Miss Navajo title is. Would you mind explaining a little bit about that? Kiana: For the Miss Navajo Nation pageant, it's a very prestigious and intense pageant that the Navajo Nation has.

Kiana: The Miss Navajo Nation role consists of being a public ambassador. You're basically in a government role serving as a spokesperson and advocate for your people. Whether that be for the youth, the elderly, or within your own generation.

Kiana: The Miss Navajo Nation pageant has been around for many, many years. I think it's beautiful that it's still alive to this day. One of the main things that Miss Navajo does as the reigning queen, she's able to travel to communities and educate her people.

Kiana: Empower, uplift, and encourage cultural teachings amongst her people. That's kind of what the Miss Navajo Nation title entails. For those of you that don't know.

Meranden: Awesome. I understand that this takes place in Window Rock? Kiana: The Miss Navajo Nation pageant is usually during the Navajo Nation Fair. It's probably one of the biggest fairs that goes on in the reservation.

Kiana: Many communities come and join to experience cultural practices like dances, singing, or even just being with family. I think that's really great that they have it during that time. Meranden: Just to let everyone know, where is Window Rock at? Kiana: Window Rock is a little bit up north of Arizona.

Kiana: It's the capital of the Navajo Reservation. It's going towards Albuquerque. If you're going towards Albuquerque on I-40, you'd likely pass the exit.

Kiana: It's really close to Gallup, New Mexico. Meranden: Awesome. You have to run for this position.

Meranden: It has various contestants. Would you be able to explain the different components of the pageant? How many people may run for this position? Kiana: The pageant is usually announced a couple months before the competition is held. Through that entire process, you're allowed to pick up an application.

Kiana: There are very specific requirements to run for the pageant, such as you can't be married. You can't have a spouse or a significant other. You can't be over the age of 25.

Kiana: You've got to speak your native language, obviously. You have to have a platform. Those are some of the main requirements to run for the title.

Kiana: However, it just depends on how many people are interested that year. Luckily, when I ran this year, when I made the decision to do so, there were six contestants. Six of us, that's kind of crazy.

Kiana: For the past few years, they only had about two or three girls run. It was a little sad to see from the outside that the interest of people wanting to run for this title decreased. But this year, it was kind of an awakening, it felt like.

Kiana: Along with what goes on during the pageant, it's a week-long entire pageant, starting with sheep butchering. Which is kind of interesting for the outside people that don't really understand our culture. They always question, like, you have to kill a sheep to become a queen? I think that's so funny.

Kiana: Butchering a sheep is actually a very cultural and sacred practice within the Navajo culture. We look at sheep as a way of life. They kind of structure our belief systems in family and always being a provider for not just our family, but our community.

Kiana: So we hold the sheep to a very high pedestal. To be able to perform that type of competition in front of many people, it's intense, but it's very beautiful. Lakin: I think that's special that you get to embrace your culture in a public setting.

Lakin: A lot of people might have that fear of being wrong or doing something wrong. But being able to confront that fear and get over that in a public setting while learning more about yourself culturally and personally is very powerful. I'm glad that you got to share that experience with us.

Lakin: That kind of gets us into the next question, which is, what inspired you to run for Miss Navajo? Kiana: The main thing that inspired me were kind of my own life's journey, as well as the mother figures within my family. They've always pushed me to try and go towards my goals and try new things. This year, when I decided to run for Miss Navajo, I kind of wanted to challenge myself.

Kiana: It was kind of a hard thing for me to decide because within my life, I'd like to be more empowered culturally and kind of integrate the modern teachings that I've learned, like being away in college, being away from the reservation, and kind of tie those two together to be the woman I am. My mother, she is a chief of police in Gallup, New Mexico. She was my biggest role model throughout my entire life.

Kiana: When I kind of opened up to her about running for this title, she was the biggest supporter. I would just say that the women in my family inspired me. Lakin: Yeah, I really like the fact that our family is the foundation of our support for us.

Lakin: It starts when we're small all the way to early adulthood and understanding how nurturing those connections and that kinship can really empower us and give us the spirit to empower our children and the community around us. Nurturing that relationship is very vital and important when it comes to our living experience as indigenous communities and families and people. Kiana: I think that's really important because a lot of the youth nowadays on the reservation, they kind of veer away from the culture.

Kiana: Nowadays, I think it's much easier to integrate culture and modern technology to learn better. I've actually tried to push a lot of the youth in my community to download Duolingo. You can actually learn Navajo on there and it's actually really good.

Kiana: Being able to have those resources is just unbelievable compared to what my ancestors have been through. Learning the stories about the long walk and even just the community of where I'm from, Fort Defiance, we still see how the land structures are. I think that needs to be emphasized more in our indigenous communities is learning about those landscapes and everything.

Kiana: I like how you mentioned that there. Lakin: You brought up the point of utilizing modern resources, modern technology and digital technology. What I see is a lot of older people have a negative reaction when it comes to that, but I feel like being able to adapt as a community and as people can really help us prepare for the next stage of evolution.

Lakin: We can do so by, like you said, utilizing those digital resources at this moment. Kiana: That's so important because a lot of the elders on the reservation don't believe in technology. They have a very stigmatized idea of technology.

Kiana: Although it is like colonizing our culture, we can find a lot of help within those resources. I think that is one problem and one challenge I ran into during the pageant was trying to get my community to get out of their comfort zone. I brought a lot of originality to the pageant and I was told this by many, many people.

Kiana: I even faced the backlash of the elders being a little critiquing by the way I speak my language, by the way I look, by the way I present myself. They tell me I'm not native enough or I'm not indulged in my culture enough. That was one of my biggest challenges was to try to fulfill that generational gap.

Kiana: Honestly, it actually inspired me and pushed me to do my very best in this entire pageant. I think I kind of caught a lot of people by surprise. I remember when the photos and the official announcements were being made, I got so much critiques on everything.

Kiana: People even questioned if I was even Navajo or even allowed to run. Just seeing that perspective was very unfortunate. My biggest goal for that entire thing was to re-inspire my people that an individual like me can come from such a small and rural community and still lead everyone on the Navajo Nation.

Kiana: I think that's one thing that I take away from this experience as a win. Lakin: I can speak for myself that you're doing a very great job at representing your people and embracing your culture and identity. I applaud you for that.

Lakin: Next question is how does the role of Miss Navajo empower your community or the Diné people? Kiana: I like to look at the role of Miss Navajo Nation as the bridge between the youth and the new generations with our elders. I know a lot of people just look at this role as a prestigious leadership role, a public ambassador, a public figure. Miss Navajo Nation is there to serve her people in a good way.

Kiana: For those of you that aren't familiar, when I ran for the pageant, my platform was to focus on healing through heritage. I really wanted to emphasize this because you can't really change a community by knowing what the problem is within. I know a lot of our people struggle with generational trauma that leads to mental health problems, domestic violence, alcoholism, and things of that nature.

Kiana: I really wanted to bring more awareness to that from our leaders. In doing so, it was very hard to get that across because the idea of Miss Navajo is just she is one role, she is this, and that's who she's going to be. I would have really liked to expand what the role of Miss Navajo Nation is, helping new generations to get to college or even working for internships because that's where it all starts.

Kiana: I was really pushing for the idea of entrepreneurship on the reservation because I truly believe that entrepreneurship is instilled within us as Navajo people. We lived off trade at one point, and we've always, always relied on our own resources. I think that mindset is essential to being a businesswoman, a businessman, and being indulged in the entrepreneurship world.

Meranden: That's awesome. We do have the cultural demonstration program here at Grand Canyon, which is done at Desert View. Currently, we have two artists, and they are able to demonstrate their craft, talk about their connections to the Grand Canyon.

Meranden: They have the supplies out of this is how it starts, this is how it gets to this step, and this is the finished product. They have that all out there, and it allows them to express themselves and let a lot of people, especially internationally here at the park, to see those kind of crafts. We have someone inside right now that's inside the visitor center.

Meranden: They're able to demonstrate their crafts and tell you the importance of certain things. That brings me to another thing of these are not just items. They have a long story behind them.

Meranden: There's so many reasons why we have certain jewelry, why there's this color, why we have this kind of stone, why this painting is a certain way. There's so much meaning behind all this, and it allows them to use that craft and show it out to the world and allows us to express ourselves. It's really good that you mentioned that as well.

Kiana: I actually love that because small businesses on the reservation don't get enough recognition. There's so many talented artists out there. I come from a long line of hunters and silversmiths.

Kiana: We try to practice that as my grandparents grow older. We're trying to carry on that tradition of being able to silversmith. Actually, some of the jewelry I'm wearing today, my grandpa made for me.

Kiana: A lot of the jewelry that I have is either borrowed or shared between family. It's actually ironic that we're silversmiths but don't own full sets of jewelry. It's kind of our way of life.

Kiana: My grandfather has always been his own businessman, and that's how he provided for our family. To know that as a first-generation college student, I was able to get that far with him just doing that. I think that's also what inspires my entire journey as a Diné woman.

Kiana: I think shedding light on the small businesses on the reservation needs to be talked about more, too. Meranden: That's awesome that you bring that up. When we had this podcast party, we asked the panelists that are up here, what do you want to see in the podcast, like the future episodes? One person mentioned small indigenous businesses.

Meranden: That's definitely something that we would really like to highlight more. I really like that you brought that up. Usually in this podcast, me and Lakin try to ask a fun question.

Meranden: Our fun question is, if you could have any traditional dish right now, what would it be? I would say mutton dumpling stew. I love dumpling stew. If you guys haven't had it, I really recommend you stop by Scott's Food Stand in Window Rock, Arizona.

Kiana: They have the best stew there. I remember growing up, I think it's a comfort food because my late grandma Rose, she would always make it every time we went there. Every time it was cold in the winter and we'd have the stew, it was just a full circle moment.

Kiana: Like, oh my gosh. I would have that for sure. Lakin: Yeah, that sounds good.

Lakin: Maybe you could make it for us next time you come. Kiana: Oh my gosh, yes, I have to. Lakin: A question from me.

Lakin: My personal interest is your attire and your dress. Can you explain a bit more about that? Because I really like the burgundy and the pink, the tulle and the embroidery. Kiana: Thank you.

Kiana: This outfit was actually gifted to me by Jumbo Creations. He's an indigenous designer, rather very luxury. So this kind of style of outfit is not so traditional, but it's very modern mixed with traditional.

Kiana: I know a lot of outfits nowadays have these little embellishments and they kind of just bring that luxury feeling to you. And then I'm wearing, obviously, my moccasins. These were also gifted to me during the pageant.

Kiana: As you all know, I butchered a sheep, so I kind of destroyed my old moccasins. They had, like, blood on them and everything, so they were kind enough to replace those. And most of my jewelry is actually, this was my grandpa's.

Kiana: My grandpa made this. My brother made my bracelet. So a lot of the jewelry and the things you see were gifted, and this is kind of how the Navajo people thrive on having heirlooms, because we don't have a family fund or, like I said, an heirloom.

Kiana: We kind of just collect our jewelry over time, and that's kind of our own little thing there. Lakin: Yeah, that was a cool fit check. Kiana: Thank you.

Lakin: But, yeah, like I was saying, I like the burgundy and the pink. Kiana: Yeah, it was actually funny, because during the pageant, I had to prepare multiple outfits, I would say 12 outfits, and I remember, like, towards the end, I was telling my mom, I really need, like, a brown or burgundy outfit, and during the pageant I was gifted this, and she's like, you got your brown outfit. So I think that was really nice, but, yeah, thank you so much.

Kiana: Oh, and I forgot to mention that this bracelet here, I actually made myself, and we made it as, we called it friendship bracelets during the Miss Navajo pageant, so all the contestants got to be able to learn how to silversmith, and so we kind of made matching bracelets, and it just has so much meaning to me. Lakin: Was it difficult learning how to solder? Kiana: It was. It was actually very scary, because you had to have a blowtorch in your hand, and then at the same time melting the metal, and I remember one of the contestants, she's so cute, she was probably one of the youngest, and every time the blowtorch came on, she would, like, scream, like, we would just hear her, ah, and we're like, are you okay? So I, it was an experience learning how to silversmith, and even though my family and my brothers, my uncles, all silversmith, it was really hard for me to learn, but I did it anyway.

Lakin: That's so cool. I hope you keep making jewelry, and I'm excited to see what else you create. Kiana: Yeah, and kind of branching off of that, I am personally a designer, so I make a lot of dresses at the moment, and I kind of just practice my craft, and I would really like to have my own business one day to create not only, like, traditional clothing, but kind of that luxury streetwear clothing for a lot of the youth on the reservation.

Kiana: We don't have a lot of fancy stores around on the reservation to get nice clothes, so I would kind of like to be that outlet for my people, too, in that way. Lakin: You know, I think we'll do a collaboration, because I do fashion design, too. Kiana: That's awesome.

Lakin: So we'll do a fashion show in the Grand Canyon someday. Kiana: Yeah. Lakin: So if y'all want to come to our fashion show, y'all can do that.

Kiana: Yes. Lakin: No, that's cool. I didn't know you made dresses.

Lakin: That's really nice, and like you said, providing the accessibility to these quality clothing, quality garments, like an egalitarian approach, I feel like it kind of calls back to our indigenous cultural system of values, how we perceive everyone as equal, pretty much. And being able to express that through clothing and art is vital when it comes to sustaining that connection. So yeah, thank you.

Kiana: Yeah, of course, and thank you for that input. I think one thing I would like to shed light on is designing within a Navajo culture has a lot of storytelling. It could be just a zigzag like this, and there's a story that could signify rainfall or thunder or a lot of the holy people that kind of lived with us at one time, how they offered back to us as Diné people.

Kiana: And I think that's where I found a lot of inspiration in learning how to design is learning the stories behind it. So thank you for mentioning that, too. Meranden: I think you kind of touched on this a little bit, but I really like to ask, my mom is like my inspiration for everything.

Meranden: She's done so much for us. And I was just curious, like I know you said your mom is your role model. Along with your mom, is there anyone else that you know who really inspired you like in life overall or someone that you really look up to? Kiana: Yeah, I would like to give this acknowledgement to my late auntie.

Kiana: Her name was Alana Tonalina, and she passed away when I was 11. And she actually was in the hospital for a very long time, and she lost her life to pneumonia. So through her journey, she had a disability and many liver transplants.

Kiana: She did a lot for her life up to where she lived. And because of her disability, she couldn't really go to college. She couldn't live on her own.

Kiana: She couldn't do a lot of things, so she kind of stayed on the reservation. And I remember when I was about 9 or 10, she told my family that she wanted to go to college. And this kind of scared my family because she needed help to kind of live.

Kiana: And when she went away to college, she enjoyed her one year there. And she really, really took on those challenges. And from that, seeing that at a young age, I always knew that I wanted to do a lot of these things that I do for her because she couldn't really get around as far as walking and running.

Kiana: So a lot of the things such as athletics and academics and like I said, entrepreneurship comes from that inspiration from my auntie. So yeah, she's the biggest inspiration in my life. And I like to think that I channel a lot of her energy.

Kiana: And a lot of people tell me that they feel her when I'm around. So I just love that idea. Meranden: Yeah, that's really nice to hear.

Kiana; Thank you. Meranden: And then like once again, it's just like the matriarchal side of us really matters and plays a huge part in how we grow up and what inspires us. And I'm glad that that's something that really touches you and that's important to you.

Kiana: Thank you for asking that. Meranden: Yeah, of course. I really like that because once again, my mom is my biggest inspo.

Meranden: And she's literally the reason why I went to college. She's the one, like if there's anything, my only requirement in life for all of you guys, and she said this to all my siblings, is that you go to college. I don't care what else you do.

Meranden: You've got to go to college. So like that kind of just stems something. And I'm just inspired by how much she pushes us and has done so much for us.

Meranden: Yeah. Lakin: So now that we're getting to kind of the end of this program, we'd like to know what does Native American Heritage Month mean to you and why is that important for our people? Kiana: Yeah, so Native American Heritage Month for me means being Diné and being resilient, always finding a way for yourself and paving the path no matter where you come from and how far you've come. Being Native American should be recognized every day because we're always on Native land.

Kiana: And I think that a month doesn't give us enough justice, but I think during November is the perfect time because we look at the winter as our new year, and that's when the big winds start to come and the snowfall starts to arrive. And I think that's a beautiful thing that we celebrate our heritage and our culture during this month because a lot of change and a lot of good things come within these winter months. And to be Diné is to be resilient and to be Navajo from a rural area means to always, always look at your family.

Kiana: I was always told that you don't need anything in this world but family, and I think that should be more emphasized and kind of that cultural connection should be made through family. Meranden: Yeah, I agree, and it's nice that you also mentioned that. Yes, we have this recognition for this month, but it's happening all the time.

Meranden: We have ceremonies in different months, so it's nice that we have this month, but it's also like every day is an indigenous day for us. And in terms of family, I agree on that. I'm a very big family person.

Meranden: I'm the oldest of four younger siblings, so I make sure I take care of them and my mom. It's hard right now because my two sisters are on the East Coast, so they're really far from me. So when we're all together for different ceremonies or holidays, it's really nice.

Meranden: So around this time, maybe a month from now, I'll be with everyone again. So that family part is really important to me, and they always come first, so I agree on that. Kiana: Yeah, and one thing that I would like to kind of acknowledge within the Navajo culture is that we're a very matriarchal culture.

Kiana: We like to hold our women figures and our mother figures at a high level, and that's kind of how we drive our culture, is based on the life of a woman. And because the women are life givers, naturally we always, always give thanks to first women. She's known as a sanaklehe, so that's how I try to live my life and try to remember who I am a descendant of.

Kiana: And I think that all Native youth should really, really learn about their culture and learn about those stories because you are them. Meranden: Yeah, exactly, and I think that's something that I'm really grateful for with being here at the Grand Canyon is that it's made me get closer to my culture and stuff like that. I love learning the different types of stories and the tribes, what they do.

Meranden: So the 11 tribes that we have here at the Grand Canyon, I've been able to learn different words, different ceremonies, what you're supposed to do at certain dances. So I really like that being here has helped me connect to not only my personal culture and tribe, it has brought me to other cultures, so I really enjoy that as well. But I did just want to ask, as we are winding down from this conversation and going to be passing it on to the audience if they have any questions, is there anything you would like to leave the audience with? Kiana: Yes, I would like to tell the audience to always be yourself and don't ever let anyone dictate what makes you happy.

Kiana: Don't ever fret away from your teachings. Always be humble and always strive for happiness because if you lose that path of who you are and knowing what makes you happy, you'll be lost and it'll be hard to come back. Always look at family for help and always, always, always pray.

Kiana: I found a lot of healing in prayer and a lot of self-identity just through talking to the higher being and really learn your culture. And don't be afraid to go against the grain. I think that's one thing that kind of changed my life during this era of running for Miss Navajo was going against the grain and staying who I am.

Kiana: And I think that's what drew a lot of people into knowing what my journey and what my life is like today. So, yeah, that's what I would like to leave the crowd with. Meranden: Yeah, so this is pretty much going to wrap up our Grand Canyon Speaks interview with Kiana today.

. Ranger Jonah: Grand Canyon Speaks is a program hosted by Grand Canyon National Park and the Grand Canyon Conservancy. A special thanks to Aaron White for the theme music.

Ranger Jonah: This recording reflects the personal, lived experiences of tribal members and do not encompass the views of their tribal nation or that of the national park. To learn more about Grand Canyon First Voices, visit www.nps.gov slash GRCA. Here at Grand Canyon National Park, we are on the ancestral homelands of the 11 associated tribes of the Grand Canyon.

Ranger Jonah: These being the Havasupai Tribe, the Hualapai Tribe, the Navajo Nation, the Hopi Tribe, the Pueblo Azuni, the Yavapai Apache Nation, the Kaibab Band of Paiute Indians, the Las Vegas Paiute Tribe, the Moapa Band of Paiutes, the Paiute Indian Tribe of Utah, and the San Juan Southern Paiute Tribe.

In celebration of Native American Heritage Month, we sat down with Kiana Omi Toadlena, a Dine influencer and public figure who was a contestant in the Miss Navajo pageant during 2024. She shares her experience, what inspires her to be a leader and representative of her people as well as what Native American Heritage Month means to her.

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